Do I Stay Or Do I Go?

[john doe]

It has been brought to my attention that my presence on this board and my requests that some sort of standards be kept, is not a too popular position here at LDStalk. Apparently, there are forces who want the board format to be more rough-and- tumble than what I enjoy in an LDS-based board. In light of these developments, I have decided to leave it up to you, the members of this board to decide whether I should stick to my guns and continue to ask others use less foul language and refrain from insulting others, or if I should just go somewhere else where the climate is more to my liking. If my presence here bothers you to the extent that you, the individual member wish me gone, I ask you to vote accordingly. On the other hand, if you think I contribute something positive to this board, feel free to express that with your vote. I'll give it a couple weeks, say the end of this month, and I will abide by the final vote count. If voted off the board, I promise I won't come back as someone else. If voted to stay, you already know what to expect. So don't miss out on this once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to decide someone's fate on the board. Except for the time we voted about Bat, and we all know how that ended. He's still trying to get back on, the poor misguided sap.

[Lindy]

Originally posted by john doe@May 19 2005, 12:09 AM

It has been brought to my attention that my presence on this board and my requests that some sort of standards be kept, is not a too popular position here at LDStalk. Apparently, there are forces who want the board format to be more rough-and- tumble than what I enjoy in an LDS-based board. In light of these developments, I have decided to leave it up to you, the members of this board to decide whether I should stick to my guns and continue to ask others use less foul language and refrain from insulting others, or if I should just go somewhere else where the climate is more to my liking. If my presence here bothers you to the extent that you, the individual member wish me gone, I ask you to vote accordingly. On the other hand, if you think I contribute something positive to this board, feel free to express that with your vote. I'll give it a couple weeks, say the end of this month, and I will abide by the final vote count. If voted off the board, I promise I won't come back as someone else. If voted to stay, you already know what to expect. So don't miss out on this once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to decide someone's fate on the board. Except for the time we voted about Bat, and we all know how that ended. He's still trying to get back on, the poor misguided sap.

JD~ I think you contribute a lot to this board, don't ever think I don't recognize that fact. I really struck a nerve with my defense of USN, but he's like my adopted son, so you see I have to protect my own. I say that you SHOULD

continue to ask others use less foul language and refrain from insulting others

because that's part of who you are.

I also stick up for Bat, maybe I'm a schmuck for finding the good in people, I don't know

But I love your posts John Doe,

You may just have to learn to PM me and let me have it!

I'm a big girl, I can take it

[Outshined]

Are you kidding? Stay.

[Setheus]

Since there is no option of "Stay, because super cool and attractive Setheus thinks you should" I have not cast a vote.

[begood2]

John doe,

Stay! :) Your contribution to this message board would be greatly missed!

[Jason]

The Board is already drying up into an internet ghost town. Leaving now will only speed up that process. You're call man.

[Traveler]

John D: I will leave you with a few thoughts.

1. I think you are making a big mistake by putting up for vote from others as a method of determining what is good and right for you. I do not think forum voting should have anything to do with a process of “choosing the right”.

2. Not all the sheep missing from the fold are “lost”. Some are hiding from both the fold and the Shepard.

3. People that say (or post) hurtful things are by definition not kind. Anyone can be kind to those they agree with – only a Christian can be kind to those that are not kind to others. (another way to determine if sheep not in the fold are lost from the Shepard or do not belong to the Shepard)

4. What you post will have more effect on you than it does on any of the forum readers. Jesus said that it is what comes out of a person’s mouth that defiles them (I believe posting is an extension of our mouths). If posting in this forum leaves you spiritually contrary to G-d’s spirit the question of continuing or leaving is a no brainier.

5. Consider taking some time off from the forum rather than leaving forever, performing instead some service – church or community or perhaps family. Take over a task you wife usually does.

