What should I do?

[slamjet]

No offense but I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce.

Oh my word, are you kidding? So you'll dismiss the advice of someone who has been there, done that and learned from it.

So I guess that means because I'm divorced, excommunicated, etc, you will dismiss my advice also.

You know not the Gospel. Not one single bit. You judge without any thought. You take a persons wrong and throw it back in their face and tell them their words are meaningless. EVEN THOUGH they have such invaluable experience learned from mistakes, repentance, and living again.

You wear your tragedies as a metal demanding respect. It only shows your lack of moving forward.

You are a judgmental little snot that needs a spanking.

I'm done here. Your unappreciative, derogatory, haughty attitude will definitely come to fruition. And it's going to be ugly.

[jayanna]

whoa, you expected a 16 year old girl to date you exclusively. That just sounds so unbelievably selfish to me, especially when you are asking about another girl while dating the 16 year old 'exclusively'. This was in fact before the 16 year old girl admitted she 'cheated' on you by dating someone else, which is what she is supposed to do according to the for Strength of Youth manual:

In cultures where dating or courtship is acceptable, dating can help you develop lasting friendships and eventually find an eternal companion. Date only those who have high standards and in whose company you can maintain your standards. A young man and a young woman on a date are responsible to help each other maintain their standards and to protect each other’s honor and virtue. You must honor the sanctity of the priesthood and of womanhood.

Do not date until you are at least 16 years old. Dating before then can lead to immorality, limit the number of other young people you meet, and deprive you of experiences that will help you choose an eternal partner.

Not all teenagers need to date or even want to. Many young people do not date during their teen years because they are not yet interested, do not have opportunities, or simply want to delay forming serious relationships. However, good friendships can and should be developed at every age.

When you begin dating, go in groups or on double dates. Avoid going on frequent dates with the same person. Make sure your parents meet those you date. You may want to invite your dates to activities with your family. Plan dating activities that are positive and inexpensive and that will help you get to know each other. Do things that will help you and your companions maintain your self-respect and remain close to the Spirit of the Lord.

For the Strength of Youth: Fulfilling Our Duty to God Dating

As you check out the actual manual, you will see that I included the entire page. This book is written to prepare youth for future temple worthiness. She probably didn't know any better, saying that you two should be 'exclusive', but you should've, being a self-proclaimed adult.

Slamjet's list was comprised of his choices, and the possible results of his actions on others that he loves...your list is a list of hurts caused to you.

Your experiences, though tragic, do not give you experience to pick an eternal companion, any more than my experiences (also tragic and equally life threatening) helped me pick my husband that I married at the age of 20, who nearly beat me to death because I became a Mormon.

A mission is a great idea. See some of the world, carry some heavier responsibilities, let the Lord make you a good, forgiving, patient companion.

It takes a lot of wisdom and humility to admit you need a divorce when you actually do need one, no matter what people will think of you.

Not a good idea to persecute someone for doing the right thing (in case you are wondering, I am referring to both the 16 yr. old girl you tried to keep to yourself in spite of unknown future plans and slamjet)

[Backroads]

No offense but I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce.

Ooh, careful. You are suggesting that everyone who has been through divorces are incapable of healthy marriages. A healthy divorce is better than an unhealthy marriage. We also have a number of divorcees on this board. I'm marrying a divorcee this weekend. I really hope you're not trying to insult anyone.

Think of it this way: Even though you doubt the helpfulness of someone who has been through a divorce... they can give you perspective on challenges that arise and even what not to do.

[rameumptom]

LDSChristian,

I've been divorced. After a year of marriage, my wife became bored with me and filed for divorce. I even tried to get her into couple counseling, but it didn't help.

Now I've been married to my 2nd wife for almost 25 years. I've been in bishoprics, worked in a variety of ward and stake callings, and am now on the high council.

Do you really think that my advice on things should be discounted, simply because I've been divorced? As with Jayanna, the divorce was imposed by our exes. Mine insisted on a divorce because she was bored, hers because he was violent. Either way, we've both learned from such experiences, are working to serve God and our current families, and are successful at it.

