A Question On Tea

[CourtneyP]

I remember from the word of wisdom that tea and coffee and such are not permitted. I cannot remember the exact wording but it goes something like "hot drinks are not for the belly" or something like that.

My question is on this...

Is it just the caffeine that's a no-no or is it something else? And are herbal teas allowed as long as they are caffeine free?

The same goes for sodas. Can a person drink a caffeinated soda or not?

(As a side note, the caffeine thing is not an issue for me since I am allergic to it and avoid caffeine like the plague. But I am a bit of a decaffeinated tea addict. Same goes with herbal teas.)

[selek]

I remember from the word of wisdom that tea and coffee and such are not permitted. I cannot remember the exact wording but it goes something like "hot drinks are not for the belly" or something like that.

My question is on this...

Is it just the caffeine that's a no-no or is it something else? And are herbal teas allowed as long as they are caffeine free?

The same goes for sodas. Can a person drink a caffeinated soda or not?

(As a side note, the caffeine thing is not an issue for me since I am allergic to it and avoid caffeine like the plague. But I am a bit of a decaffeinated tea addict. Same goes with herbal teas.)

If memory serves, clarification has come down from the leadership that tea and coffee specifically are forbidden, but that this is as much an obedience issue as one of health.

No specific guidance has specified that caffeine specifically is the issue (lest chocolate be forbidden as well).

I also understand that when referring to tea, the leadership has specified the actual tea (pekoe) leaf, which means herbal "teas" which do not contain pekoe are acceptable.

[ztodd]

Coffee and tea have multiple harmful ingredients in them. Caffeine is one, I've heard that tannic acid is another bad one.

Herbal tea is fine, as it is missing all of the harmful ingredients.

http://www.miyerbamate.com/content/Yerba_M...fee_and_tea.htm

[Canuck Mormon]

Maybe you should ask your Bishop. He would have a better understanding (usually).

As far as my choice, no tea, any tea.

[mnn727]

The prohibition has nothing to do with caffine, but with harmful substances. Caffine happens to cause my wife major problems, but it doesn't bother me as long as I am not drinking major quantites. If we go out to eat, I'll have an occasional diet coke.

[Moksha]

My doc recommends green tea or Coke with the fizz taken out for upset tummys.

[Lolgirl]

Well I don't know if you will have seen this but it's a biggy in South Africa.It's called Rooibos tea.Directly translated that redbush tea.

When we have tea we only drink that.It's purely herbal and has nothing to do with anything bad.It's a South African thing what can I say?

[mnn727]

Some people choose to limit caffine on their own due to their understanding of what caffine does to them personally OR due to their trying to live to what they believe the spirit of the Wow means to them personally, BUT:

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

There, I'm feeling much better now Seriously, if someone tries to tell you that "its caffine" or that "its tannin" or thats its something else --- know that they don't know what they are talking about.

The WoW is about obedience and the reward is good health.

[Shoofly]

Some people choose to limit caffine on their own due to their understanding of what caffine does to them personally OR due to their trying to live to what they believe the spirit of the Wow means to them personally, BUT:

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

There, I'm feeling much better now Seriously, if someone tries to tell you that "its caffine" or that "its tannin" or thats its something else --- know that they don't know what they are talking about.

The WoW is about obedience and the reward is good health.

I agree completely but why is it you cannot buy a soft drink with caffine on the BYU campus? Everything there is de-caff.

[ztodd]

Some people choose to limit caffine on their own due to their understanding of what caffine does to them personally OR due to their trying to live to what they believe the spirit of the Wow means to them personally, BUT:

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

Caffine is not prohibited by the WoW!

There, I'm feeling much better now Seriously, if someone tries to tell you that "its caffine" or that "its tannin" or thats its something else --- know that they don't know what they are talking about.

The WoW is about obedience and the reward is good health.

1. You spelled it wrong. It's Caffeine.

2. It's not stated in the WoW revelation in the D & C, but several church leaders have counseled us not to use caffeine. It's an addictive substance and not at all good for you. Marion G Romney of the first presidency in 1975 said "We know that cola drinks contain the drug caffeine. We know caffeine is not wholesome nor prudent for the use of our bodies. It is only sound judgment to conclude that cola drinks and any others that contain caffeine or other harmful ingredients should not be used." http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgne..._&hideNav=1

Edit: Oops, sorry, it wasn't Marion G Romney- my bad- it was H. Burke Peterson. and you're right carpeomnius, it's not mean as official doctrine.

Also, sorry for bringing up spelling errors, I shouldn't worry about doing that since it's not relevant to the subject.

[CourtneyP]

Caffeine is a dreadful drug for me. It causes migraines for me and I avoid it like the plague. It makes it difficult when going out for dinner sometimes in the lack of drink options that are caffeine free.

