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shadowhunter

mormon prophet and catholic pope

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Pope and Prophet and Evangelical Preacher were in a boat fishing in the middle of a lake. Pope Says, " I gotta go to the bathroom", so he jumps out of the boat and walks across the lake to the bathroom and then comes back. Mormon Prophet says, " I gotta go too", so he jumps out of the boat and walks across the water and goes to the bathroom and then walks back. A few minutes later the Evangelical preacher says, " I gotta go too", so he jumps out of the boat and and immediately starts floundering around. The Pope looks at the Prophet and says, " Should we tell him about the rocks?", the Prophet replies, " what rocks?" :lol:

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So i am wondering what are the differences and simlirates between the prophets and the popes

You deserve a serious answer. I'm not the person to do that. I don't know what "authority" the pope has.

I do know that President Monson is a Prophet of God. He holds all the priesthood keys and his line of priesthood authority goes back to Christ.

applepansy

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Similarities

They both are the “head” of there church.

Both Claim to have the same priesthood as Peter, James, and John had. (One believed it was passed down over time, the other believed it was restored).

I’m guessing the pope has some type of authority given to him to be the pope? The same is true for the prophet

Differences

I don’t know if the pope believed in Revelation/guidance for the church?

Pope is called from a bunch of elders that figure out who should lead next.

Prophet is known who is next, is set apart by the other apostles.

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Guest ceeboo

So i am wondering what are the differences and simlirates between the prophets and the popes

Hi shadowhunter,

I'll take a stab at the similar ( Pope and President Monson )

Both are children of God

Both are respected leaders of their religions

Both have accepted the responsability to lead by example

Both teach LOVE

Both have a deep faith in Jesus

Both serve God

Both are admired by many

I'll leave the differences to others :)

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Guest The_Doctor

and sadly their words are also considered irreavlent by some of theire followes as well

But should those people really be called their followers then?

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Guest ceeboo

I have Catholics in my family, they are good people, but the church? To write scriptures in and talk in Latin specifically to keep people from understanding what is being said, to try and take away any personal relationship with G-d by saying you have to go through the church for everything.... infant baptism - that little babies go to hell unless they are baptized...There is just something so wrong with that... again, love the people, just not the church.

Hello changed,

Looks like you might need a 5 hour lunch with ceeboo :):)

Your posts strike me as rather ignorant, not to mention completly off topic :)

At any rate, if you would like to be educated on these matters we can have lunch:)

God bless,

Carl

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Hello changed,

Looks like you might need a 5 hour lunch with ceeboo :):)

Your posts strike me as rather ignorant, not to mention completly off topic :)

At any rate, if you would like to be educated on these matters we can have lunch:)

God bless,

Carl

Hi Carl, what part has Changed got wrong, i dont know a lot about Catholic church, but i do hope its the part about Little Babies.

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I am a Catholic-and your post is not in keeping with the current understanding of the Catholic Church. It is OK to disagree with me and my faith tradition--but please show respect.

Catholics have the Mass/worship service in the language of the people for the last 40 years. Our services are not in Latin. In the US-they are in English and other languages of the people-like Spanish.

Catholics do not believe that babies not baptized go to hell.

-just two points-that you give which are not up to date or factual

-Please consider taking a course or update in current Catholic doctrines and teachings before you post about them--I would be happy to give you several links.

-If you disagree----fine, but do not slam another faith tradition than your own.

-just not cool!

Thank you

Carol

It comes down to the apostasy – was the apostasy total and complete? Or not?

I have Catholics in my family, they are good people, but the church? To write scriptures in and talk in Latin specifically to keep people from understanding what is being said, to try and take away any personal relationship with G-d by saying you have to go through the church for everything.... infant baptism - that little babies go to hell unless they are baptized...There is just something so wrong with that... again, love the people, just not the church.

.

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I think the Pope must be one of the most influential religious leaders. From what I can tell, the recent Popes (I am familiar with the last two) have done much good in the world. And I know that our two churches have stood in support of each other on key moral issues.

I believe that the prophet or President of the church (as we call the senior Apostle of the twelve today) has the priesthood authority that Peter and the other apostles had which makes him more than a prophet. He is a prophet, a seer, and a revelator.

When my Catholic friends say that the Pope has the authority of Peter, I used to think that they viewed the Pope in the same light. I thought that he was viewed as some version of an Apostle. After a few conversations on this board, I think I understand differently. That the pope is not a prophet and not an Apostle. But he does retain the authority from Peter and is considered the Father over the whole church. And while he may not be a seer or a revelator, he is inspired and led by God.

Is this understanding correct? I hope I am getting it right. :) Which brings me to my next Catholic question: if Peter was an Apostle, why isn't the Pope if he has the same authority?

