Word of Wisdom question

[fiona84]

Well, I'm not sure what to think lol.

Thanks for all of your replies and all of the food for thought!

Bookmeister, I appreciate what you said about dependency. That is something that makes sense!

However, I don't buy that the WoW exists just for us to be obedient. There isn't really logic behind that. I don't see Heavenly Father prohibiting things just to test our obedience. Especially things that are good for us (green tea *ahem*). And if it was soley to give us a health code, then as was pointed out earlier, fried foods and junk food would be banned.

And in any case, I am reminded of something I heard in a sacrament talk. It went something like- "A church leader was giving a talk and said ' Today as I was reading the newspaper over my morning coffee, i saw that 10 thousand members go inactive every year.' And as the sea of shocked faces gazed up him, he said 'Are you more appalled by the fact that I said I had a cup of coffee or by the thousands of members going inactive? Things need to be put in perspective.'"

[VisionOfLehi]

Well, I'm not sure what to think lol.

Thanks for all of your replies and all of the food for thought!

Bookmeister, I appreciate what you said about dependency. That is something that makes sense!

However, I don't buy that the WoW exists just for us to be obedient. There isn't really logic behind that. I don't see Heavenly Father prohibiting things just to test our obedience. Especially things that are good for us (green tea *ahem*). And if it was soley to give us a health code, then as was pointed out earlier, fried foods and junk food would be banned.

And in any case, I am reminded of something I heard in a sacrament talk. It went something like- "A church leader was giving a talk and said ' Today as I was reading the newspaper over my morning coffee, i saw that 10 thousand members go inactive every year.' And as the sea of shocked faces gazed up him, he said 'Are you more appalled by the fact that I said I had a cup of coffee or by the thousands of members going inactive? Things need to be put in perspective.'"

It's an obedience thing, yes. There's promises in the Word of Wisdom. Obey the WoW, get the promised blessings.

Science and Man can come up with a bunch of reasons why they're bad, but we don't know EVERYTHING, and there could be plenty of reasons that we don't know about.

Did they think about addiction and caffeine and carcinogen when the Word of Wisdom first came out? No. It was obedience.

Edit: Also, I love that quote. Sounds like a good talk.

Edit2: Also, red wine has "health benefits," too. HMM!

[Vanhin]

Well, I'm not sure what to think lol.

Thanks for all of your replies and all of the food for thought!

Bookmeister, I appreciate what you said about dependency. That is something that makes sense!

However, I don't buy that the WoW exists just for us to be obedient. There isn't really logic behind that. I don't see Heavenly Father prohibiting things just to test our obedience.

Well, that's not exactly what I'm saying. I wasn't referring to the reason the WoW existed. The reason for the WoW is plainly manifested in scripture:

In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days... (D&C 89:4)

What I was talking about was the reason we should live the WoW. It has nothing to do with why those substances are harmful to us. The reason we should live the WoW is to be obedient. In order for someone to be obedient to God's commandments, it's not necessary for them to know why God has commanded it. Take Adam, for example, who was commanded to offer the firstling of his flocks as a sacrifice:

And after many days an angel of the Lord appeared unto Adam, saying: Why dost thou offer sacrifices unto the Lord? And Adam said unto him: I know not, save the Lord commanded me. (Moses 5:6)

We learn after this that there was a reason for the commandment, and the angel taught Adam the reason, but Adam did not need to know the reason to be obedient.

Especially things that are good for us (green tea *ahem*). And if it was soley to give us a health code, then as was pointed out earlier, fried foods and junk food would be banned.

The thing is, the WoW prohibits the consumption of tea (Camellia sinensis). Green tea is the same plant as black tea. I'm not sure how someone can justify drinking it because we don't have any specifics from the Church as to why we can't drink tea to begin with. So, if we don't have specifics (like it's the caffeine, or it's this, or that) how do we know that green tea is ok to drink?

All we know is that we can't drink tea, and green tea is tea, so we can't drink green tea. Simple as that. And, just like the Saints originally, we may not see (or know) what is harmful in tea, coffee, and tobacco. But God knows. So, until we know we should simply obey. Makes logical sense to me.

