annewandering Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 But that avoids the question. Was the choice not made when sex was agreed to? If not, then why not allow post-natal abortion?So what about rape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerome1232 Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 So what about rape?I think it's already been mentioned, that is an exceptional circumstance, most give that case an exception. Clearly by definition you can't "chose" to be raped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 So what about rape?We're not talking about forcible rape. Most pro-lifers want an exception in case of forcible rape. We're talking about a supposed "right" to kill your unborn baby purely because you decide you don't want it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annewandering Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 We're not talking about forcible rape. Most pro-lifers want an exception in case of forcible rape. We're talking about a supposed "right" to kill your unborn baby purely because you decide you don't want it.Please dont qualify the rape. All rape is against the will of the person being raped. Another discussion I know but please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) Please dont qualify the rape. All rape is against the will of the person being raped. Another discussion I know but please.(Sorry, can't resist the minor threadjack.)How about statutory rape? Union of an eighteen year old boy with a seventeen year old girl in a state without Romeo-Juliet legislation?How about a wife who has intercourse with her husband, but isn't really happy in the relationship and would leave if she had the economic means to do so?At one time, it would have been enough to call rape rape, and have done with it. But as radical feminists develop theories of gender relations that pretty much give a female the unilateral right to cry "rape" anytime she decides an encounter wasn't all that fun; the term "forcible rape" regrettably ceases to be redundant. Edited November 15, 2012 by Just_A_Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annewandering Posted November 15, 2012 Report Share Posted November 15, 2012 (Sorry, can't resist the minor threadjack.)How about statutory rape? Union of an eighteen year old boy with a seventeen year old girl in a state without Romeo-Juliet legislation?How about a wife who has intercourse with her husband, but isn't really happy in the relationship and would leave if she had the economic means to do so?At one time, it would have been enough to call rape rape, and have done with it. But as radical feminists develop theories of gender relations that pretty much give a female the unilateral right to cry "rape" anytime she decides an encounter wasn't all that fun; the term "forcible rape" regrettably ceases to be redundant.Well there are always liars in the world. Should victims be punished because of the liars? As far as the 17/18 year olds go, the laws need changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 Please dont qualify the rape. All rape is against the will of the person being raped. Another discussion I know but please.Answer the question.And rape is not monolithic. An immature 21-year-old having sex with a willing and sexually experienced 17-year-old and a drunk frat boy having sex with a drunk sorority girl are very different things from forcible rape. For you to pretend they are exactly the same is loathsome and vomitous. For shame.Now, please, answer the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annewandering Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 If its not rape then yes its a choice made when sex was chosen. And no I still do not agree with your qualifications for rape. Rape is against a persons will. If its not against their will/choice its not rape unless the victim cannot legally consent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 If its not rape then yes its a choice made when sex was chosen. And no I still do not agree with your qualifications for rape. Rape is against a persons will. If its not against their will/choice its not rape unless the victim cannot legally consent.What's that? You're qualifying the term "rape"? How dare you!It appears that "forcible rape" is the only kind of rape you recognize. But the law and society in general do not see things your way. You would do better to accept the term as it is actually used and work within that framework than to insist on your own private definition and demand everyone else adopt it as well. (See "socialism" in another thread.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 Well there are always liars in the world. Should victims be punished because of the liars?Even granting your implication that a baby is a "punishment" - which I find highly objectionable - your logic can be turned on its head. Should the ninety-ought percent of aborted fetuses in this country who are the products of consensual sex, be punished for the existence of the ten-or-less percent of aborted fetuses who are the products of rape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annewandering Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 Even granting your implication that a baby is a "punishment" - which I find highly objectionable - your logic can be turned on its head. Should the ninety-ought percent of aborted fetuses in this country who are the products of consensual sex, be punished for the existence of the ten-or-less percent of aborted fetuses who are the products of rape?A baby is not punishment. Being forced to bear a rapist child is punishment if they can not come to terms with it. Not doing the abortion is wonderful argument. Sorry. I would have a hard time having an abortion even at the cost of my life. I am not everyone. I am not a raped person who actually is pregnant with a rapists child. God has left us that option so who am I to say it is wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just_A_Guy Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 God has left us that option so who am I to say it is wrong?You mean "the option" in that you have the inherent power to do it and mankind has the medical technology to do it? Or you mean "the option" in that Church policy has said that abortion may be justifiable in the case of rape? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 I didn't vote my conscience, I voted for a better economy.Mitt is not my ideal guy...but I believe he is a very good man (not to suggest that Barack Obama is a bad man). I don't like social issues in politics...I like small effective government...or I would if it existed.As for social issues, I wonder how many Saints would have followed the Prophet if he said that a vote for SS marriage is a sin or a vote for funding abortion is a sin? While many say that would give up everything and move to Zion if called on to do so, many others had conniption fits when the church opposed Prop. 8.Ohio and Pennsylvania....I guess they voted for a better economy too??The highest numbers of new filings came from Pennsylvania and Ohio, where there were thousands of layoffs in the construction, manufacturing, and automobile industries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 A baby is not punishment. Being forced to bear a rapist child is punishment if they can not come to terms with it. Not doing the abortion is wonderful argument. Sorry. I would have a hard time having an abortion even at the cost of my life. I am not everyone. I am not a raped person who actually is pregnant with a rapists child. God has left us that option so who am I to say it is wrong?But, anne, you keep ignoring that NO ONE HERE HAS SAID A VICTIM OF FORCIBLE RAPE SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO ABORT THE PREGNANCY. You are attacking a straw man. The topic is elective abortion as a general rule, not elective abortion in case of forcible rape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 A baby is not punishment...'I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby. " - President Barrack Obama Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john doe Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 A baby is not punishment.Tell that to Barack Obama. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Backroads Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 ...'I am going to teach them first of all about values and morals. But if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby. " - President Barrack ObamaThey have no reason to learn about values and morals if there are no consequences. Why bother abstaining from sex if you can just have an abortion? Why take the time to get educated about the various forms of birth control if you can just have an abortion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norah63 Posted November 16, 2012 Report Share Posted November 16, 2012 Ever notice how our society has traded the word sin for mistake? How handy to avoid repentance. Pardon the interuption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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