Timpman

You certainly have the right to believe as you wish, but if you actively campaign for same-sex marriage, you could face church discipline.

PeterVenkman, do you really believe in modern prophets?

Here’s my point: Throughout the history of the United State, many laws have been established based on the morals of the people. That a purely secular argument is necessary to have a law is a false perception of our time. As more and more people give in to the decayed views of the radical activists, we will get what we deserve. “And if the time comes that the voice of the people doth choose iniquity, then is the time that the judgments of God will come upon you; yea, then is the time he will visit you with great destruction even as he has hitherto visited this land.” –Mosiah 2:27 We are not denying anyone any rights or protections by withholding the status of marriage. It is they (the activists) who seek to FORCE us (me and like-minded people) to recognize unholy unions as legitimate. I don’t seek to tell them how to act, and they can’t force me to condone how they act.

After water comes fire.

Very good questions, actually. I will think about it. Thanks for pointing out that post, MarginOfError. I tend to think radically sometimes. I would like to throw a porn tea party.

PeterVenkman's detailed arguments are not there. This thread is supposed to be focused on Constitutional "Rights" rather than "Youtube and my faith reduced to rubble".

I think the prophets trumps the Supreme Court. Society just doesn't know it it yet :) These "so-called freedoms" are NOT rights. So what do we do when the SCOTUS is dead wrong?

So, is it necessary to have a purely secular argument to continue the restriction?

Didn't he say those arguments were made in 2008? Let's have a fresh discussion instead of looking up old threads. Forums would be quite dead if we couldn't discuss anything that had been discussed previously. Me. I can disagree with the supreme court.

PeterVenkman wrote: I am not a Constitutional scholar, but I understand it some. I don't know what arguments PeterVenkman made, but here's what I think:1. Any "right to marriage under equal protection and due process" is make believe. What protections are people not getting by being unmarried? Same with due process. 2. How is marriage a form of expression? I think it's ludicrous to think the authors of the Bill of Rights intended such applications. Does anyone here also believe porn is protected speech? 3. Why must there be a purely secular justification? I reject that notion. Laws are fundamentally based on morals. 4. No thoughts on that.

That's not as concrete as you might think. The Constitution merely says that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." It does NOT say that morals and religions can not or do not affect laws.

A Ferrari is an awesome grand tourer (GT). Apply the moniker to a Ford Mustang, and then people think a GT is like a Mustang. People look at and and think "that's it?" A real GT, however, is much grander. Yes, it is a perception thing. Others can't do anything to degrade the marriage of any specific couple, but it lowers the perception of marriage as a whole.Also, as homosexual acts are condoned more and more by society, participation in those acts increases. Yes, that does mean I believe someone who is heterosexual can "change teams" or go "both ways." Then society continues on it's downward spiral. With the way the Church has shown opposition to same-sex marriage, how can you possibly believe it's not a bad thing?

More on this: When marriage is applied to to same-sex couples, it degrades the significance, sanctify, and meaning of marriage. Yes, opposite-sex couples degrade marriage in various ways, but that doesn't mean society should go ahead and make it even worse.

Wickedness affects all of society. Doesn't God judge societies? We all benefit or suffer according to the righteousness or wickedness of America as a whole. While this is true, I do not know what should or should not be legal. That's another matter. However, I know that the activists should not try to FORCE us to acknowledge and/or condone their relationships by granting marriage.

That guy should no be on a mission. He's probably miserable. He could make his companions miserable. He needs to come home and face the music. I don't know what will happen, but I hope your bishop notifies the branch president in the MTC. Don't let anything stop you from seeing your bishop, though. Satan will probably try to keep you away from that office. Don't fear what any person thinks. Just do what God would have you do.

I really like this site. I was just reading about Remeron:

Dove, thanks for your post. Effexor is so lousy for me, so I know what you mean. My favorite medication site, Crazymeds, says this: "For many people Effexor XR has the absolute worst discontinuation syndrome of an antidepressant. Effexor (venlafaxine hydrochloride) is a medication people utterly loathe to have taken. It is not uncommon for someone to fire doctors during or immediately after they quit taking Effexor XR(venlafaxine hydrochloride)." Crazy Meds: The Good, The Bad, & The Funny of: - Meds - Effexor I have tried to quit several times but it messes me up. I figured it was a mistake to post that here, but it wasn't. I guess I'll rule out ECT.

Mostly my two-year-old girl. She is a delight. I also like mountain biking, but it seems like too much of a hassle to go out much. I'm in the Salt Lake/Utah County area. I have no idea what else I could do. I did mention I'm in a call center, but I'm actually a licensed stock broker working on transferring in assets from other firms.

That was awesome. I think we need to keep in mind the following: By no means am I taking that to justify suicide. We just need to withhold judgement. Selfishness may have nothing to do with it when someone commits suicide.

Dravin, I've said twice that I don't have a plan to do anything harmful to myself. Yehshen, I think this will pass. I am in a rut right now. However, this is obviously a long-term problem for me and I realize I need to do something about it. I need to work on my cognitive distortions.

Ohhhhh, I am going to say it President Monson style: blog your beliefs, tweet your testimony, Facebook your faith, and don't debate with dolts.

Yes, the brethren have said we should utilize social media to spread the Gospel. Tweet your testimony, post positive things on Facebook and on a blog perhaps, but Youtube debates are a waste of time. Anyway, it really is hard to make a good argument against same sex marriage in light of this being America, the land of the free. I see it like this: I am not taking away anyone's freedoms or rights. They can live how they choose. It is the activists who are trying to FORCE everyone else to recognize and even condone unholy unions. If someone can't visit someone else in the hospital, then rules and laws about hospital visits can be revised. ANYONE should be able to have power of attorney to make important decisions about hospital care. Inheritance laws can change as well. The activists will say marriage laws must change, but that is rubbish.

Just remember that it doesn't help a person to point out selfishness. There is no "or what." There was no threat there. What's wrong with getting a bit of support here? I came here to make it through the day.

Yehshen, thanks for your concern. I will write tomorrow. I just want to say that it is inconsiderate to talk about how selfish suicide is. Don't you think I already know!? It only makes me feel worse to hear it. I feel suicidal because I hate myself. How could it help to point out my selfishness? Just remember this.

-Mark 10I believe it's impossible for little children to upset Heavenly Father. I see my two-year-old taking the sacrament thinking it's a snack and I imagine Him and Jesus smiling down on her.