I know you are young, but you need to realize that, also. You have a lot to learn, and closing your mind to things people suggest to you, simply due to a tangent issue, is not the wise thing to do.

You dropped the 16 year old for dating someone else. Yet the Strength of Youth encourages her to date around. Such a choice by her may seem immature to you. However, we have to remember that She is, after all, 16, and not 21. At the same time, you are showing the immaturity of your own age, dating her and thinking about going out with other ladies at the same time. It is hard to keep track of where you are going, as you have changed ponies several times, sometimes on the same day!

I hope you can learn from our (and others') experiences. If not, you will be forced to learn from your own mistakes. As Benjamin Franklin once wrote:

Experience keeps a dear (harsh) school, but fools will learn in no other.

I hope you can learn from our advice and experience, so you do not have to learn from your own experience.

[Wingnut]

A wise man learns by the mistakes of others, a fool by his own.

[ryanh]

I don't understand. If you feel that it is experiences (especially bad ones) that gives wisdom and understanding, then why do you so summarily dismiss the understanding of others who have extensive experience? Shouldn't your assertion mean you ought to give more weight to the advice of those that have experienced far more in the realms of relationship than you have? Esp people that have actually experienced deaths of significant relationships - including one or more marriages?

No offense but I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce.

It is rather useless to attempt to have any sort of a conversation with a person that won't actually answer a question or address a specific thought. So, here it is again, a little more simplified: Do you feel your negative experiences in life have contributed to your maturity and understanding? I'm thinking from your earlier posts that you do feel that way. Please confirm or deny. And, how is it you feel that other's negative experiences have not helped them mature and gain understanding?

By using your logic, since you have been the object of bullying, I should wholly ignore any advice you have for others on avoiding bullying or dealing with the ramifications, no?

[JudoMinja]

LDSChristian

Forgive me if this is misguided, but based on your posts here and previous thread, it seems to me you are looking for some all-around dating/relationship advice. You are uncertain exactly who you want to date and are looking for the girl you want to marry. You also stated your desire to prepare for a mission, so you are generally attempting to determine the direction of your life.

I can see where the advice you've received so far can get under your skin, as everyone has a certain emotional investment in giving advice about such topics. Some people are trying to warn you, caution you and steer you away from danger and the conversation has gotten heated. I admit, in your other thread I became offended when you referred to such cautionary advice as "crap" and "immature". My own response was somewhat heated, and I apologize.

However, I would like to offer what helpful advice I can in a manner that you may take it to heart. The whole point of advice is to use one's own experience and knowledge to give another ideas about how to handle similar situations in their own life. What you do with that advice is entirely up to you- take it or leave it.

At 19, you are certainly an adult and have quite a bit of experience under your belt. Yet, now is the time that will determine the course of the rest of your life. Lives are truly shaped by the choices we make in early adulthood. The experiences you go through NOW will stick with you forever, for good or for ill. The best step to take right now is a look inward.

Think about where you want to be next year, in the next five years, the next twenty years. Where do you want to be religiously/spiritually? Where do you want to be intellectually? What are your plans for a career? And finally, what do you want out of relationships?

The relationships really should be the culminating point, as this involves other people. It is important to have everything settled personally before making decisions that will so heavily impact others. If you do wish to go on a mission, as you stated, perhaps dating should not be concerning you right now. Clearly there are several girls you may be considering, but attempting to settle into something serious before you have left on your mission is asking quite a bit out of these girls.

Say you do choose one before you leave. Is it really fair to ask her to hold off on dating others and learning for herself just what she wants out of life by promising to hold on to you exclusively while you are away for two years? That question is the real reason men are asked not to seek serious relationships while preparing for a mission. It is better for you to put all your focus on the gospel and the service you will be giving the Lord so that your whole heart is in it, and not unfairly tie a woman down who is still trying to figure out the same things you are.

Relationships take time to develop. Perhaps, when you come back from your mission, one of these girls will still be available and interested. Perhaps there will be a totally different girl who has captured your interest. You cannot know for certain until that time comes.

