Multiple Temple Clearances?

[MIssB]

My husband and I had to get a clearance in order to be sealed in the temple. He was married to his first wife for 7 months. We were able to get a clearance and be sealed in the temple 7 months after his first marriage ended.

Okay... fast forward to now. My husband has asked me for a divorce after 19 months of marriage. It is really devastating to me, but clearly there are bigger issues that haven't been resolved to have 2 failed marriages over the course of like 2 1/2 years. One of the points that I made to my husband was that you don't just give up if something is hard. Eternal covenants are a serious commitment. He is just done with everything and there is no changing his mind. He isn't willing to do counseling or pray or anything. He has made up his mind and chosen to shut me and the Lord out of his life. At this point, the only thing I can do is move forward.

However, one comment that he made to me last week has kind of stuck with me. He commented on how he would date someone for a year before getting married again to make sure there weren't any issues. (Whatever that means!) So, it got me to thinking about what his future does hold. Is it likely that he would be able to get another temple clearance? I know that none of us can know how the First Presidency would look at the situation, but I'm curious. Does anyone know somebody who has received multiple clearances that didn't have spouses die? I just don't think he has an eternal perspective on this at all...

[Guest]

Since he's not keeping his covenants, a clearance wouldn't be necessary. He's "clearing" himself on his own. But I imagine if he decided to marry again down the road and wanted another clearance to marry in the temple, it wouldn't be as easy. For one thing, they would ask you for a letter, and the honest truth (taking your post at face value) is that he gave up after a short time and wasn't willing to work on it.

[pam]

But isn't it policy that a man can be sealed to more than one living woman without getting a sealing cancellation? Dependent of course on whether he has gotten legally divorced.

[selek]

Without getting a sealing cancellation, yes- but three applications for Temple marriages inside of five years (assuming he doesn't already have a new honey in mind)?

That's gonna raise red flags up and down the line, if only from a polygamy angle.

Moreover, even acquiring a Temple recommend requires that he be dealing honestly and honorably with wives and children- which he arguably has not.

The Church takes these covenants seriously, even if he does not- and this will be an increasingly up hill climb the longer he plays this game, as will the repentance process once he finally gets called on the carpet.

[pam]

I just wanted to clarify policy. But I agree. That many in that short of time would be huge red flags.

[Maureen]

I think policy is that a man doesn't need to apply for a sealing cancellation but he still needs to apply for a sealing clearance.

M.

[Wingnut]

I think it's good, and smart, that he's planning a longer courtship for the next time around. However, he seems to be idealistic if he thinks it's going to help him ensure that there aren't any "issues." Every relationship and every marriage have problems. If there aren't any (even small tiffs here and there), then the parties are either lying to themselves or each other (or both). That's just my opinion, of course. An important part of marriage -- of human development and working toward self-perfection -- is learning to overcome these challenges, and work through them together, coming out better on the other side. If he thinks he can escape this natural human process by simply dating longer, he's fooling himself.

I think policy is that a man doesn't need to apply for a sealing cancellation but he still needs to apply for a sealing clearance.

M.

Correct.

[MIssB]

I know he wouldn't need a cancellation - that is something I would need if I ever wanted to be sealed to another man in the future. My questions was on his ability to get yet another clearance. I'm trying hard not to be bitter and angry, but I sincerely don't think someone should be able to just disregard solemn covenants made in the temple. Based on my experience with him, I have a feeling he will move on fairly quickly.

Ultimately, I don't make the decision. I know the Lord knows the situation and that he will guide the First Presidency when the day comes. I just wondered if anyone had heard of other men who were able to get more than one clearance when the previous marriages ended in divorce.

The divorce was not my choice and I would have fought like hell to save it, but it's not a battle I can fight alone. I am saddened for me and I am saddened for his choice. i just don't think he sees the bigger picture at all right now.

[applepansy]

But isn't it policy that a man can be sealed to more than one living woman without getting a sealing cancellation? Dependent of course on whether he has gotten legally divorced.

Only with permission from the wife he's stilled sealed to.

[applepansy]

I know he wouldn't need a cancellation - that is something I would need if I ever wanted to be sealed to another man in the future. My questions was on his ability to get yet another clearance. I'm trying hard not to be bitter and angry, but I sincerely don't think someone should be able to just disregard solemn covenants made in the temple. Based on my experience with him, I have a feeling he will move on fairly quickly.

Ultimately, I don't make the decision. I know the Lord knows the situation and that he will guide the First Presidency when the day comes. I just wondered if anyone had heard of other men who were able to get more than one clearance when the previous marriages ended in divorce.

The divorce was not my choice and I would have fought like hell to save it, but it's not a battle I can fight alone. I am saddened for me and I am saddened for his choice. i just don't think he sees the bigger picture at all right now.

Yes. My sister's 2nd husband. They are in the middle of a nasty divorce now. He's had two sealing clearances previously. My sister is his 3rd wife. The Stake President said he recommended the clearance because he thought this guy had changed and being married to my sister would help him. Wrong!

There were lots of red flags. And his family has apologized to my sister for not being more forthcoming about some of the issues. Basically he lied to everyone.

