aj4u

I guess that is a NO to the question.

What covenant is that?

That explains it. It must be all 4! Abducted by Aliens:eek: Can we get him back????

What happen to Justice. We were in the middle of a discussion and he disappeared?

Are interested in their doctrine or in being a LDS?

I thought you told me, oh, never mind. I know that you are required to give 10% that what tithe means, but all I am saying is I don't see any support for it in the NT. Mainstream Christianity would get on my case about this too. It is just my observation. I could be wrong. I would rather make my own interpretive mistakes than someone else's.

I am sorry, but it wouldn't do any good to describe Him to you. You will have to experience a personal relationship with Him for yourself. It would be like trying to describe what a chocolate covered strawberry looks and taste like to someone who has never seen or tasted it.

It does mention tithing, but it doesn't teach it or mandate it nor mention that it is a precursor to anything eternal if you read it in context. However, there is nothing wrong with doing it as long as you don't bind it on those who are free from the law, but why stop at just 10%?

Sounds like a lot more than rising water

But I already know the Savior personally! In fact, He is in heart now! He said, "Behold I stand at the door and knock if any man hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and sup with him and he with me." Rev 3:10 I heard him knocking, and I opened the door to let him in. If you hear him knock, you can do the same as I.

I'm sorry but the Scriptures you gave me does not teach or mandate tithing, and the only mention of actually doing it was in Luke and Matt. when Jesus called the religious leaders on their hypocrisy of how careful they follow the OT laws, and Jesus tells them you tithe and mint, these things you should do but not leave the other parts of the law undone, and Abraham tithing in Hebrews to the big M, but even in these scenarios, tithing wasn't being taught or mandated in the NT. Jesus did, however, teach forsaking all to follow Him. I have experienced doing that. I have learned we need to do that on a daily basis to be Christ's disciples. Tithing is simply not taught in the NT plan and simple.

That is not true, and it is true that we need to use our gifts. It is written, "The gifts of God are without repentance." As far as your commentary on power to become the sons of God, I see a maze of semantics that may not take us in the right direction. Some religions believe that we are already sons of God, and God gives power to continue to be sons. I don't believe that because we are not all children of God some people are of their father the devil. All people on earth are God's creation, but not all are sons of God. I believe that once we truly accept and surrender to Jesus we are sons, and God from then on deals with us as sons. Can you please answer my yes or no question on the other post? By the way, I did review post #53 and commented on it

That sounds reasonable to me. May I ask what is your religious persuasion?

That was an incomplete and inaccurate definition of grace. Grace is also God's unmerited favor! There is some truth to your definition, but I wouldn't trust that source. By the way, Justice, I think we can bring this to a head if you can answer one question. Do believe that Christ's death and shed blood on the cross is not sufficient to save us unless in addition to his death we work for salvation using our own strength and best efforts? Your answer to this question will clear everything up for me as to were we both stand. A yes or no response will do. Thanks AJ

I was not referring to the LDS church! Besides, neither did the group I was in force tithing. It was a volunteer thing. I said they manipulated us by telling us it was God's will. After a while they would hold back the latest prophet's word from us. They were manipulative through mind-control. I couldn't see it when I was in the group because I was in a subjective situation. When I got out (thank God) I could see objectively for who they really were and what they were doing. I do give my local church of my time and money cheerfully. Giving is a good thing, but not when we are told by people we are disobedient if we don't tithe. Besides, all I have belongs to the Lord anyway. He has made me His steward over it. Thanks for responding.

I thank you for your understanding. I am long over the hurt. I left in the mid seventies. When I was in COG, I was so sure David was the end-time prophet. At first, I doubted but a sister in the group showed me a verse that confirmed he was the latter-day prophet (so I thought). The verse was in the OT. It is where God said, "I will raise up my servant David in the latter days and you shall consider it" I knew it wasn't talking about King David. David Berg was Jewish so things really began to make sense. All of us in the group were forsaking everything going into the entire world to preach the gospel. It was like living out acts. I would tell Jehovah Witnesses who have been hurt by their cult experience losing their children because they couldn't take blood. I would tell them “I know you have been hurt by CT Russell the false prophet, but I can assure you that Moses David is the real deal. Come into his fold and be healed” He is the last day prophet. I left the group shortly after the Jim Jones incident! I have told ex- Jws that I had lost my aunt who wouldn't take blood. She was a JW too. Yes there are many modern day prophets and some may be true blue, but I will trust Jesus Christ and test every spirit to be sure it is of God!