6. Some people have determined not to treat others with kindness. It is like someone that is having a very bad time of things and is in a very bad mood and they do not want their mood changed. Some have not come to this forum with the intent of being kind and they will rejoice if they can share their misery. (I believe this is a sure indication of someone that is influenced by an unclean spirit)

7. In general intelligent post will not generate a lot of attention. Those smart enough to recognize an intelligent post often will agree in silence. But a stupid post will generate a great deal of attention. There are some posters because of their ego for attention and have learned and determined to post accordingly.

8. I have concluded that there are some posters that no matter how wrong or stupid their posts it is better to let it be. It is like wrestling with a pig in the mud. No matter what; the pigs enjoy the mud and I will regret getting even a little dirty.

The Traveler

[Guest lt]

John Doe,

your presence would be missed, I think you add allot to the board.

Lets look into making things better instead.

[USNationalist]

I voted you should go. But thats because i dont like you.

I think its great that your freaking out over me. Its funny that my opinion of you would give you the notion that the rest of the board here feels the same. Especialy since the reason i dont like you is because your fully embodie the worst of everything i dont like about each member of this board (minus lindy). Which would have seemed to me that the notion that you are liked here or the same as everyone else here might have crossed your mind. But instead when one person gives you some lip you go and scream about the falling sky, because all of a sudden everyone hates you. Or maybe you just did this as an ego booster, who knows.

But yeh- next time you want to gripe about "forces" and "others" just use my name. You and I both know thats who you ment.

[pushka]

John Doe, we haven't always agreed on issues on here, but I have never found you offensive...I feel that it is unfair that you would feel the need to leave because of the recent 'drama' on here with the other post...

I agree with you that certain 'standards' ought to be kept when posting...just plain courtesy I would think, like you said, there's no need to be foul mouthed on the board unless you are doing it deliberately to make a certain impression. Perhaps the best way to deal with those posts would be to just ignore them so that they don't generate the extra bad feelings on here.

I'm not particularly keen on banning anybody, even the foul mouthed ones, because I believe in the freedom of expressing your opinions, and hopefully one day the people who seek attention by being foul mouthed and insulting just for the sake of it will find something they seriously want to discuss around here, and will be disappointed if nobody bothers to post replies to them unless they alter their way of posting just a touch...

I would like to see Bat back on here, however!

[StrawberryFields]

I think that you should STAY because you are SUPER COOL and REALLY HOT!

[Snow]

Lighten up John.

We appreciate you.

PS. Boyd Peterson spoke to our study group last week. He brought Dr. Nibley's WW II dog tags with him.

[begood2]

John doe,

You have a right to object to the use of profanity.The rules that we all agreed to, when we signed up as members states:

"Any post which contains profanity, obscenities, or anything which would be found offensive to the majority of those who are LDS members will result in the post being removed, and the poster being banned from the site. There is a zero tolerance policy in place for those who choose to break those guidelines."

If I were to break the rules, and it was pointed out to me, I would apologize.

It really doesn't do a poster much good using profanity anyway, because very few people will see it before it gets edited. Why risk getting banned for so little a result?

If you feel that you must use profanity to get your message across, then you could edit it before you post.

Example:

The white cat went up the steep hill!

The####cat went up the####hill!

If the reader knows the poster, then he will still have a good idea what the edit means.

[Que Sera]

As your self-appointed VT from Notes, heck if I know: you never answer the door when I knock, so I've assumed you're charting your own path.

Personally speaking, I leave you with this question: did your children drive the mini-van to and from Disneyland or were you at the wheel?

Just a thought, boss.

Knock, knock...

[Traveler]

John D: I thought to send you a personal note. I believe it is rare to find a kind person in this world, even among those that should be kind (meaning children whose spirits are of G-d). I believe that unclean spirits influence and teach unkindness. Sometimes even humor is greatly influenced by an unclean spirit of degrading rudeness.

It seems to me that the forces of unclean influences are well organized, in that a spirit of unkind rudeness in an unprincipled person opens the door of temptation to a person that in the past has successfully staved off an unclean spirit of discouragement.

