Anddenex

Very true anatess, very true. Status would be eliminated, except that we are all brothers and sisters in the gospel, and all seeking the eternal goal. Agency, now I know why I am always in trouble with my wife, I think Kristi is praying really hard for my cleansing;)

"I love you." Then seek to understand their heart and seek to discern if the heart is still soft or hard. If hard, then Vort provided the perfect answer. If soft, then show love and provide all the facts contrary to his belief. The church has General Conference talks and ensign talks regarding the humanitarian aid the church provides. This will hopefully provide knowledge that will help a troubled heart. The only money spent on saving the dead is Temples, and yet Temples are to save the living who in turn help their dead ancestors. So this isn't money just spent for the dead, but also for the living. This is a common question from those who have not comprehended God's love, and what love actually is. I believe I am in that boat. Anatess, provided an excellent answer regarding the last question. I remember a conference talk where the Sister speaking talked about how God loves everyone. She asked the question does God love me just as much as he loves other in third world countries who are very poor. She said, "yes." However, I think it is very easy for one who is rich to say God loves all, verses the poor saying God loves all. I have come to the conclusion that God does love, and all that he does is out of love and long-suffering for the children of men. It is not God's love that has established third world countries, it is humankind's quest for power, money, and the honors of men which create the inequality we see in today's world. Remember, if we all follow God's plan, then we would be living the law of consecration. I don't believe, personally, there would be any third world status, if we all kept and followed God's commandments.

Oh Anatess, yep, my mother is just dumb, how sad and how unfortunate --- all sarcasm intended. Either way, I will look into the different explanations and the word OUSIA, however it will probably be another word to describe as Elder Jeffrey R. Holland said, a notion that is "incomprehensible."

No, didn't mention anything of the like. I will quote myself: Yet, they are "one being" as presently provided in your description of the trinity, which I have read before. One being, the son prays to the father, one being, the son is thus praying to himself. How can a person not be praying to himself if the two are "one being." I will look into the information Anatess provided, and if I have no clue, then all the Trinitarians I have spoken with, have "no clue" either. However, I will respectfully disagree with you, and continue to trust in my mother's words who was a Trinitarian before her conversion to the LDS faith, and others which I have spoken with. But then again, I guess my mother had "no clue" either, of course. In the meantime, I agree with Anatess, the thread is different than what we are discussing, and I will read over the information Anatess provided.

Thank you Anatess for the site provided. Not even close to the same thing, for I am not Jesus Christ, nor will I be one being with Jesus Christ. I pray to an actual being separate of myself. My mother is a convert to the Church also. Her belief system previously was Trinitarian also. So should I doubt my mother and her explanation of the Trinitarian belief system and that she was and is not as adept as Maureen and yourself? Either way Anatess, we disagree, but thank you for the site information, I will review it.

I am inline with Volgadon. I think you are thinking of sources outside the Book of Mormon which specify that Moroni may have dedicated the Manti temple spot. Which bring me to the conclusion, I have never read any authentic writings from past prophets and apostles regarding this. Does anyone have a source where this stems from? If so, I would be most curious.

Hehe... Or where Brigham Young crossed the plains, that's in the Book of Mormon also, at least that is what someone told me on my mission, who read the Book of Mormon before.

Within in the Trinity, Jesus did pray to himself. It really doesn't matter how they try to explain it, or justify it. Jesus, is the Father in the flesh, according to the Trinity belief system. Thus, Jesus, the Father in the flesh, is praying to himself. No, my understanding is correct, and I have heard General Authorities speak the same way. The easy question to ask any Trinitarian, when I stand before God, will I see Jesus, the Holy Ghost, and God, or will I just see God, One being? If I only see one being, then Jesus was praying to himself, because he is God in the flesh, separate but not separate. If I see more than one being, God the son, and God the Father, standing next to him, on his right hand, then Jesus wasn't praying to himself. Anatess, I am familiar with Trinitarians belief system, spoken with many, and have read their material. I understand, what they say, but I have never read or heard any sound argument specifying how Jesus, the Father in the flesh, wasn't praying to himself. If Maureen can provide me a good sound argument, or source, which specifies how Jesus, being God in the Flesh, isn't praying to himself, then I have no problem admitting my error.

