estradling75

If all you are going to do is insult and twist the meanings of people who are trying to have a discussion with you I see no point in continuing

Way to miss the point and be insulting all at the same time... If your goal is to reduce the number of straws in the Great Pacific Garbage patch... then you need to find out where those straws are coming from. If those straws are coming from @Just_A_Guy throwing his straws away in Lindon UT. Then taking @Just_A_Guy straws away is a good idea and we can also work on stopping the migration of straws from Lindon to the Pacific. If however the straws are coming from bad garbage practices in the Far East... They we waste our time trying to stop @Just_A_Guy from using straws because it does nothing to solve the stated problem... A good leader learns what causes a problem and then works to fix the problem. This is what America needs to be... A poor leader "does something" just to say they have "done something" and accomplish leaders this is what America currently has... And con men and huskers lead people into giving them money for empty promises This is how many of the Crisis experts come across as.

Why should we care??? Because if you want us to be a "Leader" and solve problems... the very first step is to understand the problem and it cause

Which reinforces the idea that Solar does not scale well.. You have a big cost (the large array) you sacrificed a lot, and you still rarely broke even. Now you did not mention a battery storage system.. That would be an additional cost but it would allow you to store your own excess for later use that might get you to the break even point or have less sacrifices. But your example is not really typical of the home solar panel with grid tie setup. Most of those the sacrifice is in the money for the panel not in big lifestyle changes. And those people are going to pull in power from the grid sources (whatever they may be) when the solar panels are dark. The fact that they might not be paying for this power does not change its source.

It does get confusing when people say they install solar panels and cut there power bill to zero... ( I know I am wanting to) That make it sound like all the power is coming from Solar. But the simple fact is with Solar with a grid tie... the power you pay for does not always indicate the source of the power you get

And since we were originally talking about God (since I am not qualified to really talk about your dad) and "punishment" you just answered why it appears that we have to pay... even if God has already

Solar has issues scaling up... But I can't carry a nuclear reactor around in my pocket like I can a solar panel.... so you have trade offs

Because you think the logic was about 'who paid?' Where as the logic is really more about 'what did he try to teach you by holding you responsible?'

Not at all... If I loan my kid my car... Anything they do in that car... I will pay for. But that does not mean that I can not selectively choose to charge them for some things as I deem fit

Exactly.. We also need to remember that Net-metering is a money saving option... Not a 0 pollution option. Solar panels help offset the peak load during peak demand (ACs on hot Sunny days) This is good. But we still use power when the panels do not work or are at reduced effectiveness and while the Power Company might be crediting the Net-metered user the cost... the power itself is coming from a Coal or whatever generator the company is using.

God has held himself accountable... We call it the Atonement of Christ. Though that God paid for everything... Every wrong... Every hurt... Every injustice. No matter the source. Having paid that he can then hold us accountable for what we do.. Or to your architect idea... God built the building... he paid for the building... he paid for if the building collapses on us... But if we choose take a sledge hammer to the wall or pee on the floor he can hold us accountable for that.

That is what the Parshall says in the bolded part. Utah is the headquarters of the church... as goes the headquarters so goes the rest of the church for policies.. unless it has good reasons not to. Culturally Utah-US-Canda have a whole lot in common... Fads and trends can easily be held in common through them.

Except that the argument they make is about having a choice... That they are morally entitled to make a choice to abort. That is the moral argument presented by the pro abortion side. @Just_A_Guy is simply countered that argument preemptively... Per JAG's counter 95% of the time they already made the choice and now trying to undo it. Thus it gives you want by eliminating or reducing the moral argument for abortion.

The science really is not that hard to understand. (Getting precise numbers can be but the overall is not) The big deal of Climate Change is Carbon. Basic chemistry teaches us that Carbon is a element and that baring nuclear process Carbon can not be created nor destroyed. Humanity does not have the technical skills to create Carbon in any large scale methods. Thus pretty much all the Carbon we have on the earth has always been here. (Yes we might lose a bit from Solar Wind and gain some from Solar Dust and meteors but that is really trivial) The interesting thing about Carbon is that it is foundational to life. Organic Chemistry is basically Carbon Chemistry. (Science Fiction plays on this when it speculates on Silicon Base life for aliens) The amount of Carbon on earth does not change but its state can. Everyone of one is part of this carbon state change cycle. As we grow we take in carbon to fuel our growth. If we lose weight we lose carbon. If we are stable we take in carbon (from food) and lose carbon (from breathing aka CO2 and elimination) Thus our very bodies are part of what could be call the 'active carbon cycle' and the 'stored carbon cycle'. The earth is apart of this cycle to... Its part of the Active Cycle and it is part of the Stored Cycle. The Stored Cycle is all organic material, everything from you and me to fossil fuels. The active cycle is all carbon that is moving. The best measure for this would be atmospheric carbon because it is the most mobile. Now the big argument of Climate change is that we are taking we are taking Stored Carbon (aka fossil fuels) and making it Active Carbon. That is not really debatable... because that is exactly what we are doing. What is debatable is what is going to happen next.. The Climate Change supporters point to Venus as an example of what we are headed for. (Runaway greenhouse gases) But the neglect the big check on the Active Carbon cycle. Something as far as we know Venus does not have and never did, something that Earth has in abundance. That check is Life itself. In Earth history it has had times of great variation of the Active Carbon cycle. Things like meteor strikes and volcanic eruptions can greatly increase the amount of active carbon that is in the cycle, by releasing the stored carbon. This can be greatly disruptive to existing life... but it is greatly beneficial to the concept of life itself. Because the interesting thing about greenhouse gases is that they are greenhouse gases. Ask any Climate Change Supporter and Greenhouse Gases are the bad guy. Ask anyone that tries to grow plants and you hear use how helpful and useful they are to plant growth. Now it is clear that we are putting more Carbon into the active cycle, and it is clear the earth is doing what it always does when this happens. (increasing the ability to store it). The big question is are we going to push it more then the earth can respond to? That is unlikely. But can we push it to the were the earth's response is not good for us and we hurt ourselves? That seems quite likely. So what do we do.. The climate change agenda pushers are all about taking control (aka power, aka its for your own good) and they want to stop everything. Sadly this will not stop volcanoes and meteors or any other natural method of carbon release. That seems like a bad choice no matter what. Know what seems like a better choice?... Encouraging life and innovation. Find a way to put carbon back into storage and find away to profit from it. This saves the world, saves the economy, and it give a tool to dig back out from a "natural disaster". Until then do what makes sense for you personally to reduce what you pull and increase what you put into the carbon storage.

