Snow

Your post is a bit mystifing as no one claimed that anyone was forced to go to BYU. What they said was that they didn't care for a particular practice that limits the flow of information by fiat, which, this being America, is perfectly acceptable.

Hi Dove, I agree with what you wrote, but that doesn't mean that people don't make choices; although I don't understand your last point. It seems you are saying that if I choose to egg my neighbors house, I am not truly choosing to egg his house.

Well, okay, we both acknowledge that some extreme cases are exceptions.

What do you mean "huh?" You carped about the girl even brining it up but here you are bringing it up.

Why do you feel the need to tell us your opinion and complain about the girl? Seems like you could do with a dose of your own medicine.

There are a bunch of repressed fruitcakes at BYU. My daughter danced ballet on a scholarship at BYU. After performances for students the nuts would come out of the woodwork complaining about the dance departments wanton behavior that was tempting the girls' boyfriend to entertain evil thoughts.

Disagree completely. Addicts make small incremental choices every step of the way. At the end they may be fried beyond the capacity to choose yea or nay but they got there from willful choice, one tiny step at a time.

So as a Mormon, you we generally believe that heaven, even the lower heavens is so wonderful that it is beyond imagining and yet you call that gloomy. You're name is real life isn't Debbie Downer is it? Did you read your point #1? So, for you, it's punishment to not get the very best. Are you one of those fanatic liberals who claims that slowing the rate of growth in government spending is cutting the budget?

No - you pretended to know what God thinks and feels. You do not. Now you are pretending that I am unknowledgeable while you are knowledgeable. Do you really think anyone will fall for the pretense?

Hmmm, When someone purports to know what God thinks and feels, you can be pretty sure that they are just telling you how THEY think and feel... Besides which I doubt you really believe what you are saying. I'd guess that you believe that some body modifications are just fine (mascara, pierced ears, exercise induced muscular hypertrophy) but when someone has a modification you personally don't like, then you claim that it is God who does't like it

Yes, it happened to me, twice. Then I woke up and reality set in.

Sounds like you have lived in some very unfortunately and sinfully judgemental places.

,,,

You wanted an iPad knockoff but not an actual iPad?

What on earth makes you think that tattoos or piercings are not allowed. How could the Church stop you? Women get pierced all the time. Men get pierced and tattooed and the Church does nothing about it. A tattooed doesn't keep you out of the temple or out of heaven for that matter.

Yes - I know what the scriptures say. My question was" "If that is true, why do people employ the promise and yet do NOT come to know that the BoM is true?" Why does it sometimes work and sometimes not work? And I hope you don't hive me the pat answer that they must be doing it wrong.

If that is true, why do people employ the promise and yet do NOT come to know that the BoM is true? ... and here I am using the word "know" narrowly. People don't "know," they believe or are convinced.

How on earth can you say it's "probable?" It's just a possibility that provides a rational basis for belief but it isn't anything even remotely close to proof (of the BoM).

Yeah, and...? You mean God is morally interested in whether I eat my spinach boiled or lighted sautéed? I don't think so. I am not asking for dogmatic quotes.

That's not the point I was making. Matthew was making up dogma (things asserted without proof) about rebellion and sin. I was making commentary.

Great, you've got a dictionary. Yeah, I have one too, as well as the teaching manual. If you hang out on the internet, you'll figure it out. Then you might not have to quote dictionaries and wouldn't that me dandy.

Ecuador, 77-79. It was the 3rd best 2 years of my life, right after my blue period and the fabled post-modernist years. I learned to speak Spanish so perfectly that I translated in the twinkling of an eye.

Rebellion? Sin? Get serious. It isn't a question of morality. It's a matter of public image. The Church wants it's members to present a squeaky clean image. It's like the Church's stance on piercings. It advises against piercings unless it is single piercings on each ears from women, in which case it doesn't take a position... obviously not a moral issue. Got any proof - other than that's what you believe?

Do tatoos preclude you from taking the sacrament? Do tatoos keep you out of the temple? Do tatoos keep you out of the celestial kingdom? No No, and No.

My guess is that you are just a clumsy troll but I'll play along. 1. Please quote the parts of the bible that demonstrate my faith in Jesus Christ is misplaced into a figment of Joseph Smith. 2. Could you please just use words whose meanings you understand?