Heavenly Father is not going to step on our agency, even if and maybe especially when we insist on marrying someone and insist on the temple clearance in the case of a man and temple cancellation in the case of a woman.

In my sister's case, she's choosing to honor her covenants regardless of whether her soon-to-be Ex honors his or not. Its highly unlikely she'll marry again.

Edited June 3, 2013 by applepansy

[Wingnut]

Only with permission from the wife he's stilled sealed to.

Permission, or input?

[Maureen]

...Heavenly Father is not going to step on our agency, even if and maybe especially when we insist on marrying someone and insist on the temple clearance in the case of a man and temple cancellation in the case of a woman....

Can a member insist on getting approval, or can they only request?

M.

[Guest]

They can insist all they want, but it doesn't mean they'll get it.

[ttr1023]

Yes. My sister's 2nd husband. They are in the middle of a nasty divorce now. He's had two sealing clearances previously. My sister is his 3rd wife. The Stake President said he recommended the clearance because he thought this guy had changed and being married to my sister would help him. Wrong!

There were lots of red flags. And his family has apologized to my sister for not being more forthcoming about some of the issues. Basically he lied to everyone.

Heavenly Father is not going to step on our agency, even if and maybe especially when we insist on marrying someone and insist on the temple clearance in the case of a man and temple cancellation in the case of a woman.

In my sister's case, she's choosing to honor her covenants regardless of whether her soon-to-be Ex honors his or not. Its highly unlikely she'll marry again.

I'm curious, did his second clearance take longer than his first? I will need to have a second clearance some day and the thought of that led me here. Also, did they contact the first ex-wife when applying for the SECOND clearance, or does the previous clearance already count? I'm not perfect or without blame, but both marriages of mine there was infidelity on their part, I've always remained strong and these trials have helped me grow and learn how the atonement applies to us individually. My first ex left the church too. My second got disfellowshipped. Do you think it'll take longer for my second clearance? The marriages were 1998 and 2005. Thanks!

[ttr1023]

Permission, or input?

Input. Leadership realizes the other side can be vindictive and vengeful. I was told in mine, they want to see if things are consistant, but in some cases take it with a grain of salt.

[Wingnut]

Input. Leadership realizes the other side can be vindictive and vengeful. I was told in mine, they want to see if things are consistant, but in some cases take it with a grain of salt.

That's what I've always heard. I just wondered, since Apple sounded like she had some close-to-personal experience with it.

[applepansy]

Permission, or input?

The word I've heard used in the situations I know about is permission, but I'm sure that human nature plays a roll and vindictive spouses are taken into consideration.

Edited June 4, 2013 by applepansy

[applepansy]

Can a member insist on getting approval, or can they only request?

M.

They can only request, but I've seen people try to "insist"

[applepansy]

I'm curious, did his second clearance take longer than his first? I will need to have a second clearance some day and the thought of that led me here. Also, did they contact the first ex-wife when applying for the SECOND clearance, or does the previous clearance already count? I'm not perfect or without blame, but both marriages of mine there was infidelity on their part, I've always remained strong and these trials have helped me grow and learn how the atonement applies to us individually. My first ex left the church too. My second got disfellowshipped. Do you think it'll take longer for my second clearance? The marriages were 1998 and 2005. Thanks!

Yes it took longer. Yes the other wives were contacted.

I don't know about your situation specifically. Only your Bishop and Stake President can give you any idea about how long the process will take for your circumstances.

[ttr1023]

Yes it took longer. Yes the other wives were contacted.

I don't know about your situation specifically. Only your Bishop and Stake President can give you any idea about how long the process will take for your circumstances.

Do you know how many months the second one took? My first clearance took 3 months and only after the approval letter did my bishop tell me how vindictive and evil speaking my ex ( who left the church) was. I'm curious how long his second one was. Thank you very much

[Mojomanny]

I am new here and an investigator (so I don't know a whole heck of a lot).

That being said, have you sat down and spoken with your Bishop. He could help you understand the answer as well as you providing him with a full picture now, because surely the Bishop will be involved at some point if there is another request. If he sees now that your husband is not willing to work on things and is not keeping covenants, it might help him when the request comes through.

Just my 2¢ and worth every penny you paid for it.

Please let us know how things work out

[MIssB]

I have spoke with my Bishop about things - he knows that my husband is not willing to work on things. However, I have now moved out of the ward. My husband will move out of the ward when the lease is over - so he won't be in that ward or stake when the time comes.

Having gone through the process to get a clearance for our own sealing, I do understand the process. I even met with my husband's Bishop and Stake President prior to the paperwork being submitted. One of the things that the Stake President said to me was that one of his responsibilities was to be able to say to the First Presidency that he felt like this marriage would work.

There is not one part of this whole process that isn't hard. In fact, I'm still feeling pretty devastated over the whole thing. My husband did tell our Bishop that he wanted an eternal marriage and family but he didn't see it with me. He "just couldn't see it." That was hard. So, now I'm just thinking about what his options really would be. I know I just need to let go and take care of myself, but I'm not quite there yet.

Thanks everyone for all of your thoughts and input!

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