A Jewish Voice From the Desert


Aish HaTorah
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1 hour ago, Aish HaTorah said:

We recite that word in the Shema every day.

"The Shema" refers (as shown below) to the passage in Deuteronomy.

43 minutes ago, Aish HaTorah said:

Absolutely!  Yeshua, of course, was Yehudim, so he would most certainly have been referring to Devarim (Deuteronomy) 6:4-9:

Quote

HEAR, O ISRAEL: The L-rd our G-d, the L-rd is one.  ANd thou shalt love the L-rd thy G-d with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.  And these words, which I command you this day, shall be upon thy heart; and thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thy house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.  ANd thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thy hand, and they shall be for frontlets between thine eyes.  And thou shalt write them upon the door-posts of thy house, and upon thy gates.

"Shema" is the first Hebrew word in the passage: "Hear". Many Jews recite it as part of their daily prayers.

Note to Aish: Not all of us have learned these things. I'm trying to plug some holes in our collective education.

Lehi

Edited by LeSellers
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10 minutes ago, LeSellers said:

"The Shema" is refers (as shown below) to the passage in Deuteronomy.

"Shema" is the first Hebrew word in the passage: "Hear". Many Jews recite it as part of their daily prayers.

Note to Aish: Not all of us have learned these things. I'm trying to plug some holes in our collective education.

Lehi

I am so sorry about that!  I forget what people know or do not know.  I should make no assumptions; that isn't fair.  Thank you for checking me!  :)

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10 minutes ago, Aish HaTorah said:

I forget what people know or do not know.  I should make no assumptions; that isn't fair.  Thank you for checking me!  :)

It happens to all of us.

If we assume what you do not know, enlighten us about our preconceptions, too. We're just as human (i.e., error-prone) as anyone else.

Lehi

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9 minutes ago, LeSellers said:

It happens to all of us.

If we assume what you do not know, enlighten us about our preconceptions, too. We're just as human (i.e., error-prone) as anyone else.

Lehi

I was hoping to avoid hubris as well.  :)  That is always a danger.  Not with me, I assure you!  But with some.  I've heard, anyway.

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4 hours ago, Aish HaTorah said:

Well..."minor" is a bit subjective :D, but yes in essence.  Your faith, as does most all of Christianity, has its roots in Judaism.  Of course, there were no Jews before Abraham.

Your view of Yeshua and who he was is a bit of a hurdle for us.

In case it wasn't clear, I was trying to make a joke about the "minor" thing. We believe Jesus was the Son of God and his mission the most important thing that's happened in human history.

I respect that the Jews see it differently, though. #11 of our official articles of faith:

Quote

We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may.

 

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10 hours ago, Aish HaTorah said:

Well..."minor" is a bit subjective :D, but yes in essence.  Your faith, as does most all of Christianity, has its roots in Judaism.  Of course, there were no Jews before Abraham.

Your view of Yeshua and who he was is a bit of a hurdle for us.

This has always been my understanding.  I have respect for Judaism, what I know of it, for this reason (the roots). :)  

Shalom!  Welcome to the board.

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Here is a question...  What is your understanding the significance/importance of the various tribes of Israel? Especially any particular role in future events they are expected to play?

I ask because we LDS have our own understanding of them and I am curious about what insights a Jew might offer on the matter.  

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2 hours ago, Carborendum said:

I've got a question too.  What is the Jewish belief regarding the after-life?

We call the afterlife Olam Ha-Ba, or The World to Come.  There is not a lot of definitive consensus with regard to dogma and Olam Ha-Ba, in my opinion, but as with all things Jewish and Theology...there is a LOT of speculation (read arguing).

We don't believe in the idea of hell in the traditional Christian way of thinking (and, I presume LDS as well?).  We do believe that there is a state of punishment that results from sins committed, although it isn't permanent.

Within the many flavors of Judaism, it is a pretty unequivocal belief that mortal death is NOT the end of our existence.  Torah nods to this in many places.  Deuteronomy 11:13-15 and Leviticus 26:3-9, for example.

This is just the surface, of course.  If you or anyone is interested, perhaps a sub-thread within the Jewish category could be started.  I appreciate your question very much.

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3 hours ago, estradling75 said:

Here is a question...  What is your understanding the significance/importance of the various tribes of Israel? Especially any particular role in future events they are expected to play?

I ask because we LDS have our own understanding of them and I am curious about what insights a Jew might offer on the matter.

Excellent question!  To bring Readers Digest into the mix, let me say that there are essentially two basic beliefs on the "lost" tribes.  The majority of people in Jewish circles believe that the tribes were so mixed in with the various world groups (i.e. intermarried) that they are gone forever and will never return as in days of old.  The minority believe that they are indeed lost AND intact and that some day they will be reunited with Judah.

