Wow And Eating Meat

[trailrnr]

It seems to me that the WoW supports a more vegetarian lifestyle than what most LDS people live. I know we are not told to completly cut meat out of our diet but I think most LDS people eat way more meat than what we are suppose to. It seems to me we should be eating a plant based diet except in time of famine or when other food is not available. I have read things Joseph Smith and Brigham Young have said that seems to support a vegetarian diet but don't have the sources right now. I would like to get others view points on this topic.

[pushka]

I'm not LDS but I am a vegetarian. I agree with your views above. We are now able to survive on a vegetarian diet alone, and many items of food have been modified to suit the taste buds of former carnivores (omnivores!) and taste really good.

I certainly would not force my dietary preferences on anybody else, however I do believe it is healthier to eat little red meat, rather than more and is only really necessary for those people living in countries where there is little vegetation, nuts, fruit and berries available for them to eat.

[miztrniceguy]

i personally follow a low-carb lifestyle....usually

helps with weight-loss

[trailrnr]

i personally follow a low-carb lifestyle....usually

helps with weight-loss

Personally I eat a balanced diet and exercise to control my weight. Weigth loss is not an indicater of a healthy diet.

[Traveler]

I turn 60 this year - I commute by bicycle 25 miles (one way) to work. In my younger years I have competed in sport activities. You can cay whatever you want about diets but I know for a fact that no one competes on a long term low protein (little meat) diet - they simply do not have the endurance.

The Traveler

[trailrnr]

I turn 60 this year - I commute by bicycle 25 miles (one way) to work. In my younger years I have competed in sport activities. You can cay whatever you want about diets but I know for a fact that no one competes on a long term low protein (little meat) diet - they simply do not have the endurance.

The Traveler

Meat is not the only place to get protein. You can get plenty of protein from a plant based diet. It seems people who say you can't get enough protein from a plant based diet didn't do much research into the matter. I've carefully studied the topic and as I cut out some of my meat and dairy I made sure I was eating more high protein plant foods. I'm not a vegetarian but close.

Scott Jurek who is the 7 time winner of the Western States 100 Mile endurance run is a strict vegan. Scott also set the course record for the Badwater Ultramarathon last year (135 miles in death valley). I don't think he is lacking endurance.

[Guest just_jason76]

It seems to me that the WoW supports a more vegetarian lifestyle than what most LDS people live. I know we are not told to completly cut meat out of our diet but I think most LDS people eat way more meat than what we are suppose to.

I think, trailrnr, you would have to know most LDS people to make that statment. Personally, I eat very little red meat. It's usually chicken or fish for me. Maybe most of the LDS people you know eat a lot of red meat, but that in no way proves that most LDS people in general do.

[Guest Monica]

Lets look at nature in general.

Animals with eyes on the sides of their heads ex: rabbits, cows, sheep are vegetarians. They have their eyes on the sides of their heads to maximize periferal vision and see any predators that may be approacging.

Animals with their eyes in the front of their faces ex: dogs, lions, cats are meat eaters. They have their eyes in the front of their faces so they can percieve depths and distances.

Where are your eyes located?

Also look at the body types. Vegetarian animals tend to be on the heavy bulky side, ex: hippos, elephants, bison. Meat eaters are sleek ex: chetah, coyote, puma.

[BenRaines]

As for me and my household we will eat meat. So what is everyone cooking on the BBQ for Memorial Day? I think we will BBQ some zuchinni and squash along with some red and yellow bell peppers.

They look good decorating around the ribeye steaks. LOL

Ben Raines

[miztrniceguy]

m mmm.............ribeye.........medium......grilled onions and mushrooms......

[Guest ApostleKnight]

I've heard of the Atkin's Diet, but has anyone given the Angus Diet a shot? B) Gotta' love steak...in fact, sometimes I think I eat steak as an excuse to use A1 Steak sauce. I could drink A1 by itself, but even so, it does go great with meat...not so sure it'd complement asparagus.

Now I do make a tasty dish with spaghetti squash. I don't limit myself just to plants or just to meat...I take the tastiest from both! I will say that if America (not just LDS) would follow the WoW more, we wouldn't be one of the most obese nations in the world. Yikes!

[Guest Monica]

I will say that if America (not just LDS) would follow the WoW more, we wouldn't be one of the most obese nations in the world. Yikes!