Whether the word of wisdom prohibits caffeine or not, I won't drink it. Evil stuff, really.

I still plan to ask the bishop about the herbal tea option when I go to church tomorrow.

[mnn727]

I still plan to ask the bishop about the herbal tea option when I go to church tomorrow.

Herbal Tea's are sold in the cafeteria's of Temples

[mnn727]

1. You spelled it wrong. It's Caffeine.

2. It's not stated in the WoW revelation in the D & C

You could have ended it right there. Caffeine is not a harmful substance in moderate amounts for most people. I personally only drink it when we go out and the only real choice I have is between water and diet coke. My wife must avoid it completly, however its NOT against the WoW and yes I am aware of 'letter of the law' verses 'spirit of the law' arguments -- frankly the sugar content of regular Sprite or 7-Up (both decaf soda's) is much more harmful than the caffeine in a Diet Coke.

How are you at not eating meat except in times of famine or cold? Personally I'm pretty lousy at it, but then so are most Mormons, even those that claim they are following the WoW.

[carpeomnius]

1. You spelled it wrong. It's Caffeine.

2. It's not stated in the WoW revelation in the D & C, but several church leaders have counseled us not to use caffeine. It's an addictive substance and not at all good for you. Marion G Romney of the first presidency in 1975 said "We know that cola drinks contain the drug caffeine. We know caffeine is not wholesome nor prudent for the use of our bodies. It is only sound judgment to conclude that cola drinks and any others that contain caffeine or other harmful ingredients should not be used." http://www.lds.org/ldsorg/v/index.jsp?vgne..._&hideNav=1

Thanks for providing the URL because I found that you made an error. Marion G. Romney did not make that statement. H. Burke Peterson made that statement. (H. Burke Peterson, “Q&A: Questions and Answers,” New Era, Oct. 1975, 36–37). It should be noted that "Answers" are for help and perspective, not as pronouncements of Church doctrine.

The Church has taken no stand against any substances containing caffeine other than coffee and tea. As Elder Bruce R. McConkie wrote about the Word of Wisdom, “Some people become cranks. … There is no prohibition in Section 89 as to the eating of white sugar, cocoa, chocolate, … or anything else except items classified under tea, coffee, tobacco and liquor. If some particular food disagrees with an individual, then that person should act accordingly without reference to the prohibitions in this particular law of health.” (McConkie, 1966, pp. 845–56.)

[Guest prnldsfrms]

We simply do not know why coffee and tea and alcohol are banned (and illegal substances in todays world). And it doesn't include herbal teas. There are areas of the world where other teas are common, and local leaders have identify some as violations and not others.

I quit drinking caffeinated sodas (except medicinally when I have to pull an allnighter), when I hear Pres. Hinckley say in response to Larry King's question about soda, that of course mormons didn't drink caffeinated drinks. Not exactly a pronouncement of doctrine, but clearly what the prophet though was a no brainer.

[DrewM]

Is it just the caffeine that's a no-no or is it something else? And are herbal teas allowed as long as they are caffeine free?

The same goes for sodas. Can a person drink a caffeinated soda or not?

Caffeine is not an issue officially with the church. As a matter of fact, almost all of the members of the church in Paraguay, Argentina, Uruguay and some in Chile and Brazil drink "yerba mate" which contains caffeine. Anyone who tells you otherwise [ie. that caffeine is prohibited by the word of wisdom] is probably straining at a gnat and swallowing a camel, in my opinion.

The following story may be helpful:

During intermission at a theatrical presentation, his [Pres. McKay's] host offered to get refreshments: "His hearing wasn't very good, and I got right down in front of him and I said, 'President McKay, what would you like to drink? All of our cups say Coca Cola on them because of our arrangement with Coca Cola Bottling, but we have root beer and we have orange and we have Seven-up. What would you like to drink?' And he said 'I don't care what it says on the cup, as long as there is a Coke in the cup.'" McKay's point was simple and refreshing: Don't get hung up on the letter of the law to the point where you squeeze all the spirit out of life. (David O. McKay and the Rise of Modern Mormonism, 23)

Does caffeine violate the spirit of the word of wisdom? Probably so, if we're looking to live it perfectly and strictly. But so does chocolate, eating meat in times other than famine or winter, eating food out of season, over eating, etc. It's hypocrisy, in my opinion, to avoid caffeine while you're at McDonald's eating your 1/2 burger when the WoW actually says something about meat but nothing about caffeine. If you're not living what it already says strictly, why start adding other things to it?

My views, however, are probably controversial, but you asked. :)

[DrewM]

I agree completely but why is it you cannot buy a soft drink with caffine on the BYU campus? Everything there is de-caff.