As with any of these questions all of you have been asking.  We can go as deep as you'd like or stay in the shallows with the minnows.  :)

I am Jewish.  I could argue for years on a single Hebrew letter and its significance within G-d's word.  :D

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3 hours ago, anatess2 said:

Yeay!  We have another Jewish expert on board!  We could use your input on a lot of our discussions around here...

WELCOME!

Well, "expert" is certainly a kind, albeit largely unfounded, compliment.  I do my best with HaShem's assistance.

There is an old Yiddish expression:  Dos hitl iz gut nor der kop iz tsu kleyn.  The hat is fine, but the head is too small.  I can't shrink my head, so I guess I'll have to buy a bigger hat.  ;)

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1 hour ago, Aish HaTorah said:

Excellent question!  To bring Readers Digest into the mix, let me say that there are essentially two basic beliefs on the "lost" tribes.  The majority of people in Jewish circles believe that the tribes were so mixed in with the various world groups (i.e. intermarried) that they are gone forever and will never return as in days of old.  The minority believe that they are indeed lost AND intact and that some day they will be reunited with Judah.

As with any of these questions all of you have been asking.  We can go as deep as you'd like or stay in the shallows with the minnows.  :)

I am Jewish.  I could argue for years on a single Hebrew letter and its significance within G-d's word.  :D

Thanks

So assuming that the "Lost" tribes are not gone forever and they do at some future point return...   What purpose would such a recovery serve?

 

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22 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Thanks

So assuming that the "Lost" tribes are not gone forever and they do at some future point return...   What purpose would such a recovery serve?

 

*takes a deep breath*

Okay.  So, all Jews (of which I know) agree that the tribes are still lost...at least in the way most people understand the term.  Sephardic Jews are still Yehudim, no matter where they call home.  Are the part of the lost tribes?  I don't know.  :)

Do you (and other Mormons) believe that Jews represent all of the twelve tribes?  In my experience, many Christians hold this belief.  This is not what I believe, nor most Jews believe.  When I've asked Christians to provide examples from Jewish sources to back up this claim, they cannot do so.  This is because they are non-existent.  The term Yehudi (Jew) has its origin in the kingdom of Judah, and Judah alone.  Nowadays, I think there is a general consensus that the term Jew is indicative of the physical as well as spiritual descendants of Ya'akov (Jacob).

What purpose would a recovery serve?  To bring people back to Jerusalem.  The word Jerusalem is actually a composite of two Hebrew words:  Yirah Shalem.  I means "a perfect state of awe."  This was the state of Jerusalem when the temple was there.  Now that it is gone, we wait for the return of the temple and, therefore, a restoration of that state of perfect awe.  This is why the Hebrew word for "repent" is "teshuva."  It means literally to "return."  The Hebrew letter "a" in teshuva is the same "a" (or "hay" in Hebrew) that is in G-d's name, which we do not speak:  Yod Hay Vav Hay.  In other words, to repent is to return to that state of perfect awe, or to return to G-d.

There is endless argument about all this, I have no doubt that my answer was as clear as mud on a dark day.  I prefer Rabbi Eliezer's stance:  "Just like a day is followed by darkness, and the light later returns, so too, although it will become 'dark' for the ten tribes, G-d will ultimately take them out of their darkness."

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OK, I really hope I'm not banned for this one, but I wanted ask Aish, have you seen the following movie?

Jewtopia
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0878814/
Netflix link, not sure if it will work for you all: https://www.netflix.com/search/jewtopia?jbv=70287266&jbp=0&jbr=0

I thought it was hilarious, but then I was ashamed at myself for laughing. It has a lot of apparent stereotypes, most of which I had never heard of before.

Then I read some reviews by Jews and they said the movie was just Jews making fun of themselves. So I thought maybe I could relax and go back to finding it hilarious.

Now, I will say that I do not necessarily recommend this movie to LDS people in this forum, because it has some strong sexual references which were way too much for me. I didn't enjoy that part. It's rated NR

But anyway, I wondered if you'd seen the movie and what you thought. You seem like someone who might enjoy the humor. I would have never brought it up if you hadn't insisted you were not easily offended.

Edited by tesuji
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9 minutes ago, Aish HaTorah said:

Do you (and other Mormons) believe that Jews represent all of the twelve tribes? "

To answer this question I will also need to also *take a deep breath*

You have heard many here on the forum talk about an affinity they feel toward the Jewish people... There is a very simple reason for this.  When the tribes got lost and scattered (lost to all but G-d that is) they got mixed in mingled with the non Israelite population.