America's obesity comes from too much fast food, snacks, sodas and a bad diet. Look at what americans looked like in the 50's, 60's, 70's and 80's. Think about that next time you supersize those fries!

Also the american dinner table isnt used the way it was before for family meals. Then again families are not what families were before with so many steps and live ins. Different scheduals make family dinner now a treat or a gala event when before it was the norm.

[Sugarbay]

Well, I think that Father is the one we should listen to about eating meat. Sparingly he says.I don't see anywhere where the more modern day prophets have said he doesn't mean that anymore. Comparing us to the various animals really isn't a valid analogy. We are human. The WOW says sparingly. Think about the reasons we shouldn't be addicted to things. Because we will leave here with the same addictions and such we have here. I think it is a kindness for him to tell us these things. After all, he has given us these guidelines for getting through mortality as easy as we can despite the corruption of flesh we deal with. We don't see the grand scheme of things and the WOW is no doubt an eternal principle. We are cheating ourselves if we do not obey.

There must be a reason he doesn't want us to over indulge in eating another living creature. Perhaps something we aren't ready to accept in this mortal state. Everything commandment we have been given has an eternal principle involved.IMHO

[trailrnr]

Lets look at nature in general.

Animals with eyes on the sides of their heads ex: rabbits, cows, sheep are vegetarians. They have their eyes on the sides of their heads to maximize periferal vision and see any predators that may be approacging.

Animals with their eyes in the front of their faces ex: dogs, lions, cats are meat eaters. They have their eyes in the front of their faces so they can percieve depths and distances.

Where are your eyes located?

Also look at the body types. Vegetarian animals tend to be on the heavy bulky side, ex: hippos, elephants, bison. Meat eaters are sleek ex: chetah, coyote, puma.

These examples don't fit your model.

http://www.whitesharkdiscovery.com/media/p...to02/gws103.jpg

http://img.lenta.ru/news/2005/06/03/dinosaur/picture.jpg

Gorillas have eyes in the front of their faces and they are herbivors. I don't think eye placement dictates what we are suppose to eat. We are also the only species that has to cook meat to eat it. True carnivors don't have to refrigerate their meat either.

[Guest Monica]

These examples don't fit your model.

http://www.whitesharkdiscovery.com/media/p...to02/gws103.jpg

http://img.lenta.ru/news/2005/06/03/dinosaur/picture.jpg

Gorillas have eyes in the front of their faces and they are herbivors. I don't think eye placement dictates what we are suppose to eat. We are also the only species that has to cook meat to eat it. True carnivors don't have to refrigerate their meat either.

With everything there is an exception to the rule, but majority rules.

Also the bible warns us about those who wish to impose strict vegetarianism on others.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; 3 Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God [is] good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: 5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

[Laureltree]

I agree fully, I think most do it out of habit or ease though....Its easier to just microwave, or some think....I personally think its worse, you do your body more harm then good..

[boyando]

If you ask me, I miss the fat that we had all those years ago. I remeber broning hamberger and adding left over mashed patatoes. Add butter and brown like hash browns. That was the good old days.

mmmmmmmmmmmmmm good eats

[Lindy]

Also the bible warns us about those who wish to impose strict vegetarianism on others.

1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; 3 Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God [is] good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: 5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

Thanks Monica.... I knew there was something in the Bible that stood up for meat eaters.. thank you for finding it and saving me the time to go searching :)

I honestly think that to meat or not to meat..... it's just a personal choice

[prisonchaplain]

i personally follow a low-carb lifestyle....usually

helps with weight-loss

I don't know how closely a low-carb, Atkins-like diet goes with the WoW, but it is most biblical.

Neh 8:10: 10 Then he said unto them, Go your way, eat the fat, and drink the sweet, and send portions unto them for whom nothing is prepared: for this day is holy unto our Lord: neither be ye sorry; for the joy of the LORD is your strength.KJV

Furthermore, Jesus declared that all food is clean for believers:

Mark 7:18-20

18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;

19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.

KJV

I'm being a bit facetious here. Vegetarianism can be very healthy. However, beyond obeying spiritual authorities, the New Testament seems to only ask us to care for our bodies, which are the temple of the Holy Spirit.