Thanks beefche for the information, your belief in my knowledge of the Trinity however is incorrect.

That would be great reading, thank you.

Haha Maureen, when you actually point out my "limited knowledge" regarding the Trinity, instead of just saying "Talk about limited knowledge" you might have a valuable point. Typically, if you are going to point out someones "limited knowledge" because ultimately you are saying you have more, yet providing nothing to back up your point. Hmmm.... Instead, you insult, and then tell me to look at correct sources, which I have thank you. How about you take the extra step and give me all your wisdom about the Trinity you think I don't have.

The logic is flawed, because it assumes if it leads to something good, then it isn't wrong. I have friends who watch rated R movies, and they say they learned something good, so an R movie is ok to watch if I learn something good. The adversary constantly uses good and truth to deceive individuals. Note when the Lord was temepted, the Adversary quoted scripture. He quoted something good with a twist, in the event, if Christ followed any of his advice, he would have no longer been the savior and all would have been lost. I don't need to smoke weed to know the effects. I only had to watch my friends growing up. This is the great aspect of knowledge, we can learn through observation or learn through experience. I don't need to do drugs to know they aren't good for anybody, and they don't enhance anybody's abilities to be more spiritual or a better artist. It is a myth that smoking weed will enhance your spiritual capacity, however it will put you in a path that will more likely allow you to be deceived. All you have to do is take a good look and recognize you are trying to tell everyone that doing drugs, despite the Lord's counsel of not doing drugs, will lead, or provide spiritual enhancement. Not only are you trying to convince yourself of marijuana, now you are trying to convince yourself of shrooms. This reminds me of a missionary back home who purchased a tatoo on his mission, of CTR, and said it was a sign of him truly coming unto Christ. It is irony at it finest. Here are some leaders thoughts on drugs: I really hope that you listen to your parents, speak with your Bishop, and stop immediately. Either way, I wish you the best in your endeavors.

Let me be more specific, I can control it. You crack me up! LOL

Now this is new to me, I have never read anywhere the average age of men who were married to be mid to late 30s. That would have made Joseph, Mary's husband, the Lord step-father, well below the average. Unless, those who have taught me since childhood are wrong, that Joseph was between 18-20. Most of the sources I have read specify him probably 18. However, I will be the first to admit, I am not as studied as others are in middle-eastern studies. I am simply amazed by how smart some people are pertaining to this culture, and the history texts they have read. The only justification, good justification, pertaining to the Lord being married is that marriage was and is a commandment of the Lord. The Lord was perfect in all things the Father commanded. The Father commanded for his children to be married. However, there is a lot of empty holes pertaining to the perfection of Christ. We are only taught that he was perfect and sinless. So I would agree, no justification is good, unless it is true, and if true, then it isn't a justification, just reality. Either way, as previously shared this is my personal opinion. :)

I think of this verse as well, but not according to his marital status, but according to his life as the son of God. A person is still able to be married, and still be despised by men. Likewise, a person is still able to be despised and be single.

As a Christian, and one who believes in the Trinity, a being that is ONE, but separate, prays to himself, at a baptism speaks from Heaven calling himself his son and is pleased in himself, and a dove appears for the Holy Ghost. Yet, you write, LDS doctrines confuse you the most? If truth was contingent upon the lack of confusion, then there would be no religion on this earth that would be considered true. We are taught regarding mysteries of heaven, and these mysteries are confusing, or may appear confusing because of our limited knowledge. This also is dependent on where you get your knowledge from and how you go about obtaining knowledge. It would be similar to a sincere seeker of truth wanting to learn about Jesus, during Jesus's lifetime, and actually going to the Pharisees. The knowledge gained by the Pharisees, verses the knowledge gained by learning from Christ or one of his disciples will be different. Our doctrine may be the most confusing to you because of how you originally were taught regarding our doctrine verses actually seeking correct sources. This is a question that is two fold: 1st - We are all the literal spiritual offspring of deity, our Father in Heaven. This automatically specifies a characteristic of divinity within us all before our mortal probation. 2nd - Mortal probabtion is an opportunity for experience, and for God to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of all the sons and daughters of God. Immortality given to all who kept their first estate, eternal life, or exhaltation, is provided to those who accept Christ and believe in him (Article of Faith #3). 3rd - There was no doubt, from our Father in Heaven, regarding the divinity of Christ before his earthly probabtion, and Christ's divinity while he was his, the Fathers, only begotten Son in the flesh. 4th - All of God's knowledge, has not been revealed to his children. It would be nice to know everything, while other tenets we accept in faith, even though a doctrine may not be as clear as other doctrines. However, are they confusing or unclear due to our own faith and knowledge, or due to the actual teachings provided by God?

