Secret Society

[Snow]

Snow:

Do you believe the part in the Book of Mormon about there being secret combinations in these last days?

Not really relevant as we are discussing YOUR views, but yes. However - I am wondering about specifics.

Which secret combinations are you referring to and what have they been up to?

[bytor2112]

Not really relevant as we are discussing YOUR views, but yes. However - I am wondering about specifics.

Which secret combinations are you referring to and what have they been up to?

Seriously Snow....where have you been? Been to Wendy's lately for a juicy hamburger??? Once upon a time......lots of juice, had to use several napkins. Now, maybe one napkin. A secret combination......I think so.

[Snow]

"Hitler, of course, was a Bohemian."

That would be interesting. So as to take this out of the realm of fruitcake nuttery, a couple things are in order:

1. Can you provide a respected scholarly work demonstrating Dolf baby's membership and participation in the Bohemian Grove - something in a respected academic journal or similar publication... no junk lunatic websites please.

2. Please specify, with appropriate evidence, what conspiracies Hitler participated in through the BG - same academic or scholarly standards as above apply.

Hitler would not have gotten very far if it were not for the other bohemian cronies who financially supported his endeavors. cronies such as Paul Warburg.

Do you know who Paul Warburg is? You should, because of him you pay thousands of dollars each year to the private bank known as the "Federal Reserve". (PS - the Federal Reserve is not "Federal" - it is a privately owned company like Wells Fargo.)

LOL - from their own site:

FRB: FAQs: Federal Reserve Banks

They are not elected officials, they are not part of our gov - they are private citizens who work for a private bank (like wells fargo)... A high US debt makes some of our fellow private citizens rich.... think about that.

The Fed reserve is a private company owned by citizens of the US who are NOT elected officials, but rather chosen by fellow Bohemians. Don't you find that a little frightening, those in control of US debt/money are private non-elected people?

NOTE: Let the Reader Beware: Your "quote" is NOT from the Federal Reserve Banks FAQs. You fraudulently exerted phrases from the FAQs and then dishonestly altered them.

That is a tactic of the fruitcake conspiracy nuts. Please keep your posts honest and truthful in the future.

see proven conspiracies:

Holy smokes Batman - it is a proven conspiracy (according to something you found on the internet) that the FRA was CLAIMED to be written by Paul Warburg. Lions and Tigers and Bears, oh my!

This is the type of stuff that is planned/organized... people pay big bucks to be a member of secret organizations like the Bohemians / skull -n - bones - and they make big bucks - trillions of bucks - off of the alliances they form there. Or they win presidencies, or they win wars - I guess it depends on what you are after, why you join.

Who, specifically has made "trillions of bucks," how, when, where is the money?

Same standards of credible evidence apply.

look at this list of people:

Membership of Yale's Skull and Bones Society

These people did not come into power on their own.

Oh my gosh - you have linked to a list of names. Say it out loud - that is the kind of proof of... well... of nothing, now isn't it.

[Snow]

Seriously Snow....where have you been? Been to Wendy's lately for a juicy hamburger??? Once upon a time......lots of juice, had to use several napkins. Now, maybe one napkin. A secret combination......I think so.

It's not a laughing matter bytor.

Right now the Illuminati is taking the proceeds of those napkin savings, laundering the proceeds through a Microsoft Zune front company and investing them in a massive rightwing conspiracy to dominate world politics through a proprietary wmv format.

[Maxel]

Not really relevant as we are discussing YOUR views, but yes. However - I am wondering about specifics.

Which secret combinations are you referring to and what have they been up to?

I don't know specifics. They wouldn't be secret if we knew about them, would they?

However, if you want specifics: ACORN, STORM, Al Qaeda, the Taliban... There's more.

ACORN isn't so secret, but it's connected to plenty of other organizations and is involved in plenty of underhanded dealings.

I mentioned the Book of Mormon because it specifically says secret combinations will be among the Gentiles in the latter days. That's all the evidence I need to believe that secret combinations exist in our society.

[Snow]

I mentioned the Book of Mormon because it specifically says secret combinations will be among the Gentiles in the latter days. That's all the evidence I need to believe that secret combinations exist in our society.

It one thing to say that secret combos exist - for heaven's sake, La Cosa Nostra nd the Yakuza are secret combinations - something disputed by no one, it's quite another thing to believe... pick your looney tune conspiracy of the week promulgated by the likes of monkey boy Alex Jones or rooty tooty Charles L. Woods - author of Mormon Conspiracy outlining LDS plans to rule the world.

[Gatorman]

*shakes head

'nuff said...What a lark...LOL

[Gatorman]

Funny thing, conspiracy theories...

In history, there was this crazy theory. People thought that those who believed it were loony, foolish, or just out there. This theory lingered for years and years, decades. It was just too unbelievable. People called those who believed in it conspirators with the devil or worse. There was no proof of this claim. There was no evidence or academic journal that would support this claim. Crazy thing, everyone KNEW that the Earth was the center of the universe.

Course, today, we know differently. Funny thing, even without proof, those nuts were right. Even though the evidence did not exist, those demanding it were still wrong. Funny thing about conspiracy theories. Like scientific theories, and the often actually can be the same, they are simple lunacy until someone finally figures out how to prove them.