[Guest ApostleKnight]

...beyond obeying spiritual authorities, the New Testament seems to only ask us to care for our bodies, which are the temple of the Holy Spirit.

This is exactly why the Word of Wisdom was given to Joseph Smith by the Lord. The medical/health knowledge of his time was rather ridiculous. Joseph Smith's brother died after being given mercury as a medicine. The Lord sorted out in simple, sweeping principles (not legalistic lists) the best ways to honor the bodies we have on loan from him, and avoid the deception of those who would profit by them.

[prisonchaplain]

This is exactly why the Word of Wisdom was given to Joseph Smith by the Lord. The medical/health knowledge of his time was rather ridiculous. Joseph Smith's brother died after being given mercury as a medicine. The Lord sorted out in simple, sweeping principles (not legalistic lists) the best ways to honor the bodies we have on loan from him, and avoid the deception of those who would profit by them.

By way of clarification, is health the official reason given by Joseph Smith for the Word of Wisdom? The reason I ask is that many people assume the same about Jewish kosher laws. However, my sources tell me that the simple reason Orthodox Jews keep kosher is obedience. "God said so." Many rabbis are skeptical of attempts to offer secular rationale for keeping religious commandments.

On the other hand, if Joseph Smith said, "God wants you to keep your temples in good working order, so here's how to do it--sayeth the Lord: WoW--then God would have done something unusual, and offered a secular rationale for his command.

[Guest ApostleKnight]

By way of clarification, is health the official reason given by Joseph Smith for the Word of Wisdom?

Let's ask the Lord why he gave this revelation:

"Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days, I have warned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation--"

"And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, shall receive health in their navel and marrow to their bones;"

"And shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures;"

"And shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint."

"And I, the Lord, give unto them a promise, that the destroying angel shall pass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen." (D&C 89:4,18-21; emphasis mine).

There are several reasons there. The main benefits seem to me to be physical health, mental clarity, and spiritual strength. Let me explain how they interrelate. Drinking alcohol, taking drugs by any delivery method, etc... impair the brain's ability to function. Personal experience has taught me that my ability to sense and discern the promptings of the Holy Ghost is directly linked to my lucidity and wakefulness. Lack of sleep, eating/drinking to excess, using drugs and harmful substances decimates personal control over body and mind. In turn, the ability to communicate personally with God through spiritual promptings is also decimated.

So, where does that leave us? Let me summarize it this way.

(1) Being in tune with the Holy Ghost requires mental awareness and clarity;

(2) Certain behaviors and substances diminish our ability to "hear" the still, small voice of the Spirit;

(3) The Lord revealed guidelines as a warning against these behaviors/substances.

So I don't think physical health is the "official" reason for the WoW. I think the principle contained in the WoW is: Avoid anything that lessens your control over your thoughts, body and spirituality. On a personal note, as I live the WoW I find that I think more clearly; learn new concepts faster; have better memory; and comprehend "hidden treasures of knowledge" revealed by the Spirit that I otherwise would've been "deaf" to.

Many rabbis are skeptical of attempts to offer secular rationale for keeping religious commandments.

There may be LDS members who cite the danger of tannic acid present in certain teas, or the harmfulness of nicotine on brain function, in an attempt to have this revelation "make sense" to secular (read: skeptical) minds. I don't see how physical health has to be seen as secular, since physical health affects spiritual sensitivity. Maybe it's semantics and not worth debating; that's my feeling anyway.

...then God would have done something unusual, and offered a secular rationale for his command.

I'm not sure I understand this comment. Are you saying that if the Lord revealed a health code (the WoW is much more, see D&C 89:21) that would be out of character or incompatible with religion?

To clarify, the WoW is not a health code alone. Diets promise slimmer waists and more energy. The WoW promises much more, and my experience has been that the Lord delivers on the promises in the WoW. :)

[boyando]

<div class='quotemain'>

By way of clarification, is health the official reason given by Joseph Smith for the Word of Wisdom?

Let's ask the Lord why he gave this revelation:

"Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days, I have warned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation--"

"And all saints who remember to keep and do these sayings, walking in obedience to the commandments, shall receive health in their navel and marrow to their bones;"

"And shall find wisdom and great treasures of knowledge, even hidden treasures;"

"And shall run and not be weary, and shall walk and not faint."