Whether or not you do serve a mission, the next step would be in making sure you can provide for a family. How can you commit to a serious relationship, if you are not prepared to provide for a wife and children? There are still some other big decisions to make. Do you have a career in mind? Are you planning on going to college? What direction do you see yourself going in? There are many, many responsibilities you have not yet considered and what career path you choose will heavily influence your ability to be a provider.

Once you have all that figured out, then you need to ask yourself what you want out of a relationship, and more importantly what you can give. Identifying the "right girl" is the wrong approach, as there are likely many girls out there that you could potentially have a good relationship with. Instead, determine what kind of man you want to be and put yourself in places where you will meet and get to know girls who are looking for that kind of man.

Dating is certainly a precursor to marriage, but only after time. The "getting to know you phase" should include many individuals as you build friendships based on shared interests. Once these friendships are in place, you can start looking into delving more deeply, spending one-on-one time with people of interest and determining whether their life-plan could match your own. It is hard to make that determination if you or the girl you are interested in have not yet figured out what you want to do with your life.

So, instead of asking a girl to make an "on the fly" decision on a guy who doesn't yet know what direction he is going, figure out your direction so that you have a good "pitch" to offer.

[Guest JustAnotherGirl]

Dear LDSChristian, Check these out...Maybe they will help:

“‘Soul mates’ are a fiction and an illusion; and while every young man and young woman will seek with all diligence and prayerfulness to find a mate with whom life can be most compatible and beautiful, yet it is certain that almost any good man and any good woman can have happiness and a successful marriage if both are willing to pay the price” (“Marriage and Divorce,” p. 146).---Pres. Spencer W. Kimball

“While I am sure some young couples have some special guidance in getting together, I do not believe in predestined love. If you desire the inspiration of the Lord in this crucial decision, you must live the standards of the Church, and you must pray constantly for the wisdom to recognize those qualities upon which a successful union may be based. You must do the choosing, rather than to seek for some one-and-only so-called soul mate, chosen for you by someone else and waiting for you. You are to do the choosing. You must be wise beyond your years and humbly prayerful unless you choose amiss” (Eternal Love [salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1973], p. 11).--Elder Boyd K. Packer

[NeuroTypical]

Careful with those quotes, JAG. If you have anything from Brigham Young, don't tell LDSC. He doesn't take advice from people who have been through a divorce.

No offense but I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce.

As far as I can tell, part of wisdom involves being willing and able to learn from someone who has made mistakes. Surely, some of the most precious and valueable advice my wife and I ever recieved, was from our bishop in 2006. He had been through a divorce and was on his 2nd marriage when he gave us the advice.

But hey, live like you wanna live, baby. May I suggest you also refuse to sing hymns written by people who were once excommunicated?

* Phelps, William W.

Adam-ondi-Ahman - #49

Come, All Ye Saints of Zion - #38

Come, All Ye Saints Who Dwell on Earth - #65

Come, Let Us Sing an Evening Hymn - #167

Gently Raise the Sacred Strain - #146

Glorious Things Are Sung of Zion - #48

If You Could Hie to Kolob - #284

Now Let Us Rejoice - #3

Now We'll Sing with One Accord - #25

O God, the Eternal Father - #175

Praise to the Man - #27

Redeemer of Israel - #6

The Spirit of God - #2

We're Not Ashamed to Own Our Lord - #57

Edited March 3, 2011 by Loudmouth_Mormon

[rameumptom]

Dear LDSChristian, Check these out...Maybe they will help:

“‘Soul mates’ are a fiction and an illusion; ” (“Marriage and Divorce,” p. 146).---Pres. Spencer W. Kimball

“While I am sure some young couples have some special guidance in getting together, I do not believe in predestined love. ” (Eternal Love [salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1973], p. 11).--Elder Boyd K. Packer

Oh, so who are your gonna believe: a couple of apostles or Saturday's Warriors?

[LDSChristian]

Careful with those quotes, JAG. If you have anything from Brigham Young, don't tell LDSC. He doesn't take advice from people who have been through a divorce.

As far as I can tell, part of wisdom involves being willing and able to learn from someone who has made mistakes. Surely, some of the most precious and valueable advice my wife and I ever recieved, was from our bishop in 2006. He had been through a divorce and was on his 2nd marriage when he gave us the advice.