They attend regular wards and hold callings. Sean Bradley, NBA player, attended a regular ward in Texas. I worked with a person and Sean was his young men's president or advisor. The young man thoroughly enjoyed it.

My three wishes similar yet a little different. 1. Anytime I needed a specific amount of money, I would just put my hand in my pocket and walla, the money would be in my hand (I would fill up my bank account pretty quick). 2. Anything I could imagine with my mind I would be able to accomplish. Example, if I started thinking about flying then I would start flying. If I wanted to be at a certain place, I could teleport (like with the movie jump). 3. The intelligence to understand any concept, wisdom. Ha... as the Genie of Aladin would say... "you can't wish for more wishes"

Up for bids .... $1 ..... Sold!

Smoking pot is, as others have expressed, a sin. It is breaking the commandment, as another has expressed, within the word of wisdom. I am always dumbfounded when people try to promulgate this argument, "it makes me very spiritual and I can connect to the bible better." It is similar to a young man I spoke with once who said he was a better artist after he smoked marijuana. Smoking pot doesn't enhance any ability of the human intellect, athletic skill, or spiritual capacity. When your mind is hazed by marijuana you will not be able to think better, or even be intuned to the voice of the spirit when reading the bible. It would be like a husband saying he is a better husband when he is on marijuana. You will need to really study more and understand more what it means to be "spiritual". You will be better off in the long run deciding now never to smoke cannabis again.

My last statement is regarding this verse of scripture, Luke 2: 52: Me personally, I have a hard time seeing the Lord gain the favour of men, especially in this time period, without being married. Marriage provided a social status among men, especially within the Jewish culture. Within a Patriarchal society, marriage provided more than what it does now, and he being single at 30 reminds me of Brigham Young's words, "Single men over 28 are a menace to society (This is more of humor than reality)." So I have a hard time believing he was single, but then again, in your other post you provide a valuable point that marriage may have been trivial to His higher calling. These are reasons why I would believe he was married verse single.

1. Family members and two friends 2. 7 3. Too picky, nothing bizarre in the least 4. Don't remember 5. 30 hours strait through, Utah to Ohio 6. My wife 7. Awkward 8. 347 9. 5' 9" 10. Have a lot of fun (service, vacations, never work for an arrogant and controlling manager again, etc...) Now my turn, What would you wish for if you had only 3 wishes?

I remember Kristi sharing this with me. An amazing story, especially since I am not sure I would have been thankful for fleas. Amazing and inspiring faith.

Although I understand what you are meaning, I think, one needs to be careful when saying "the command to take a mortal wife is lacking in scripture." I agree, the command "take a wife" is no where said in scripture, however in the garden of Eden we know that the Lord said, "It is not meet that man should be alone..." And a woman was provided that man should not be alone. We know Adam and Eve were married. I would venture to say this meant for Christ also, that it was not meet for him to be alone either. There is another commandment the Lord provides, "Multiply and Replenish the earth." This is a commandment given to all mortal beings. The only way a person, righteously, and without sin, could multiply and replenish the earth, is through the avenue of marriage. So the question which comes to my mind, when the Lord said he was to fulfill all righteousness, did this righteousness include "Multiplying and Replenishing" the earth? If so, then the covenant of marriage is the only way this could have been fulfilled. As we all know, this isn't doctrine, however there isn't anything wrong with asking questions. Without a question, revelation is typically not obtained.

Daboosh, I don't know if you have served a mission, but if so, then send an email or letter to your mission president and ask him.