lattelady

I apologize if that's the impression you've gotten. That's not my intention at all.

Traveler, to answer your question: "Why would a person choose to have a tattoo if it did not communicate something to others that can't see it?" I guess there are quite a few reasons people get tattoos. The person I wanted to communicate "Freedom" to was myself. Freedom is a message that is for everyone, obviously; but my tattoo was about communicating "Freedom" to myself. Not "freedom to show off my tattoo," but freedom from alot of things that are personal to my experience. My choice to get a tattoo was to get something on my body that would be a forever-reminder to me--FOR ME. But I don't judge anyone who's desire to get a tattoo is to show it off (unless they're showing off a part of their body that would be inappropriate.

Thanks for the p.s.--that makes total sense. Thanks for taking the time to explain the Law of Consecration to me. I'd never heard of it before.

Thanks, Dravin, for your clarification and explanation of the verses from a Member point of view. I appreciate the answer to my question.

I know that just by watching my kids from birth up (and though biased, I believe I have great, well-behaved kids), man isn't by nature good. I didn't teach my kids to rebel, lie, steal, etc., but they figured that out on their own. When they were very small, and I would tell them "no no", to keep them safe from danger, they would look me in the eye, smile, and then disobey. I think it's in the heart of man, naturally, to defy authority and buck the rules--even as they pertain to God.

As messed up as our world already is, I do fear that it would be a beyond-scary free-for-all if we all realized this life was all there was. The whole "eat, drink, and be merry for tomorrow...we all die" thing. I would love to think that in and of myself, I would be a good person. But I know me all too well. Maxel, I too have struggled several times in my life with depression--even with suicidal thoughts. I know if it weren't for God, I would've sought an early end to my pain. But God gave me reason to hope that things could get better. And I thank Him that they did.

Maxel, thanks for your transparency. Actually, my husband and I said pretty much the same thing; if we knew this was all there was, we would hope to make some moral choices because we have children and we'd like them to grow up, be happy, be good citizens, etc. But at the end of the day, if there was no God, and this life was all there was, I'm afraid I would live for me and what makes me happy--and in the process I would self-destruct. Is that called hedonism? It was just a scary thought to realize who and what I'd be apart from God.

I saw, written on another post, something about the "law of consecration." Would someone be willing to explain what that is?

**This isn't meant to be a doctrinal debate. It's simply a thought-provoking question. My husband and I celebrated 14 years of marriage in August and we went out for a night without our kids and talked the night away. It was awesome to "mine the depths of each other's souls" uninterrupted. :) But we asked each other this question and it was so wierd to think of the outcome: HOW WOULD YOUR LIFE CHANGE/BE DIFFERENT FROM THE WAY IT IS NOW IF YOU KNEW THERE WAS NO AFTERLIFE? WOULD YOU BEHAVE DIFFERENTLY? IN WHAT WAYS?

WOW...it is shocking how different she looks, then and now--before and after! She aged well! with a great deal of help and money. Is it the Geico commercial she was on awhile ago where she makes fun of herself about her cosmetic surgery? I laugh every time I see it--she has a cool sense of humor about it (I'm sure she's been the brunt of MANY a joke).

If the LDS church owns the land, which they must, and if it meets the city's building codes, the people that are against it really won't have much of a leg to stand on. Churches have a right to build! Churches of all denominations fight opposition when they try and build in an area where people are against that particular denomination, and it's not right. That's America--we're supposed to have the freedom to go a worship where we please--but even in our country, others can strive to make it difficult to do so.

Bob, I wasn't really trying to argue a false dichotomy. FORMER doctrine seemed to indicate with clarity that it wasn't anything like "holy artificial insemination." It's this quote that I want to ask about : "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints proclaims that Jesus Christ is the Son of God in the most literal sense. The body in which He performed His mission in the flesh was sired by that same Holy being we worship as God, our Eternal Father. Jesus was not the son of Joseph, no, nor was he begotten by the Holy Ghost. He is the Son of the Eternal Father." (Teachings of Ezra Taft Benson, Reed A. Benson p.7) But I read in the Bible and also in the Book of Mormon that Jesus was conceived by the Holy Ghost. So I'm confused by the conflicted teachings. If you don't believe that God had physical relations with Mary (and I'm getting that very strong impression from most posters), but you DO believe that God impregnated her miraculously...do you make a separation between which personage of the Godhead actually caused her to become pregnant? Was it God the Father or the Holy Spirit, is what I mean. I realize my question has morphed a bit from the original question; I'm trying to balance what you're saying with what scripture is saying.