[Snow]

Funny thing, conspiracy theories...

In history, there was this crazy theory. People thought that those who believed it were loony, foolish, or just out there. This theory lingered for years and years, decades. It was just too unbelievable. People called those who believed in it conspirators with the devil or worse. There was no proof of this claim. There was no evidence or academic journal that would support this claim. Crazy thing, everyone KNEW that the Earth was the center of the universe.

Course, today, we know differently. Funny thing, even without proof, those nuts were right. Even though the evidence did not exist, those demanding it were still wrong. Funny thing about conspiracy theories. Like scientific theories, and the often actually can be the same, they are simple lunacy until someone finally figures out how to prove them.

Interesting - arguing that because people believed in geocentrism, that George Bush and John Kerry are conspiring to rob and rule the world or that B. Obama is actually a space alien from the planet Thargor sent to impose nationalized healthcare or whatever Bigfoot yarn is the myth de jour.

It's what is referred to a red herring fallacy and a non-sequitar and simply kinda silly.

Of course - there is a little problem with your little theory (actually the entire theory is huge problem - but lets start with one) - it is false. That is - not honest. Not everyone, as you claim, knew that the earth was the center of the universe - it was merely one theory, among others.

Pythagoreans thought that the Earth to be one of several planets going around a central fire.

Heraclides Ponticus is believed to placed Mercury and Venus circling the sun, not the earth.

The Maragha Revolution school was not geocentric, and so on and so on.

Edited September 11, 2009 by Snow

[Snow]

Oh and while we are speaking about nutty conspiracy theories, here's a couple of nutbars websites that believe that the earth is the center of the universe.

Why?

Because the Bible says so:

The Geocentric Bible

Geocentricity

[Kawazu]

"Hitler, of course, was a Bohemian."

Hitler would not have gotten very far if it were not for the other bohemian cronies who financially supported his endeavors. cronies such as Paul Warburg.

Do you know who Paul Warburg is? You should, because of him you pay thousands of dollars each year to the private bank known as the "Federal Reserve". (PS - the Federal Reserve is not "Federal" - it is a privately owned company like Wells Fargo.)

LOL - from their own site:

FRB: FAQs: Federal Reserve Banks

They are not elected officials, they are not part of our gov - they are private citizens who work for a private bank (like wells fargo)... A high US debt makes some of our fellow private citizens rich.... think about that.

The Fed reserve is a private company owned by citizens of the US who are NOT elected officials, but rather chosen by fellow Bohemians. Don't you find that a little frightening, those in control of US debt/money are private non-elected people?

see proven conspiracies:

This is the type of stuff that is planned/organized... people pay big bucks to be a member of secret organizations like the Bohemians / skull -n - bones - and they make big bucks - trillions of bucks - off of the alliances they form there. Or they win presidencies, or they win wars - I guess it depends on what you are after, why you join.

look at this list of people:

Membership of Yale's Skull and Bones Society

These people did not come into power on their own.

Howdy,

The Federal Reserve System is an important issue. I just think that there are many solid grounds on which to oppose Federal Reserve policy without wandering into conspiracy territory. (It is just my personal opinion, though.)

Be well.

Sincerely,

Kawazu

[FunkyTown]

Funny thing, conspiracy theories...

In history, there was this crazy theory. People thought that those who believed it were loony, foolish, or just out there. This theory lingered for years and years, decades. It was just too unbelievable. People called those who believed in it conspirators with the devil or worse. There was no proof of this claim. There was no evidence or academic journal that would support this claim. Crazy thing, everyone KNEW that the Earth was the center of the universe.

Course, today, we know differently. Funny thing, even without proof, those nuts were right. Even though the evidence did not exist, those demanding it were still wrong. Funny thing about conspiracy theories. Like scientific theories, and the often actually can be the same, they are simple lunacy until someone finally figures out how to prove them.

Too true, Gatorman.

There have been conspiracies to cover the truth in the past: The Medici family's influence in the church, the Borgia popes.

Of course, there have also been people claiming conspiracies that haven't existed: Aliens kidnapping people from Podunk, Idaho or the idea of a vast Zionist conspiracy that controls the world.

The truth is: If all the conspiracies existed that people say exist, then the world is controlled by:

The Skull and Bones, the Illuminati, the Zionists, the Mormons, the Aliens, the US government, the Knights Templar, the New World Order, the Masons, the Vatican, the Mafia, the Communists, Hitler's Brain and Satan.

I think we can agree that if one group controls the world, the other groups do not. That means that the people who believe in those conspiracy groups are wrong.

Me, I'm voting it's the Hitler's Brain one. All the rest of you are crazy for believing anything else.