There is a great war raging over the hearts of men that began in heaven and it is far from being over. There are some battles that are not worth the fight because there is too much at stake on many fronts. But there are other battles that must be fought and won, so the lesser battles are magnified as a distraction and a diversion by the Adversary. I say this because I believe that for the most part the battles on the forums of the internet favor those influenced by unclean spirits that teach to despise and ridicule things that are virtuous, lovely and of great value to seekers of good things or in other words truth.

Because kindness and spiritual wisdom is so rare I have pondered the value of demonstrating such on the internet. I believe my conclusions are much the same as yours are. I see little or no value of communicating truth over the internet where ridicule has such advantage. Those attempting to supply spiritual wisdom in light of the lies being touted as “new wisdom” soon learn that the playing field is not level. Teaching G-dly virtue, chastity and compassion has proven to be of little consequence. Those that love virtue still love virtue and those that hate virtue and chastity in society hate it the more.

With all this in mind – thank you for your efforts in keeping the “lower lights” as the storms of our generation rage and the wicked find delight in the suffering caused by their evil ways.

The Traveler

[StrawberryFields]

Originally posted by Traveler@May 20 2005, 07:39 AM

John D: I thought to send you a personal note. I believe it is rare to find a kind person in this world, even among those that should be kind (meaning children whose spirits are of G-d). I believe that unclean spirits influence and teach unkindness. Sometimes even humor is greatly influenced by an unclean spirit of degrading rudeness.

It seems to me that the forces of unclean influences are well organized, in that a spirit of unkind rudeness in an unprincipled person opens the door of temptation to a person that in the past has successfully staved off an unclean spirit of discouragement.

There is a great war raging over the hearts of men that began in heaven and it is far from being over. There are some battles that are not worth the fight because there is too much at stake on many fronts. But there are other battles that must be fought and won, so the lesser battles are magnified as a distraction and a diversion by the Adversary. I say this because I believe that for the most part the battles on the forums of the internet favor those influenced by unclean spirits that teach to despise and ridicule things that are virtuous, lovely and of great value to seekers of good things or in other words truth.

Because kindness and spiritual wisdom is so rare I have pondered the value of demonstrating such on the internet. I believe my conclusions are much the same as yours are. I see little or no value of communicating truth over the internet where ridicule has such advantage. Those attempting to supply spiritual wisdom in light of the lies being touted as ÅÏew wisdom¡¦soon learn that the playing field is not level. Teaching G-dly virtue, chastity and compassion has proven to be of little consequence. Those that love virtue still love virtue and those that hate virtue and chastity in society hate it the more.

With all this in mind ¡¦thank you for your efforts in keeping the ÅÍower lights¡¦as the storms of our generation rage and the wicked find delight in the suffering caused by their evil ways.

The Traveler

Traveler,

You said "Teaching G-dly virtue, chastity and compassion has proven to be of little consequence. Those that love virtue still love virtue and those that hate virtue and chastity in society hate it the more."

I believe that there are many who read but rarely post. Are you saying that boards like this one are not of value?

I don't know the situation of what occurred with John Doe but it was most likely only one person who had a "problem" with him. Someone being rude does not change that which is good. I believe that when rules are set that they should be upheld or consequences follow. There are some who would like nothing more then to destroy what we have her simply because they can. Those who attempt such a thing should be ignored and not responded to. If we are to try and fight against such a spirit of discontentment over the internet it only fuels their unrighteous fire.

Ignore, Ignore, Ignore...

[Guest lt]

I think we can treat others and respond kindly ...like we would want them to....

[Guest Taoist_Saint]

Stay...if I can do it, anyone can.

[huma17]

Originally posted by USNationalist@May 19 2005, 02:32 PM

I think its great that your freaking out over me.

I didn't get the sense that he was 'freaking out' over you, but rather felt that he might not be getting the support he wants in keeping this board clean. He seems to be asking if members of this board want him to continue trying to prevent vulgarity and the like - which I think he should.

[begood2]

huma17,

Good point. :)

[Setheus]

Heavenly Homemaker, is your Avatar constipated?

