J. Smith Papers II - Revelations and Translations

[ehkape]

Anybody out there who has got this book?

Any comments or thoughts on it?

(other than it's a really big and heavy one )

[NeuroTypical]

I don't have it, but wish I did. My wistful thoughs are all in my sig line.

[pam]

I would love to read it...but at $100 it's a bit out of my price range at the moment.

[HiJolly]

Anybody out there who has got this book?

Any comments or thoughts on it?

(other than it's a really big and heavy one )

I have it. I've glanced through it but have not seriously tackled it yet.

It is well done and of apparent excellent quality. Images of written text are clear and annotated as far as writer, dates, etc. I like it a lot.

HiJolly

[rameumptom]

Sigh. One of the things Santa didn't bring me for Christmas. Just as well, my reading list is so long right now that I'll have to live to the age of Methuselah just to finish the books now out I'd like to read....

[deseretgov]

I'd love to have that book. Maybe we should make that book the new Doctrine and Covenants.

[ehkape]

I'd love to have that book. Maybe we should make that book the new Doctrine and Covenants.

Well, it used to be the "old" D&C, or at least the manuscript of the then called book of commandments.

I got it as a christmas gift and and started looking into it. Very well done edition.

To those of you who have the book: I was reading (todays) section 20, (p.75), the Articles and Covenants of the church. It describes the rise of the church, Josephs visitation by an unidentified angel (not the first vision I guess, rather Moroni appearing), the translation of the Book of Mormon etc.

That is followed by a "statement of faith", i.e. we believe in God and Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost, one has to be baptized etc.

Now the different priesthood offices are explained: Elders, Priests, Teachers, Deacons and different duties of the members.

Not a single word distinguishing between the "aaronic" or "melchisedek" priesthood...

Not a single word concerning High Priests, bishops, high councilors etc...

Our modern D&C adds the following verses, which are completely missing in the original text:

66 But the presiding elders, traveling bishops, high councilors, high priests, and elders, may have the privilege of ordaining, where there is no branch of the church that a vote may be called.

67 Every president of the high priesthood (or presiding elder), abishop, high councilor, and bhigh priest, is to be ordained by the direction of a chigh council or general conference.

I was thinking about this for some time. Is there a chance, that the church was organized without the Melchisidek Priesthood? We don't have an exact date for the restoration by Peter James and John.

Could it possibly have been after 1830?

[deseretgov]

I don't know but the revelations in our current Doctrine and Covenants have been changed(in some cases quite a lot) from the more original versions in the Book of Commandments. I think some of these changes were done by Joseph Smith but many were done by the church at a later date.

[Hemidakota]

There are many revelations [26 and counting] withheld from the Doctrine and Covenants found in the church archives, perhaps, for a wiser purpose but most of it due to the immaturity of the membership at the time received; noting Joseph comments in his journal.

A comment that Joseph Smith made in his days concerning his inability in writing, he wished he had that ability to write versus allowing others to do this simply act. But, I suspect this was weakness given to Joseph by the Lord in allowing others to help him and keeping him humble in his days.

[pam]

Was it a weakness from the Lord or just the fact he only had a 3rd grade education? Which is what makes the translation of the Book of Mormon so amazing.

[Hemidakota]

2nd grade but his learning curve was stupendous. He never seemed to overcome this issue well into his forties. However, looking at President Young own education, he had far less than Joseph and note the difference of the two men. Of all learning Joseph applied in his life, this was a scourge for him.

Looking at the past dispensational prophets, Moses, Enoch, and Joseph had common weakness.

[pam]

Hemi..I'm pretty sure it was a 3rd grade (not that it matters) but I wonder how he could possibly even attempt this well into his forties when he was only 39 when he was killed.

[Hemidakota]

Hemi..I'm pretty sure it was a 3rd grade (not that it matters) but I wonder how he could possibly even attempt this well into his forties when he was only 39 when he was killed.

Thanks for the correction Pam. I was thinking about the 1840 vice his age.

Some added background on the Smiths, partially about Joseph’s own education circumstances research and written by Apostle Mark E. Peterson:

THE UNLEARNED MAN

By the time Joseph Smith closed his career in martyrdom, he was brilliant and he was learned. He had been taught by heavenly angels and by the Holy Spirit as well.

When the Saints settled in Kirtland, Ohio, one of their first efforts was to provide for education, and a school of the prophets was begun. Later, when they established the city of Nauvoo, Illinois, they organized the University of Nauvoo. The Prophet Joseph was a firm supporter of education and took every opportunity to study ancient languages and other subjects.

But when, as a youth, he was selected as the one through whom the Lord would usher into the world "a marvelous work and a wonder," he most certainly was unschooled and unlearned. Isaiah could not have described him more accurately.

To suppose that he had the capacity to write the Book of Mormon, or any book for that matter, was simply beyond reason, especially when it is remembered what archaeologists subsequently found in Book of Mormon lands, and when we discover that the book is filled with Hebrew idioms of which the young farm boy had not the slightest inkling. His formal classroom education would not exceed even the sixth grade as we know it.

The translation was nothing short of a miracle, and of course that is what the Lord called it. He did that work by the gift and power of God, and not of any man or set of men. (See D&C 3:11-14; 5:4; 6:25; 10:1)

Joseph Smith was raised in a poor family, all members of which were obliged to work to bring home the required daily sustenance. Not only did he work on his father's farm, but he also hired out as a laborer to his neighbors.

The schools that were available at that time were usually of the one-room variety, and even these Joseph was not able to attend regularly.

During most of his childhood he lived in areas that were, in fact, frontier regions of the struggling young United States of America, where schools were scarce and far between. Few of the young people in those areas at that time attended school with any degree of regularity. Their conditions were not too different from those of Abraham Lincoln.

It was to such a young man that the Lord entrusted the publication of this ancient record that was destined to come out of the ground and out of the dust, baffling even the wise and prudent men of the world.

People who knew the Prophet Joseph Smith in his childhood confirmed that he was not privileged to have much schooling, and his own family, of course, knew very well his childhood educational limitations, for his brothers and sisters suffered the same handicap.