Timpman

Vort doesn't mess around! It's important to not overlook his words "or the postmortal equivalent thereof".

Can you tell us why you were like that for a year?

Absolutely! Heavenly Father could have said to someone during the pre-existence "I am sending you to a place on earth where you will not learn about the Gospel. Just do the best you can and it's okay."Those you really learn of the Gospel, though, are better off accepting it here and now.

I don't think the CK is only for Mormons at all. On the other side of the veil, people who were in other religions or no religion will have the opportunity to accept or reject the Plan of Salvation and its ordinances and have the chance to go to the CK.

Convert55, thanks for your reply. I see you put a lot into writing that and I really appreciate it. It makes sense to me now. I want to read more scriptures online but it's out of service! Nooooooooooooooooo!

I think that was Brother Brigham speaking about his own thoughts

Thanks for pointing that out. So that is referring to sons of perdition. I am pretty sure there are instances in the scriptures where it mentions eternal/endless/everlasting punishment for those who are not sons of perdition.skippy, thanks for the explanation. I'm still confused about 3 Nephi 27:17 because it says "And he that endureth not unto the end, the same is he that is also hewn down and cast into the fire, from whence they can no more return, because of the justice of the Father." The words "from whence they can no more return" doesn't fit so well as a type of punishment. vort, that reference to Alma makes a lot of sense. I had forgotten about that.

So section 19 says: I don't understand how all the references to eternal, endless, or everlasting punishment in the scriptures do not really mean that it won't end. How does that work with the following verses?: 3 Nephi 27:17 "And he that endureth not unto the end, the same is he that is also hewn down and cast into the fire, from whence they can no more return, because of the justice of the Father." Matt 25:41 "Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" Helaman 6:28 "And also it is that same being who put it into the hearts of the people to build a tower sufficiently high that they might get to heaven. And it was that same being who led on the people who came from that tower into this land; who spread the works of darkness and abominations over all the face of the land, until he dragged the people down to an entire destruction, and to an everlasting hell." I just don't get it.

So it looks like Desmond spooked the "liberal" Mormons away. Btw, Desmond, I am so glad you got out of the Hatch.

Soooo, I visited a doc this morning. He was great and has experience with ADD patients. My wife went with me because I am not good at self reporting. I would have just said "I'm sad and I don't know why" and he would say I have depression. Usually, it would probably be good to wait until a patient has visited 2-3 times before making a diagnosis, but my wife and I zoomed through many symptoms and stories and he wrote a prescription for Adderall. For now, at least, I will continue to take Effexor XR as well. That might be abandoned later. Adderall kicks in right away, and I actually feel more focused. Of course, it's too early to tell if it will really work for me, but I am hopeful. I'm not ticked as I thought I would be.

Windseeker, I'm sorry for being a jerk. I see what you are saying now and I appreciate your comment.

Dear, dear Vort, you make me laugh. I still don't like your profile pic, though. Windseeker, saying that exercise and discipline and will power works for you implies that medication is for the weak. While you said "for myself," the implication is still there and your comment is not helpful. Exercise helps, but my discipline and will power has not worked for at least 15 years.

I confess I will probably be ticked off for a while. I will be happy to be diagnosed (if I am) and treated, but I will also mourn the lost opportunities and wasted time. It may explain (though not excuse), my drug use as a teenager. Marijuana was a glorious panacea to me. It made my mission very difficult at times. It took me a decade to finish one year of college, and that's all I've finished. My wife has complained that I don't pay enough attention to her. I have been labeled as "selfish." I have had a hard time seeing the good things in life, so I have been guilty of the heinous sin of ingratitude. I have experienced repeated disappointment and aggravation. I have constantly wondered why I fail over and over again and can't quite measure up. I have not moved up in my career. Most of the time I feel like doom is on the horizon and I am barely keeping my head above water. I am very frustrated with my life. I feel I am not who I should be. I am an underachiever.

I finally have an appointment with a doctor and will see him tomorrow. He is known to be knowledgeable about ADD. I am 95% certain I have Adult ADD and it is a plague from hell to me. My wife made the appointment for me because I failed to do it day after day after day, even though I really meant to and wanted to. I hope the appointment goes well.

Well, it doesn't matter. I will stick with the faith.

Many, many people inside and outside of the church can't seem to handle current commandments! That's why I don't understand that argument.

Bishops, councils, and other groups DISCUSS callings. Usually a name does not pop up out of nowhere. This could be a situation where the idea that you would like the calling lead the bishop to feel good about it. It could be that all of that could be changed with further discussion and clarification. You would not be out of line to just mention what your boy said.

Maureen, I read that page you linked and it's great. Thanks. So when are you going to join the Church?

And I really really hope that I have ADHD and that medication, therapy, and exercise will help. That will be a lot better than my current depression and anxiety.

Dravin, I appreciate your post. The verses I posted seem to be a religious law and not a secular one because the chapter heading says "The Lord reveals his laws pertaining to servants." MasterOrator, I did enjoy having a testimony. Things seems to complicated now. Loudmouth, it just seems that God could have said "Thou shalt not make slaves of one another" even though the people were rotten.

Oh, and there's these verses from the same chapter: So, if a man smites his slave and the slave dies right away, the owner will be punished. However, if the slave survives a day or two, it's okay!

Hi, I'm back and crazier than ever (actually, I am getting an appointment with a doc to probably diagnose me with ADHD). So I'm having a hard time because I've been reading some stuff in the Old Testament. Ha, you thought I was going to name some anti book. Anyway, these verses from Exodus just blow my mind: So someone could "buy an Hebrew servant" and after six years the servant (slave) would have to be let loose, unless the slave is a maidservant, in which case she could be kept for life (verse 7). Why did God condone slavery? I must have grown up in ignorance because I have always thought that God wants people to be free. And families don't seem to be very sacred. Verse 4 explains that a man would have to leave his wife and children behind if he leaves after the six years. What's up with that?

Um, seven year olds can't sin. You are handling this badly. Have you studied child psychology at all?

Thanks for that. Goodbye.

I have recently given up on trying to improve. Maybe it's a good thing because maybe I'm learning to rely more on God. That poem just went through my mind last night. I'm leaving this forum because I know I have little credibility.