But hey, live like you wanna live, baby. May I suggest you also refuse to sing hymns written by people who were once excommunicated?

I take advice of any prophet regardless because they are the mouthpieces of God.

[NeuroTypical]

Ok, got it. You're not interested in hearing from people who might have learned from their mistakes. But you'll listen to prophets regardless of their background. So anything Brigham Young had to say on marriage is ok, but marriage advice from any bishop, stake president, patriarch, area or general authority is still out, if they'd ever been divorced. (Fortunately these folks are pretty rare.)

But does that still leave WW Phelps out? He never made prophet, just counselor to David Whitmer...

[LDSChristian]

LDSChristian

Forgive me if this is misguided, but based on your posts here and previous thread, it seems to me you are looking for some all-around dating/relationship advice. You are uncertain exactly who you want to date and are looking for the girl you want to marry. You also stated your desire to prepare for a mission, so you are generally attempting to determine the direction of your life.

I can see where the advice you've received so far can get under your skin, as everyone has a certain emotional investment in giving advice about such topics. Some people are trying to warn you, caution you and steer you away from danger and the conversation has gotten heated. I admit, in your other thread I became offended when you referred to such cautionary advice as "crap" and "immature". My own response was somewhat heated, and I apologize.

However, I would like to offer what helpful advice I can in a manner that you may take it to heart. The whole point of advice is to use one's own experience and knowledge to give another ideas about how to handle similar situations in their own life. What you do with that advice is entirely up to you- take it or leave it.

At 19, you are certainly an adult and have quite a bit of experience under your belt. Yet, now is the time that will determine the course of the rest of your life. Lives are truly shaped by the choices we make in early adulthood. The experiences you go through NOW will stick with you forever, for good or for ill. The best step to take right now is a look inward.

Think about where you want to be next year, in the next five years, the next twenty years. Where do you want to be religiously/spiritually? Where do you want to be intellectually? What are your plans for a career? And finally, what do you want out of relationships?

The relationships really should be the culminating point, as this involves other people. It is important to have everything settled personally before making decisions that will so heavily impact others. If you do wish to go on a mission, as you stated, perhaps dating should not be concerning you right now. Clearly there are several girls you may be considering, but attempting to settle into something serious before you have left on your mission is asking quite a bit out of these girls.

Say you do choose one before you leave. Is it really fair to ask her to hold off on dating others and learning for herself just what she wants out of life by promising to hold on to you exclusively while you are away for two years? That question is the real reason men are asked not to seek serious relationships while preparing for a mission. It is better for you to put all your focus on the gospel and the service you will be giving the Lord so that your whole heart is in it, and not unfairly tie a woman down who is still trying to figure out the same things you are.

Relationships take time to develop. Perhaps, when you come back from your mission, one of these girls will still be available and interested. Perhaps there will be a totally different girl who has captured your interest. You cannot know for certain until that time comes.

Whether or not you do serve a mission, the next step would be in making sure you can provide for a family. How can you commit to a serious relationship, if you are not prepared to provide for a wife and children? There are still some other big decisions to make. Do you have a career in mind? Are you planning on going to college? What direction do you see yourself going in? There are many, many responsibilities you have not yet considered and what career path you choose will heavily influence your ability to be a provider.

Once you have all that figured out, then you need to ask yourself what you want out of a relationship, and more importantly what you can give. Identifying the "right girl" is the wrong approach, as there are likely many girls out there that you could potentially have a good relationship with. Instead, determine what kind of man you want to be and put yourself in places where you will meet and get to know girls who are looking for that kind of man.

Dating is certainly a precursor to marriage, but only after time. The "getting to know you phase" should include many individuals as you build friendships based on shared interests. Once these friendships are in place, you can start looking into delving more deeply, spending one-on-one time with people of interest and determining whether their life-plan could match your own. It is hard to make that determination if you or the girl you are interested in have not yet figured out what you want to do with your life.

So, instead of asking a girl to make an "on the fly" decision on a guy who doesn't yet know what direction he is going, figure out your direction so that you have a good "pitch" to offer.