[Gatorman]

Interesting that you would take that argument and miss the point of the post. The point of the post is that the idea of the earth not being the center of the universe was considered a crazy, conspiratal idea. There was no proof that was acceptable to many people. IE: It is exactly like the ideas you are shooing away with your insistent on evidence that fits your criteria and definition. Well, tough. Your argument is just as flawed as you claim others are, because, you are requiring that which is not required. Some of the conspiracies are likely bunk. Some are likely based on fact. Some are likely darn near the truth. But, you can no more prove which are which, in general, than the conspiracy 'nuts' can prove which are. But, NONE of these points change the fact that just because someone calls a theory a conspiracy, crazy, the supporters nuts, or whatever, changes the possibility that they are true. Otherwise, the earth would be flat and the center of the universe and I believe your acceptable evidence proves that conspiracy to have been true.

So, we are simply on different sides of this discussion and I will attempt to follow the example of Christ. I will not resort to calling you crazy, nuts, stupid, foolish, or even suggesting such. I will simply walk away.

Interesting - arguing that because people believed in geocentrism, that George Bush and John Kerry are conspiring to rob and rule the world or that B. Obama is actually a space alien from the planet Thargor sent to impose nationalized healthcare or whatever Bigfoot yarn is the myth de jour.

It's what is referred to a red herring fallacy and a non-sequitar and simply kinda silly.

Of course - there is a little problem with your little theory (actually the entire theory is huge problem - but lets start with one) - it is false. That is - not honest. Not everyone, as you claim, knew that the earth was the center of the universe - it was merely one theory, among others.

Pythagoreans thought that the Earth to be one of several planets going around a central fire.

Heraclides Ponticus is believed to placed Mercury and Venus circling the sun, not the earth.

The Maragha Revolution school was not geocentric, and so on and so on.

[Gatorman]

Ahhh...But you missed a point. They all serve Satan. So, in the end, you only have different branches of the same plan.

Too true, Gatorman.

There have been conspiracies to cover the truth in the past: The Medici family's influence in the church, the Borgia popes.

Of course, there have also been people claiming conspiracies that haven't existed: Aliens kidnapping people from Podunk, Idaho or the idea of a vast Zionist conspiracy that controls the world.

The truth is: If all the conspiracies existed that people say exist, then the world is controlled by:

The Skull and Bones, the Illuminati, the Zionists, the Mormons, the Aliens, the US government, the Knights Templar, the New World Order, the Masons, the Vatican, the Mafia, the Communists, Hitler's Brain and Satan.

I think we can agree that if one group controls the world, the other groups do not. That means that the people who believe in those conspiracy groups are wrong.

Me, I'm voting it's the Hitler's Brain one. All the rest of you are crazy for believing anything else.

[Snow]

Interesting that you would take that argument and miss the point of the post.

No - I got the point and that was that you think "everyone" believed in egocentricity and that any theories to the contrary were conspiracies.

Frankly, I've never heard that and don't believe you have either.... or do you have some evidence that non-geocentricity was viewed as a conspiracy?

Doubt it.

So, we are simply on different sides of this discussion and I will attempt to follow the example of Christ. I will not resort to calling you crazy, nuts, stupid, foolish, or even suggesting such. I will simply walk away.

Ah - but you are not above calling others non-Christ like while holding yourself out as a model of Christ-like behavior.

What's the word for when people do that?

[MrsAri]

I like this quote by President David O. McKay:

Today two mighty forces are battling for the supremacy of the world. The destiny of mankind is in the balance. It is a question of God and liberty, or atheism and slavery . . .

Those forces are known and have been designated by different terms throughout the ages. "In the beginning" they were known as Satan on the one hand, and Christ on the other.

In Joshua's time they were called "gods of the Amorites," on one, and "the Lord" on the other. . . . In these days, they are called "domination by the state," on one hand, "personal liberty," on the other hand; communism on one, free agency on the other. (P.P.N.S., pp. 215-216)

[Snow]

I like this quote by President David O. McKay:

That's nice.

I like this quote by Milton Berle:

"I feel like Zsa Zsa Gabor's sixth husband. I know what I'm supposed to do, but I don't know how to make it interesting."

[lilered]

While I am unsure as to what to think about the various posts on this thread, I do believe that to deny that evil exists in the world or deny that Satan conspires to captures souls is a mistake. I also believe that there exists today secret organizations just as they have since Christs time.

The fact that we call refer to them as Secret Combinations or Organization, would indicate that we don.t have a lot of knowledge about them. A great example of this was the Costa Nostra, The Mafie, etc. we heard rumors for years befoe we actually were provided proof that they even existed and that only happened because of on-going investigations and/or former members willing to talk about their purpose and actvities.

Edited September 13, 2009 by lilered

[Moksha]

Been to Wendy's lately for a juicy hamburger??? Once upon a time......lots of juice, had to use several napkins. Now, maybe one napkin. A secret combination......I think so.

Don't forget about McDonald's Secret Sauce. That cabal of New World Orderists want desperately to get their hands on this and sell it to the International Bankers Syndicate, who will in turn try to pollute our bodily essences with this sauce diabolique.

[Moksha]

Don't forget about McDonald's Secret Sauce. That cabal of New World Orderists want desperately to get their hands on this and sell it to the International Bankers Syndicate, who will in turn try to pollute our bodily essences with this sauce diabolique.

You want further proof? Okay, consider this: How many times have you seen pictures of President David O. McKay, standing in front of a KFC and wearing a goatee and black glasses as a disguise?