Becoming Gods? Is this true?

[Hemidakota]

I assume that joint-heir = equal to because YOU say so.

Do you have anything more to support your contention other than you want it to be that way?

That is a correct statement. Search out the Church archives on past conference talk.

[rameumptom]

Why? Because some teachings the Church teach are just plain wrong.

For example the whole thing about blacks not holding the preiesthood till '78. That was due to racist reasons. I even have read sayings from past Church leaders to that end.

Yet no one here will accept my words.

In the end if others believed what I do my world would be better off.

We don't know all the reasons for the ban. Racism may have been a part of it. But it is 20 years in the past, and it is time to move forward. Today, blacks do hold the priesthood and are in positions of leadership. We have a black bishop in our stake here in Indianapolis, for example. Great guy.

We are working hard to integrate. All of the congregations are geographical, so we are basically integrated. That isn't true of other Christian churches, where especially in the South, they are still segregated into white Baptist churches and black Baptist churches. Don't forget, the Baptist church split over the issue of slavery, creating the Southern Baptists over a century ago, who propagated the idea of blacks being subhuman and supposed to be slaves. Brigham Young came from that culture and promoted it in his reading and understanding of LDS scripture.

But we've moved beyond that belief. We don't have to hold ourselves hostage to the past. We can forgive the ignorance and culture of the past and move on, whether we are Mormon or Baptist or whatever.

If we can't forgive such issues, then we have a major Biblical problem. Moses forbid marriages with people outside of Israel. And Jesus kept the gospel from others outside of Israel. He told his apostles to preach only to the house of Israel and not to the Gentiles. A Canaanite woman asked Jesus to heal her daughter, and he said that the dogs do not eat from the Master's table. "Dog" is one of the biggest insults in Middle Eastern countries. So, when it comes to racism or ethnic prejudice, we need to be careful where we go with it, as it could just as easily indict our Savior on racist charges, simply because we do not know the reason why he did not send the gospel to the Gentiles until years after his death and resurrection (Peter and Cornelius in the Book of Acts). And until God reveals to us his actual reasons (if any) that he commanded or allowed the priesthood ban, perhaps we should look forward and not backward.

Are the prophets perfect? Of course not. They never have claimed to be. What they have claimed is that they are witnesses of the resurrected Jesus Christ, and hold the keys and authority necessary to perform the ordinances necessary for salvation and exaltation.

In the end, it isn't whether the world believes as you do. That was a rather ego-centric statement you made, by the way. What is actually important is whether we believe the way God does. For if we wish to live with him , we have to be and think like him. You can either reject the entire gospel for a few past human flaws, or you can go to the Lord and ask God what is HIS will, and then do it.

As it is, if you are living with your girlfriend, you are already living a lifestyle that is readily rejected in the Bible as sinful and wrong. Perhaps your indecision is due to your desires to live in the world. It is often too easy to blame our rejection of the gospel on side issues, such as the priesthood ban - and this is rather silly, given it ended 20 years ago, and many blacks don't have a problem with it (at least not anymore). Gladys Knight and her daughters recognized the truthfulness of the gospel and embraced it. They didn't let past issues cloud the key issue: is this the Lord's Church and does he want me to follow the living prophets of God?

Given that the Spirit has whispered to your heart that the Book of Mormon is true, you would be wise to listen to it. To ignore it or reject it is to choose the world over Christ. Your decision to make, but you really need to look at spiritual reality and not allow selfish worldly desires make the decision for you.

[rameumptom]

Yeah, judgement, what a buzzkill. What ever happened to the world where everyone could do anything they want with no consequences for our actions?

Isn't that the world that Lucifer offered us in Moses 4:1-4?

[rameumptom]

Well the Mormon rules are a bit different than the typical Church. I grew up in the Church Of Christ. We didn't have to give 10% of our income. We didn't believe in adding onto the Bible. Everyone had the sacrament. We believed Jesus died for our sins. We didn't do anything Temple related nor did we believe in modern day prophets. Heck I still don't truly believe Joseph Smith was a prophet.

Later on I attended Vineyard. We used drums and other musical instruments. As at my old Church there was no need to give more than you wanted to the Church. People spoke in tongues and others translated for all to hear.

And by the way a man cannot become as God is. To say so is sinful.

The Church of Christ was founded in the mid-1800s by a group of men that included Alexander Campbell. In the 1830s, Campbell had a Reformed Baptist movement in Kirtland, Ohio. His pastors included Sidney Rigdon and Parley P. Pratt. Their teachings included a belief that God would restore the primitive Church with baptism by immersion, apostolic authority, miracles and revelation.

Pratt preached in the East, where he encountered the Book of Mormon. He read it nonstop until he had finished it in just a couple days. He recognized that Joseph Smith had restored the primitive Church. After baptism, he and Oliver Cowdery were sent on a mission to the borders of the Indian territory. They stopped in Kirtland, and ended up converting the vast majority of the Reformed Baptists there.

Campbell did not join the LDS Church, as Joseph Smith would not guarantee him a position of power in exchange for his conversion. Joseph told him that the priesthood was not for sale, somewhat reminiscent of Simon Magus attempting to buy the power from Peter (Acts 8:18). Campbell was angered and eventually left the area.

His new creation, the Church of Christ, was extremely different than the Campbellites. No longer was he seeking the primitive Church with its miracles and apostles, but a Church with no modern spiritual gifts. He absolutely closed his mind on such things, due to the experience he'd had in losing his people to the Mormon Prophet.