Not really dating advice. This thread was intended to be a question on what kind of activity people recommend for a date but as you see, most people here have yet to answer what is a good activity for a date. I have my standards set as far as the kind of girl I want to marry.

1. good personality (should be obvious)

2. looks don't matter to me but looking decent would help

3. has & still lives the law of chastity and word of wisdom

4. member of the church because i want to get married in the temple

5. doesn't have a kid and hasn't been married before and has saved herself for marriage

6. wants kids

I don't have a problem with kids as you see by #6, in fact I want about 3. I just want the first kid we raise to be our first kid, not someone elses.

[LDSChristian]

Ok, got it. You're not interested in hearing from people who might have learned from their mistakes. But you'll listen to prophets regardless of their background. So anything Brigham Young had to say on marriage is ok, but marriage advice from any bishop, stake president, patriarch, area or general authority is still out, if they'd ever been divorced. (Fortunately these folks are pretty rare.)

But does that still leave WW Phelps out? He never made prophet, just counselor to David Whitmer...

Did I say I don't take advice from others? No. I just said I heed the words of a prophet because of who they are. Are you sure you're a member of the church?

[Guest]

Not really dating advice. This thread was intended to be a question on what kind of activity people recommend for a date but as you see, most people here have yet to answer what is a good activity for a date.

Wrong thread. That was that other thread with a different girl who you said was cheating on you while you're asking everybody here about some OTHER girl while you're dating that one.

And... once again... you received TONS of suggestions on good date activities - and still, you refused to acknowledge a single one of them.

You should submit your head to the Guiness Book of World Records for the World's Thickest Skull.

[Wingnut]

I take advice of any prophet regardless because they are the mouthpieces of God.

Except the the advice in For the Strength of Youth, of course.

[JudoMinja]

Not really dating advice. This thread was intended to be a question on what kind of activity people recommend for a date but as you see, most people here have yet to answer what is a good activity for a date.

As anatess said, you're thinking of your other thread. This was your OP for this thread.

I'm in an interesting situation. There's a girl I've known since we were in the 5th grade and we've been friends ever since. We're both 19. I'm a little over a month older. We're really close. We've always been able to talk to each other about anything and everything and can make each other laugh. We don't hide our real selves from each other because we're comfortable with each other. I'm currently dating someone and she is too just to throw that out there. People have told us in the past that we should date. We've had arguments before. She is the only girl I've ever been able to patch things up with no matter how much we argue or how bad the argument is. We always find a way to get back how we were laughing and carrying on and just having a good time. Every time I'm around her I get this feeling I don't know how to explain. She also said, not asked, but said we needed to go to the movies sometime. My parents also said perhaps it's meant for her and I to be together. If you saw how we act towards each other you'd understand why they say that. But everything seems to point to what my parents say. What should I do? Considering we always find a way back to each other could it be possible that we could be meant for each other?

Sounds like you are looking for dating advice, because you are trying to determine whether you and this girl are "meant for each other". Pulling from your other threads, you are considering this girl, the 16 year old you dated for a week before she "cheated" on you, and another girl you are considering writing while on your mission.

Others have answered your question here about being meant for each other, pulling quotes from prophets which discount the idea of "soul mates". There is no one you are "meant" for, but there are many you could have a successful relationship with. Your standards for what you are looking for are good though somewhat judgemental and also a little contradictory considering where you are looking for such girls. I recall from another of your previous posts that you said you are willing to date non-members as long as they have good morals. So do you plan on trying to "convert" a non-member so that you can take her to the temple if you decide she's "the one"?

Again, though, you have also mentioned that you want to go on a mission. So why are you so worried about dating right now? Are you trying to "hook" a girl before you leave? That will just leave you both disappointed, unless you end up being one of the lucky few examples where she actually waits for you to get back and doesn't fall in love with someone else while you're gone.

As you are now an adult, dating is no longer a game or something to do for fun. You should be seriously looking for a spouse. As such, you should be prepared for all that a marriage entails. Can you financially support a family? Are you preparing yourself to be able to support a family?

[ryanh]

I just said I heed the words of a prophet because of who they are.