"And I, the Lord, give unto them a promise, that the destroying angel shall pass by them, as the children of Israel, and not slay them. Amen." (D&C 89:4,18-21; emphasis mine).

There are several reasons there. The main benefits seem to me to be physical health, mental clarity, and spiritual strength. Let me explain how they interrelate. Drinking alcohol, taking drugs by any delivery method, etc... impair the brain's ability to function. Personal experience has taught me that my ability to sense and discern the promptings of the Holy Ghost is directly linked to my lucidity and wakefulness. Lack of sleep, eating/drinking to excess, using drugs and harmful substances decimates personal control over body and mind. In turn, the ability to communicate personally with God through spiritual promptings is also decimated.

So, where does that leave us? Let me summarize it this way.

(1) Being in tune with the Holy Ghost requires mental awareness and clarity;

(2) Certain behaviors and substances diminish our ability to "hear" the still, small voice of the Spirit;

(3) The Lord revealed guidelines as a warning against these behaviors/substances.

So I don't think physical health is the "official" reason for the WoW. I think the principle contained in the WoW is: Avoid anything that lessens your control over your thoughts, body and spirituality. On a personal note, as I live the WoW I find that I think more clearly; learn new concepts faster; have better memory; and comprehend "hidden treasures of knowledge" revealed by the Spirit that I otherwise would've been "deaf" to.

Many rabbis are skeptical of attempts to offer secular rationale for keeping religious commandments.

There may be LDS members who cite the danger of tannic acid present in certain teas, or the harmfulness of nicotine on brain function, in an attempt to have this revelation "make sense" to secular (read: skeptical) minds. I don't see how physical health has to be seen as secular, since physical health affects spiritual sensitivity. Maybe it's semantics and not worth debating; that's my feeling anyway.

...then God would have done something unusual, and offered a secular rationale for his command.

I'm not sure I understand this comment. Are you saying that if the Lord revealed a health code (the WoW is much more, see D&C 89:21) that would be out of character or incompatible with religion?

To clarify, the WoW is not a health code alone. Diets promise slimmer waists and more energy. The WoW promises much more, and my experience has been that the Lord delivers on the promises in the WoW. :)

True, all true. I'm still over weight and I still wan't a hamberger, about once a week. I still have to say thanks for reminding me that I can do better.

[trailrnr]

Also the bible warns us about those who wish to impose strict vegetarianism on others.

Did I try to impose strict vegetarianism on anyone? I still eat meat.

[Christos]

I know that it is most possible to give up meat.

I did it for Lent.

It is Orthodox tradition to fast for the period of Lent.

One week before lent there is a week of preparation called "meatfare", this is when all meat apart from fish is cast out of the diet.

Then there is clean Monday which comes a week after Meatfare Sunday. This is when you are thrust into the fast.

No meat is to be eaten, no fish, no dairy products or anything that comes from an animal. (technically caviar and seafood is allowed but I wouldn't personally allow that, it is an ancient loophole).

After a few days your body starts to adjust, first of all you get stomach rumbles. You always feel full. And your stool improves. I felt a lot healthier, my skin was wonderfully clear and I became very healthy in general.

After about a week, there is no longing for meat and you forget why you even eated it in the first place, however, giving up dairy is annoying because I do prefer milk chocolate than plain etc.

When Lent finishes, at Great and Holy Pascha (otherwise called Easter) people take in the meat carefully.

There is a feast after the service which consists of meat (and lots of it) and eggs, and anything that was abstatined from in Lent.

I felt so ill after the feast but so happy!

Also I was a lot thinner, at the end of Lent I was probably at the correct shape I should be....now I am a little wider round the waist than I should be. .

Something which the Orthodox and LDS church can unite in is that the abstainance of such foods is not a personal selfish act but an act of prayer, a means to become more meditative in God.

Both churches acknowledge that it is to clean the body, which is described as the "Temple of the Holy Spirit".

I watch my cat catch her prey (whether it be bird or mouse) and it really makes me think how we should be like a cat.

Excercise plenty and eat occasionally.

Eat only when you are hungry.

If there is too much food on your plate, do not eat it! If the person is a good host, they shouldn't be offended plus if it were in a restaurant, you do not know what the size of the portions are.