I do believe there is wisdom in the WoW, and I'm pretty confident that at some point we will know all the reasons why God did not want us to partake of those substances, but it's not necessary for us to know in order to be obedient was my point. :)

Regards,

Vanhin

[peanutgallery]

Well, that's not exactly what I'm saying. I wasn't referring to the reason the WoW existed. The reason for the WoW is plainly manifested in scripture:

In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days... (D&C 89:4)

What I was talking about was the reason we should live the WoW. It has nothing to do with why those substances are harmful to us. The reason we should live the WoW is to be obedient. In order for someone to be obedient to God's commandments, it's not necessary for them to know why God has commanded it. Take Adam, for example, who was commanded to offer the firstling of his flocks as a sacrifice:

And after many days an angel of the Lord appeared unto Adam, saying: Why dost thou offer sacrifices unto the Lord? And Adam said unto him: I know not, save the Lord commanded me. (Moses 5:6)

We learn after this that there was a reason for the commandment, and the angel taught Adam the reason, but Adam did not need to know the reason to be obedient.

The thing is, the WoW prohibits the consumption of tea (Camellia sinensis). Green tea is the same plant as black tea. I'm not sure how someone can justify drinking it because we don't have any specifics from the Church as to why we can't drink tea to begin with. So, if we don't have specifics (like it's the caffeine, or it's this, or that) how do we know that green tea is ok to drink?

All we know is that we can't drink tea, and green tea is tea, so we can't drink green tea. Simple as that. And, just like the Saints originally, we may not see (or know) what is harmful in tea, coffee, and tobacco. But God knows. So, until we know we should simply obey. Makes logical sense to me.

I do believe there is wisdom in the WoW, and I'm pretty confident that at some point we will know all the reasons why God did not want us to partake of those substances, but it's not necessary for us to know in order to be obedient was my point. :)

Regards,

Vanhin

ITA. Very well said. I will add that I have noticed in recent years more people looking for reasons to justify something they want to do rather than looking to avoid anything that could possibly be disobedient. Not just regarding the WoW, but all commandments.

[Maureen]

VisionOfLehi said:

Edit2: Also, red wine has "health benefits," too. HMM!

Health Benefits of Red Wines: One to Two Glasses a DayPlato may have been wiser than he knew when he said, "Nothing more excellent or valuable than wine was ever granted by the Gods to man." Those of us who have come to enjoy the variety and tastes that wine have to offer can now look to red wines for greater health benefits. Recent studies show that drinking one glass of red wine every day may have certain health benefits. Research indicates that moderate red wine consumption may help protect against certain cancers and heart disease, and can have a positive effect on cholesterol levels and blood pressure.Health Benefits of Red Wines: One to Two Glasses a Day

[JohnBirchSociety]

Here is what I've figured out: Pepsi is for those who think young because of its slightly sweeter taste. It is good when you are feeling frivolous. You need more than a modicum of frivolous for good mental health.

For more serious or mature Mormons, Coke is the real thing.

For those who just want a buzz, without that wonderful cola taste, Mountain Dew fits the bill.

Green tea appears to be a health food. Still, you know what they say....

Hope this experiential research helps.

As long as you realize that Dr. Pepper is the ellixer of the "Gods"....

[Vanhin]

If you want the health benefits of red wine, drink grape juice.

Grape juice: Same heart benefits as wine? - MayoClinic.com

I like this quote from another article:

One drawback for wine may be that you may not be getting enough. “Wine only prevents blood from clotting [when it is consumed] at levels high enough to declare someone legally drunk,” states Jane Freedman, M.D., a researcher at Georgetown University. “With grape juice, you can drink enough to get the benefit without worrying about becoming intoxicated.”

Another drawback to wine consumption is that alcohol actually generates free radicals, increasing free radical damage caused in the body. Alcohol may also increase the breakdown rate of antioxidants in your body. A study conducted at the University of California, Davis, reported that volunteers who drank grape juice versus those that drank wine enjoyed longer antioxidant protection. (Wine vs. Juice)

:)

Regards,

Vanhin

[Moksha]

I think we're commanded not to drink coffee because it smells and tastes horrible.

My daughter and I always take delight in lingering by the coffee beans to enjoy the smell in the grocery store. We had a bit of a mishap a while back though, when she opened one of the bins thinking it would let more of the smell out. It did, along with the beans.

She knows better now that she has bean there and done that.