As for tithes, it is found in the Old and New Testaments. Prophets are found throughout the Bible, and Amos 3:7 tells us that God only reveals his secrets through prophets. Revelation tells us there will be prophets in the last days, at least during the battle of Armageddon. And Rev 19:10 tells us that the "testimony of Jesus Christ is the spirit of prophecy."

Temples are just a modern holy space wherein man can worship God and prepare to see his face. For Adam, it was the Garden of Eden. Jacob saw God in the wilderness. Moses had Mt Sinai. Temples came about to create a holy space within a civilized area.

The early scriptural writings included dozens of books we now do not have in our Bible. The Essenes included many books that could easily have been in their version of the Bible. Early Christians accepted the Book of Enoch, Odes of Solomon and the Shepherd of Hermas as holy writ. In fact, Enoch is quoted almost 40 times in the New Testament, so his writings were considered valid by the early apostles, as well.

Clearly, the primitive Church was very different than Campbell's Church of Christ.

[kona0197]

As it is, if you are living with your girlfriend, you are already living a lifestyle that is readily rejected in the Bible as sinful and wrong. Perhaps your indecision is due to your desires to live in the world. It is often too easy to blame our rejection of the gospel on side issues, such as the priesthood ban - and this is rather silly, given it ended 20 years ago, and many blacks don't have a problem with it (at least not anymore). Gladys Knight and her daughters recognized the truthfulness of the gospel and embraced it. They didn't let past issues cloud the key issue: is this the Lord's Church and does he want me to follow the living prophets of God?

In the eyes of God I'm pretty sure we are married. They didn't have a marriage license in the old days I fail to see why we need one now. Other than becoming members of course.

I don't reject the Gospel itself I reject the way the Church would have us lose a chunk of our income and in the end have us living under a bridge just to be members.

Not every one has a job good enough to support a family.

[rameumptom]

God has given laws. They aren't put in place for us to then find exceptions. Only he can give an exception. You will have to choose what is more important, your testimony of the Book of Mormon or the social security check.

My wife and I have lived just fine for 22 years on a small income - none of it social security. I don't see why others cannot do it also.

[kona0197]

Define small income. You probably lived on more than 800 dollars (or less) a month. And by the way my girlfriend is disabled. She can not work. Should we lose the Social Security money we would be living off of 500 to 600 dollars a month. Rent is around 500 dollars up here. You do the math.

In the end I'll end up going to a Church that will not request us to lose income to be baptized.

[john doe]

I know this sounds really simplistic, but you could try to better yourself. It would do your self-esteem loads of good too.

[kona0197]

In what fashion?

[WillowTheWhisp]

Would you be happy to marry if you had a larger income?

[kona0197]

Not really. At this point I just want to get married without losing any income.

[ztodd]

Hi Kona, how are you?

What if you made 10,000 per month? Then would you get married? Would you then be willing to pay 10% for tithing and keep all the other commandments revealed to the church? How's your testimony of the restoration?

[kona0197]

Hi Kona, how are you?

I'm doing OK I guess.

What if you made 10,000 per month?

If that was after taxes I would love that!

Then would you get married?

YES!!

Would you then be willing to pay 10% for tithing and keep all the other commandments revealed to the church?

Yes I would.

How's your testimony of the restoration?

It grows everyday. It's getting stronger.

[WillowTheWhisp]

Kona, we just gotta get you a higher paid job! :)

[kona0197]

Good luck with that. I need a home first.

[Teancum18]

I hope you'll forgive me for saying that Christians won't accept this line of thinking as representative of Christian theology.

There's nothing to forgive man. Having said that, thank you for your diplomacy. This is hard man. A lot of our doctrine is deep, intricate, and for all intents and purposes, unexplainable other than by faith.

You have expressed quite a bit that you can't accept some of these beliefs. So I have two things to say to that:

1) Good for you for still trying to understand a deeper knowledge of our doctrine.

2) My friend, that is exactly why you are here on this earth. To decide what you will and wont believe. To decide how you will live your life.

While I add my testimony that this particular doctrine is true, I for one am totally ok with you not believing it or accepting it.

I heard this quote in my 12th grade English class: "Shoot for the moon. If you miss, you'll land among the stars."

If we are wrong, we're only bettering ourselves by striving for it anyway. :)

[ztodd]

I'm doing OK I guess.

If that was after taxes I would love that!

YES!!

Yes I would.

It grows everyday. It's getting stronger.

You're awesome.

Yeah I would love to make that much too.

Keep striving - you'll make it. I pray it will be soon for you.

[Hemidakota]

What choices we make here will eventually effect our eternal life.

[Teancum18]

What choices we make here will eventually effect our eternal life.

That is precisely my point.

[Guest Topspin]

I could smash this Malachi's christian beliefs up into a thousand little pieces with what I know with just one single sentence of penetrating truth that he can't deny. But that would go against 'building bridges of faith and understanding between different religions....'

[VisionOfLehi]

Why would you even bother posting that? In the future, please refrain from joining the conversations if you can't actually add anything to them.

We welcome posters of all beliefs and levels of understanding, but we ask the to contribute.

[rise]

The church has always taught you can become a God.

[VisionOfLehi]

No, I've always been taught you can become a god.

[Pa Pa]

Hi:

I read on a website that it's a Mormon belief that you can become Gods and Goddesses.

And that you will have children after you die.

And that your children will later become Gods too...if they take on physical bodies.

Are they making that up about LDS beliefs?

What our scripture says is... "Ye shall be "gods" (note little "g") because ye have no end". I think people just run away with this scripture...it seems to suggest immortality. Which immortal beings are "gods".

[WillowTheWhisp]

The church has always taught you can become a God.

No, I've always been taught you can become a god.

How can you discern an upper or lower case G when someone is speaking?