This is exactly the problem I have with the current legal definition of what is human. Just about every horror story we ever hear about from slavery to concentration camps starts with and justifies itself by saying the targets are not human, subhuman, inferior order human.. etc. etc. All we have to do is look into our legal history to see how the laws supported this. Yet to many people today think that what is legal is what is moral. Many today would find it totally unacceptable to own a slave or gas someone in a chamber, think it is totally ok to tear a person apart. (aka abortion). Now I can not give any provable means of saying "This is when a mass of cells becomes human" But I know I would rather error of the side of being too generous and be wrong... Then on error on the side of too strict and be wrong. Because the later is holocaustic level error.

Interesting... After all this time for saying it needs to be defined... You are the first and only person to show that it has been... Thank you. So then the pro-life side needs to work on changing that definition

Exactly... If we understand what happened to the dinosaurs and what happened with the ice ages... it is impossible not to believe in climate change and mass extinction events... because they clearly happened without any human actions. As for human caused climate change... I am willing to grant Humanity having an impact... In fact I sincerely hope it does... Because the climate will change with or without us, but having some power over it means it is possible that the next mass extinction event will not include humanity. I am more afraid that we will be bamboozled by the climate change con artists in to spending our resources on things that will not work... That when the next ice age happens, or asteroid strikes or super volcano erupts, that we will have wasted the every resources that could have saved us and stopped us from being part of the mass extinction.

Yes... and if someone dies in a car accident or of old age it come be argued that nature (G-d) committed murder. But as a general rule we do not hold nature or G-d accountable before mortal laws.

You are talking about courts... which as you so clearly point out are all over the place... I am talking about the Legislative (aka Congress) the reasons the courts are all over the place is because the Legislative been phoning it in. Last I checked (barring Judaical activism) the court system likes having clarity of meaning and intent from the Legislative

The only reason laws like this exist (and their opposites) is because we have not legally answered the question of "When does a fetus become Human?" That of course is a question that has a lot of morality to it, but once answered all the other laws directly targeting abortion become moot. If the fetus is Human then it has Human rights, and we have laws already about when one human can harm and/or kill another. If it is not Human then it is the property (and body) of its mother and she can do what she wills with it. I know that I am on the side of calling it Human with all the rights and protections that come with that.

Hmmm after reading this it seems the Quote "Well behaved Women don't make history..." needs a Collaterally "Poor behaved Women don't really make history either... unless they have the support of a lot of Well behaved Women" (I used women because that was the quote... but I believe it applies to men as well)

Speaking of horse and buggy... that reminds me of a story I heard once.. (Which I can in no way validate so take it as you will). Back when Horse and Buggy was the means.. people started becoming concerned about the natural pollutant of that form of transportation (Horse Crap). Predictions were made that we were getting too congested, and if we did not stop soon we would be up to our waists in horse crap... It was the smog of its day. Clearly this did not happen. Because a game changing tech appeared. The internal combustion engine. It did not change things over night... but it did change things. And because of it we are not up to our waists in horse crap. Now we see the problems with the internal combustion engine and its pollutants... So what is the game changer for the internal combustion engine? I do not know. Predicting the future is hard. Like the internal combustion engine before it, any of the current potentials I am seeing have issues that they need to work out. But I definitely want to see them given and chance to do so.

Which is why with all things are are commanded to Study it out and Pray about it. Thing that might be worthwhile and useful can depend a lot on an individuals current resources and abilities

As a matter of this website policy we do require such massive quotations to be referenced. This is due to the legal issue it might cause should the author have issues with it. While others might discard the data based on the source... another complication is that it also must be within the site rules... For example no linking to anti-sites. Please note this is not a rebuke for anyone's current action... But rather a "since we are talking about it here is some official stuff we want here." reminder

Because God commanded us to... and we are ultimately accountable before him for how we handled our stewardship... Standard understanding is that as long as we do the best we can with what we have and know... God will find it good enough... But if we do not even try we are going to be not liking things.