Noted, and quoted. Don't you mean you heed the advice of prophets when it suits your preferences in relation to dating? It's already been pointed out that you have rejected dating advice of prophets.

Are you sure you're a member of the church?

wow. Really? While I may not frequently agree with LM, I for one would be glad to have him in my ward and have him as a friend to confer with.

[NeuroTypical]

Did I say I don't take advice from others? No.

Actually, you did. Here.

No offense but I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce.

---------

I just said I heed the words of a prophet because of who they are.

Well, no, that is not all you "just said". You started a thread on the advice board entitled "what should I do", and then when someone gave you advice, you told them "I wouldn't want relationship advice from someone who's been married more than once if it's due to a divorce." So I'm taking your statement, and probing to see how far the notion goes in your mind, by asking you if you also refuse to sing hymns written by someone who has been excommunicated.

---------

Are you sure you're a member of the church?

I'm sure. Are you sure you're not a bit, well, 180 degrees wrong in your reaction to ryanh?

LM

[LDSChristian]

Wrong thread. That was that other thread with a different girl who you said was cheating on you while you're asking everybody here about some OTHER girl while you're dating that one.

And... once again... you received TONS of suggestions on good date activities - and still, you refused to acknowledge a single one of them.

You should submit your head to the Guiness Book of World Records for the World's Thickest Skull.

Ok so wrong thread. And I did acknowledge the good advice, being few, given. Oh, there was only a few things given as advice on actual activities, other stuff was "you shouldn't date" and junk like that, not advice and certainly nothing good. You laugh about people cheating on others so obviously you wouldn't be someone to listen to.

[LDSChristian]

Noted, and quoted. Don't you mean you heed the advice of prophets when it suits your preferences in relation to dating? It's already been pointed out that you have rejected dating advice of prophets.

No it hasn't because I don't reject what prophets say.

[Backroads]

Not really dating advice. This thread was intended to be a question on what kind of activity people recommend for a date but as you see, most people here have yet to answer what is a good activity for a date. I have my standards set as far as the kind of girl I want to marry.

1. good personality (should be obvious)

2. looks don't matter to me but looking decent would help

3. has & still lives the law of chastity and word of wisdom

4. member of the church because i want to get married in the temple

5. doesn't have a kid and hasn't been married before and has saved herself for marriage

6. wants kids

I don't have a problem with kids as you see by #6, in fact I want about 3. I just want the first kid we raise to be our first kid, not someone elses.

Okay, dating advice: This really depends on your personality and interests. What do you like to do? No point on taking a girl on a date you don't even like.

I think all six points are valid desires just as long as you don't judge those who match your "don't" or those who don't have a problem with any of those "don'ts".

Ok so wrong thread. And I did acknowledge the good advice, being few, given. Oh, there was only a few things given as advice on actual activities, other stuff was "you shouldn't date" and junk like that, not advice and certainly nothing good. You laugh about people cheating on others so obviously you wouldn't be someone to listen to.

Do you believe in forgiving others? Because I believe that whole "laughing at cheating" incident was cleared up as a misunderstanding.

Edited March 3, 2011 by Backroads

[Backroads]

No it hasn't because I don't reject what prophets say.

However, you have already made it clear you disagree with For the Strength of Youth which is endorsed by prophets.

[Wingnut]

You laugh about people cheating on others so obviously you wouldn't be someone to listen to.

Do you believe in forgiving others? Because I believe that whole "laughing at cheating" incident was cleared up as a misunderstanding.

Multiple times, at that, and by multiple people.

[Guest]

Ok so wrong thread. And I did acknowledge the good advice, being few, given. Oh, there was only a few things given as advice on actual activities, other stuff was "you shouldn't date" and junk like that, not advice and certainly nothing good. You laugh about people cheating on others so obviously you wouldn't be someone to listen to.

For somebody who claims he knows a lot, you sure don't know how to UNDERSTAND ENGLISH.

I laugh at people cheating on others? REALLY?

Okay, I dare you to point out WHERE exactly I laughed at people cheating on others. I'll even have all members of this board be judge and jury on your preposterous accusation.

I don't need you to forgive me. I am not at fault. I forgive you, though, no matter how really whacked up you can get.