Pam, I'm sorry to hear about your dad--they're such a huge part of our lives. Sounds like you had an amazing father...thanks for sharing a little about him with me.

I worked with a guy about a year ago who is a member of the Church and came out about his homosexuality about a year ago. He isn't active in the Church right now (I know that in his situation it's his own choice); but I wondered what would be protocol in the church if he and his partner were to begin attending regularly. They wouldn't be banned, would they? Would their bishop confront them? How is that handled within the Church?

Pam, you said something about your dad and your hypothetical tattoo idea being one that had some aviation theme in his honor because he was a pilot. I think that's such a cool idea (hypothetically). :) Some of the neatest tattoos (to me) are the ones I've seen on the forearms and upper arms of elderly men who served in World War Two. The tattoo itself is really faded, but I love to hear the story behind it. Those are some of the bravest men I can think of... My husband's grandfather was a bomber pilot in WW2, and after the war he flew for PanAmerican Airlines for years. He passed away last year, but what a great man he was. Was your dad a commercial pilot?

An honest question: was this a thought from way back, like in the 1800's? Someone else mentioned Brigham Young's name--was he the prophet who spoke about it? Please: I'm not playing dumb, I know this concept about Elohim being the literal father of Jesus had a place at one time in church history. I just wanted to know when the thought originated and when the concept died down or was replaced. I'm slowly learning how progressive prophecy works in the LDS faith (I'm not saying I agree with it, but I think I'm understanding your beliefs about it--I'm not here to bash your faith!).

oh owwww!

Ah yes...the great Apostle Moses...:) j/k

Where have I quoted Brigham Young? Why are you questioning me? Do you realize that anyone can read books or the internet--books on LDS doctrine are not off limits to non-mombers. I've grown up around devout members all of my life and have very close LDS friends. I'm not speaking negatively about the Church. What is it that I'm doing that is bothering you?

"For someone who doesn't know much about what our Church teaches, you sure seem to know alot"-- I'm not sure why you're saying that. What I know about the LDS church comes from living in Utah for 25 years. As you can imagine, as a non-member, I've heard about MANY differing teachings. As many differing teachings as I've encountered on this forum, 25 years has provided a great deal more... Beefche, the reason I was asking that question was: it's interesting to hear what the majority of current LDS members believe on different doctrines. I have heard both teachings. As I've spent time in this forum, I've seen that current teaching trumps former teachings from former prophets. Now and then, I will run into people who choose to hang on to a former prophet's teaching. I just wondered what the common, most widely held belief was. I wasn't going to argue with you on what the most common belief was. I just wondered.

Thanks, EVERYBODY! I'm enjoying reading your posts!

Pain is right! I was told it was painful, but (much like with the labor of each of kids) had no idea how painful it was going to be...thankfully it was worth it to me. I wonder if anyone has ever had to quit part way through because they were in too much pain?--and then they never got their tattoo finished?

For those of you who don't have one and would never get one, if you were thinking hypothetically, what symbol would you WANT to tattoo on your body (what symbol would best represent YOU?)? I realize you'd never actually do it...we're just talking strictly hypothetical.

I saw a beautiful tattoo the other day at a baseball game on a woman's shoulder and arm--it was the branch of a cherry tree and it was blossoming--the artwork was so, so pretty. I don't always like the look of every tattoo I see, but this one was really elegant. Whoever did the work was an amazing artist. The colors and shading were so realistic. I wanted to ask the girl about it, but we had to find our seats because the game was starting.

I'm simply stating that I started a thread for the purpose of getting to know others and to hear about their creativity and why they made the personal choice to get a tattoo. Someone made what I perceived to be a negative comment about the fact that I started it; I asked others to help me keep it non-contentious. That was going well! There was no contention or judgement. Someone else then made a comment that would be considered judgmental by at least some of the people who have a tattoo on their lower back when they asked someone if their wife's tattoo was a trampstamp. Was that necessary? No. Was it kind? No. In the interest of having a thread that remains peaceable, could we simply continue letting others post about their decision to get a tattoo--what they chose and why? If I sounded in any way contentious, I apologize. I was just trying to express that it does hurt people's feelings to get mocked or discouraged from posting when they didn't really do anything wrong.