[john doe]

Okay, here's the deal. Those of you who were here at the time and were paying attention know that on another thread, I made an observation about another's rude and insulting style of posting, noting that this poster would receive a more positive response to his postings if he were to attempt to be less abrasive and insulting of fellow members of this board. He had, in the recent past, started a thread suggesting that some here should consider suicide because he didn't much care for their personalities. Immediately after that this poster turned his hate and insults on me, claiming that it was people like me who prefer a higher standard of posting style without made him go berserk with his rudeness and insulting manner. I attempted to reason with this person, but he apparently was uninterested in a conversation, just more flames. So I terminated my participation in the thread in question.

Now here's what rubbed me the wrong way. During this whole episode in which I made a pretty benign comment on the way this person treated others here, not one of the other members of this board, which proclaims to espouse basic LDS standards of decency and respect for others, even bothered to stop and stand up for those standards. Not one. In fact, the only person who jumped in , jumped on me for asking this person to treat others decently. This other person basically said I should tolerate people who come here and behave like jerks, because we should be doormats. That we should overlook the insults of others because they are really really smart people. But not one person stood up in that thread and said "maybe JD has a point, maybe we should encourage others to treat people with respect here". The silence was deafening in that regard.

Now, in this thread, some have come out and said that perhaps I was right in my actions and requests. My question is, where were you then? If you like to be treated with respect and decency, why doesn't anyone here stand up for it? Am I the only one who cares? Or did this person perhaps hit a nerve when he basically called you doormats who deserve to be degraded? Did the suicide thing hit a little close to home? I have a problem with the idea that many of the (mostly) women here are codependent to the point that they think they should put up with the kind of things this guy said to and about you. But maybe he has a valid point hidden there in his disgust of some here.

My poll was an attempt to try to gauge the basic feeling around here on whether I should associate myself with people who may not care or think they deserve to be treated like dirt. Because I have enough respect for myelf that I believe that I don't need to be a member of an LDS discussion board whose members don't feel they should demand to be treated with decency, even if you don't agree with me or my beliefs. If this place isn't the right place for me, I need to know, so I can move on to a board where I am more comfortable. It was a mandate on me.

So, does anyone want to change their vote, or is the current vote (11-2 to stay) still a valid one?

[Outshined]

The voters have spoken, so hang out a while.

As for me, I'd stay just to spite a vote for me to leave.

[StrawberryFields]

Dear John,

I tried to locate the post in question but the one I thought it was is one where you didn't post at all. The post I looked at was very rude but I believe this particular poster to have some mental difficulties so I went easy on him. B)

John, I am not sure what you are looking for but it feels like you are leaving us with an ultimatum. It seems that this rude poster might have hurt you and that you feel that if we don't choose your side that he has won? A winner is a winner no matter what is flung at you. John for what it is worth you are a winner in my book.

Not to bad for a codependent doormat eh?

To be honest, I have a life outside of this message board. What some rude poster decides to say does not affect the outcome of my life. Sorry I guess I was out of touch when the post in question happened.

[Lindy]

In fact, the only person who jumped in , jumped on me for asking this person to treat others decently. This other person basically said I should tolerate people who come here and behave like jerks, because we should be doormats. That we should overlook the insults of others because they are really really smart people.

John~

I loved being referred to in the 3rd person......made me feel kinda special

Maybe you didn't underdstand the ties I have to some (infrequent) posters....or that I have, do, and will continue to stand up for family, friends, and issues that I believe in.

In real life I know that there are people who have had their hearts and lives touched by others who overlook the downfalls and offer the hand of friendship because of the type of person they see inside.

I don't think that Christ gave up on those who made Him feel like a doormat, He was/is a very tolerant person because of how He saw/sees us as individuals.

SF~ You know me and my wacky perspective on people... and as one codependent doormat to another.....you know I can't keep my mouth shut

Oh BTW.....I can act like a responsible adult and give reprimands and a good chewing out OFF the board as much as I can defend on the board.

John D~ I happen to love your posts, I have told you that before....I will wear a sign today that says "I love and appreciate John Doe" if it helps anything..... I dont' want you to even think about leaving, I will have to hunt you down and humiliate myself to bring you back.......spare me that humiliation please?