What would make you think I don't respect your belief?

Sure thing and I am honored. I am a Christian. In my zeal for the Lord, I got caught into a cult for seven years. I forsook all for Jesus in this group including my things, money, car and even my family and friends to obey Luke 14:33 and Mark 16:15. I would not trade my experience for a million dollars, but I wouldn't pay a nickel to go through it again. I choose not to be bitter even though God has brought to me through profound disappointment for only wanting to serve Him. I choose to continue to trust Him. Let every man be a liar, but God's Word is True. Jesus is Truth to me. Our prophet Moses David gave us directives and mandates to tithe. We were also told that tithing is not giving, because it is money that belongs to God anyway. If we wanted to give sacrificially, we would have to go beyond a mere 10%. I have come to the conclusion that I will interpret Scripture with the help of the Holy Spirit for it is written: "You have no need that a man teach you" I have learned not to judge the Holy Scriptures by what man or prophet says but judge the man's teaching by what the Holy Scriptures say from the Bible! This step of faith I have taken has been better than a known path for me! I believe very much in giving, but I do it freely and with spontaneity. I am no longer manipulated or controlled to tithe or give by Moses David the false prophet or anyone else for that matter!

I was not aware of this mandate made to Mormons at the turn of the 20th century. This mandate is also made to the fundamental congregation of churches by many pastors, but according to the Scriptures in the Holy Bible, I believe it is unwarranted and cannot be backed up Scripturally speaking!

Tithing is something I have been doing for a long time. But as I study scripture, I think binding tithing on Christians that have been set free from the Mosaic law or any OT law by faith in or the law of Christ is a returning to that law which makes the law of Christ ineffective. I could be wrong, but there really is no mentioning of it to the New Testament Christians. No one is exhorted to do it, and no one is reproved for not doing it. Don't get me wrong, I think a Christian should give, but they should not be bound to do it. The only kind of giving that happened in the New Testament was spontaneous and of a free will. It is written,” Let every man give as he has purposed in his heart to give.” We are free to give 30, 40, 50 or 90% of our possessions. We should not be bound by any giving rules according to the way things were done in the NT church. But keep in mind, if we give sparingly, we reap sparingly and if we give generously we reap the same and so on. The point is, Christians should feel they have to do it. We have been set free by the Law of Christ.

I would tell him. He that abides in sin, is a servant to sin, and free from the laws or commands of Christ. But he that abides in Christ and puts to death the deeds of the flesh is a slave to righteousness, but he is free from the law of sin and death. NO, but he is off to a good start. Each day presents new battles. We must die daily to sin. Yes, he loves God by stopping and NO does not by being idle. He must receive Christ and repent, but he cannot repent in his own strength. It takes faith through God's grace! Then he has eternal life where he is growing daily by the washing, renewing and regeneration of the Holy Ghost. If he is in Christ he is a new creature every thing is new the old is passed away. The path of the just is as a shinning light. It shines more and more until the perfect day.------------------------------------------- When we accept the Lord, He gives us the power to become the sons of God. If we sin, it breaks our fellowship with Him, but we are still His child. God will chasten him if he doesn't repent soon enough because God is dealing with him as a son. When the unsaved sin, it keeps them from God altogether.

Don't confuse the gift of salvation with gifts and talents. The one thing we need to do with the gift of salvation is receive it. The Bible does says "Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" it doesn't say work for it. The spiritual gifts & talents are what God gives in different measures to each of us. We must be faithful stewards of what He has given us. Remember He said be faithfull servant not successfull servant! If you truly have faith, you will be doing works for God faithfully!

You haven't upset me, but I have gotten frustrated trying to explain. I had to go back and modify some things I said. Please read it again. Go through each post carefully because you're bringing up things that I am not saying. Find what is not making sense or show me the contradiction so I can explain. Please this is very important.

I won't put faith in myself, but I will put it in the Lord. We can be our own worst enemies

Ep2:8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Do you think the author of these verses was suggesting that in fear of boasting we do nothing? My whole point to you was: You cannot work for a gift! Not that we should do nothing! If anyone insists on working for their salvation, they won't be receiving it!