Because the Church doesn't want to offend the self-righteous bigots who believe caffeine is evil. That's why. Some people come up with their own version of the gospel and then when the church isn't teaching it they start to think the church is in apostasy (when really it's them!).

You can get guarana on BYU campus, and it does have caffeine. Why? Because the Church doesn't want to offend the Brazilians who think guarana is part of the gospel. :)

[ztodd]

Thanks for providing the URL because I found that you made an error. Marion G. Romney did not make that statement. H. Burke Peterson made that statement. (H. Burke Peterson, “Q&A: Questions and Answers,” New Era, Oct. 1975, 36–37). It should be noted that "Answers" are for help and perspective, not as pronouncements of Church doctrine.

The Church has taken no stand against any substances containing caffeine other than coffee and tea. As Elder Bruce R. McConkie wrote about the Word of Wisdom, “Some people become cranks. … There is no prohibition in Section 89 as to the eating of white sugar, cocoa, chocolate, … or anything else except items classified under tea, coffee, tobacco and liquor. If some particular food disagrees with an individual, then that person should act accordingly without reference to the prohibitions in this particular law of health.” (McConkie, 1966, pp. 845–56.)

Oops, sorry, it wasn't Marion G Romney- my bad- it was H. Burke Peterson. and you're right, it's not meant as official doctrine.

I've learned something from this thread.. and I agree that there are probably bigger things to worry about concerning the word of wisdom. It's just my own view based on what I've learned that caffeine is pretty bad for you, so I believe a person can go their whole life just fine without it.

I personally have no problem cutting anything out of my diet- my wife's a vegetarian and I had no trouble switching my diet to eating what she's willing to cook for me. :) I still have meat probably at least once a week tho, either when we go out or eat at our parents - I should probably cut back more on it, but it can be hard to find protein otherwise. We do eat lots of eggs though. Sorry, I've digressed..

[Connolly]

Green tea is often promoted as having healthy benefits for the drinker. This is contrary to actual facts and the US FDA has taken formal exception to some of the claims made by green tea sellers. One thing that many people are not aware of is that green tea and black tea are both made from leaves of the same plant. The difference is that the tea leaves are dried very slowly for black tea so that the leaf oxidizes and darkens (much the same way a piece of fruit darkens because it oxidizes) while the leaves are quick dried for green tea.

[Moksha]

Because the Church doesn't want to offend the self-righteous bigots who believe caffeine is evil. That's why. Some people come up with their own version of the gospel and then when the church isn't teaching it they start to think the church is in apostasy (when really it's them!).

Still, wouldn't you rather have them focusing their efforts at BYU on this, than sinking their teeth into something else, like doctrinal purity?

[Guest AutumnBreez]

http://www.widomaker.com/~jnavia/tannins/tannexpl.htm

This was a link someone sent to me on Tannins. This is only for health reasons that I post this. It is interesting.

For me personally:

I do not take drugs, only by prescription. I don't ingest liquid drugs, ie, coffee, and sodas that contain them.

I used to drink them alot, but since I have come back to God's Church a couple of months ago, I stopped drinking them.

When I was in the church prior 12 years ago, I did not drink them either. For me personally, I feel spiritually better for not drinking them at all. Can not explain, a addictive side of me wants to drink a Dr. Pepper, not because of caffeine but the taste. I liked it. Same with coffee, cream, and sugar. I loved it. However, I did decide that I was going to follow the commandments and also the small voices that keep me from temptation. I want to improve myself, I want to have discipline in myself. This is how I learn.

It is a small token to quit these devices, funny how I could not seem to control the urges then without Him, now with Him in my life I can. If that is part of it, I accept.

Simple little testimonies that add up.

Again all a personal spiritual choice.

[DrewM]

Still, wouldn't you rather have them focusing their efforts at BYU on this, than sinking their teeth into something else, like doctrinal purity?

I don't think the church really cares what people think about caffeine either way. However, they sure don't want to offend anyone they don't have to offend. Thus the policy.

[Still_Small_Voice]

I find in my own life as I follow the Word of Wisdom more and more that it brings physical strength and other spiritual blessings. We often think about the don't commandments in the Lord's Law of Health. But what about the do commandments: Cleanliness, rest, and exercise are important.

"A latter-day prophet has told us that people “should learn to keep their bodies healthy by right living, … by inhaling pure air, taking plenty of exercise, and bathing … often in fresh water” (Joseph F. Smith, Gospel Principles Chapter 29)

"Fruits, vegetables, and wholesome herbs are good for us. We should use them with wisdom and thanksgiving." (Gospel Principles Chapter 29)