We believe that G-d has set in motion the restoration of the lost tribes.  That members of the LDS faith (and their conversion efforts) are how the tribes are being gathered.  Just about every member of the LDS faith has had a patriarchal blessing in which it is revealed which tribe they are a part of.

Of course we have what our prophets and our scriptures tell us this means..  But part of being lost is that we don't have the heritage and the knowledge that that those that didn't get lost have.  Which is part of what prompted my question.

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11 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

To answer this question I will also need to also *take a deep breath*

You have heard many here on the forum talk about an affinity they feel toward the Jewish people... There is a very simple reason for this.  When the tribes got lost and scattered (lost to all but G-d that is) they got mixed in mingled with the non Israelite population.

We believe that G-d has set in motion the restoration of the lost tribes.  That members of the LDS faith (and their conversion efforts) are how the tribes are being gathered.  Just about every member of the LDS faith has had a patriarchal blessing in which it is revealed which tribe they are a part of.

Of course we have what our prophets and our scriptures tell us this means..  But part of being lost is that we don't have the heritage and the knowledge that that those that didn't get lost have.  Which is part of what prompted my question.

May I ask IF this is considered a priority to you, and, if so WHY?  This is all very instructive, thank you.

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10 minutes ago, Aish HaTorah said:

May I ask IF this is considered a priority to you, and, if so WHY?  This is all very instructive, thank you.

A priority in the sense of am I going to stop doing what I think and know I should be doing to pursue it?  No.

A priority in the sense of learning more is generally good? Yes.

We as a church do promote genealogy and family history and learning more about where we came from... And Israel is one of the most famous families and G-d has (and presumably) will continue to interact with it.  Learning more about this is a good thing

 

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22 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

To answer this question I will also need to also *take a deep breath*

You have heard many here on the forum talk about an affinity they feel toward the Jewish people... There is a very simple reason for this.  When the tribes got lost and scattered (lost to all but G-d that is) they got mixed in mingled with the non Israelite population.

We believe that G-d has set in motion the restoration of the lost tribes.  That members of the LDS faith (and their conversion efforts) are how the tribes are being gathered.  Just about every member of the LDS faith has had a patriarchal blessing in which it is revealed which tribe they are a part of.

Of course we have what our prophets and our scriptures tell us this means..  But part of being lost is that we don't have the heritage and the knowledge that that those that didn't get lost have.  Which is part of what prompted my question.

I would be interested in having a discussion about what is the actual official church doctrine about this. Are Mormons descended from Israel, literally? There is also the concept of adoption into the chosen lineage of Israel, which I believe is supposed to happen at baptism.

I'd look this up but contrary to apperances I'm supposed to be working at home at the moment.

And, to Aish and any other Jewish visitors, I realize our doctrine about all this might be odd to you...

Edited by tesuji
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12 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

A priority in the sense of am I going to stop doing what I think and know I should be doing to pursue it?  No.

A priority in the sense of learning more is generally good? Yes.

We as a church do promote genealogy and family history and learning more about where we came from... And Israel is one of the most famous families and G-d has (and presumably) will continue to interact with it.  Learning more about this is a good thing

 

I meant a priority on the part of LDS to gather the tribes.  Is that what you meant?  Now I am confusing myself.  :)  Sorry about that.

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14 minutes ago, tesuji said:

I would be interested in having a discussion about what is the actual official church doctrine about this. Are Mormons descended from Israel, literally? There is also the concept of adoption into the chosen lineage of Israel, which I believe is supposed to happen at baptism.

I'd look this up but contrary to apperances I'm supposed to be working at home at the moment.

And, to Aish and any other Jewish visitors, I realize our doctrine about all this might be odd to you...

I don't know if odd is the right word.  Well, perhaps it is.  :)  I guess I am just trying to understand why the fascination about us.  It's a bit flattering, really.  Is this the case with other Christian goyim as well?

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9 minutes ago, Aish HaTorah said:

I meant a priority on the part of LDS to gather the tribes.  Is that what you meant?  Now I am confusing myself.  :)  Sorry about that.

Oh... my bad... I took it as you asking about if it was a personal priority to understand more about roles of the tribes.

Gathering of the tribes we call missionary work and falls as one of the main "Missions" of the church...  So yes it is very much a priority

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9 minutes ago, estradling75 said:

Oh... my bad... I took it as you asking about if it was a personal priority to understand more about roles of the tribes.

Gathering of the tribes we call missionary work and falls as one of the main "Missions" of the church...  So yes it is very much a priority

Why is this a main mission (gathering the tribes), as you say?  I am truly fascinated by this.  Most Jews couldn't care less.  The fewer goyim hanging around means more matzo ball soup for us!  :D

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