And as always, simply trying to understand how my Catholic friends see this issue. I am afraid I do see it thru Mormon eyes as was my upbringing.

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So i am wondering what are the differences and simlirates between the prophets and the popes

Both the LDS and the Catholic churches claim institutional authority from God in providing the saving ordinances (sacraments) of the Gospel to their believers/members.

Both churches promote spiritual growth and active service to their fellow man amongst their membership.

Both churches provide a tangible focus and context for personal faith for its membership.

Thus, both churches have the capacity to serve as an adequate exoteric 'feeder' church that leads its membership to the esoteric Church of the Firstborn.

If the Pope commits adultery, the Catholics will grieve and hope for the day when that Pope behaves more appropriately. If the LDS Prophet commits adultery, he will be excommunicated from the Church, and the President of the Quorum of the Twelve will take his place.

HiJolly

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Hi from Carol-

Yes, our two faith traditions have much in common and much good both can do for a hurting world.

Thankyou for your message:

I am not here to debate --just give you the current understanding of the Catholic Faith.

On the Catholic Faith-I suggest you first read and try to understand the basics of our faith by reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

Here is a searchable link:

English Translation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church with Search Utility

A link on the current understanding of Baptism of Infants can be found at:

CNS STORY: Theologians: Unbaptized babies in heaven makes more sense than limbo

-enjoy your study.

-Carol

OK – I will say something nice. At least the Catholics believe the priesthood, authority from G-d is needed. It seems like most other denoms don’t recognize the need for priesthood or for any kind of authority beyond some human given degree. The point that G-d is the head of the church, not man, and that authority from G-d is needed to guide the church is very important. Also love that they are pro-lifers, support traditional marriage etc... again, great people.

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You must be a prophet-correct? You know what will happen to the Pope in a given future circumstance--wonderful!

You know more than I do.

-Carol

Both the LDS and the Catholic churches claim institutional authority from God in providing the saving ordinances (sacraments) of the Gospel to their believers/members.

If the Pope commits adultery, the Catholics will grieve and hope for the day when that Pope behaves more appropriately. If the LDS Prophet commits adultery, he will be excommunicated from the Church, and the President of the Quorum of the Twelve will take his place.

HiJolly

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Hi from Carol-

Yes, our two faith traditions have much in common and much good both can do for a hurting world.

Thankyou for your message:

I am not here to debate --just give you the current understanding of the Catholic Faith.

On the Catholic Faith-I suggest you first read and try to understand the basics of our faith by reading the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

Here is a searchable link:

English Translation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church with Search Utility

A link on the current understanding of Baptism of Infants can be found at:

CNS STORY: Theologians: Unbaptized babies in heaven makes more sense than limbo

-enjoy your study.

-Carol

Thank you for the Links Carol.

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Guest ceeboo

If the Pope commits adultery, the Catholics will grieve and hope for the day when that Pope behaves more appropriately. If the LDS Prophet commits adultery, he will be excommunicated from the Church, and the President of the Quorum of the Twelve will take his place.

HiJolly

Hi Hijolly,

Was Joseph Smith excommunicated??:confused: HUH I didn't know that.

You have an excommunicated prophet who will judge you at the end????

God bless,

Carl

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You must be a prophet-correct? You know what will happen to the Pope in a given future circumstance--wonderful!

You know more than I do.

-Carol

As a member of the LDS church, it is perfectly acceptable for me to be a prophet...

But I am speaking not of the discussions in the two churches amongst the leadership, the inevitable discussions of consequences or appropriate censure and so forth, but rather of the historical record concerning disciplinary actions of leaders of the two institutions.

Do you disagree?

HiJolly

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As the Catholic Church believes in Apostolic succession, we believe the Bishop of Rome/The Pope is also an "Apostle." We sometimes use that term to designate the 12 original Apostles. We do not use that term as much as Pope or Bishop of Rome-which was his original title and still true today. -His formal Church/Cathederal is St. John Latern-in Rome

CHURCHES OF ROME

Do a search on Apostle at the following link and you will find dozens of parts from our Catechism on Apostle and what that means to us.

English Translation of the Catechism of the Catholic Church with Search Utility

-Great question-Thank You

-Carol

I think the Pope must be one of the most influential religious leaders. From what I can tell, the recent Popes (I am familiar with the last two) have done much good in the world. And I know that our two churches have stood in support of each other on key moral issues.

I believe that the prophet or President of the church (as we call the senior Apostle of the twelve today) has the priesthood authority that Peter and the other apostles had which makes him more than a prophet. He is a prophet, a seer, and a revelator.

When my Catholic friends say that the Pope has the authority of Peter, I used to think that they viewed the Pope in the same light. I thought that he was viewed as some version of an Apostle. After a few conversations on this board, I think I understand differently. That the pope is not a prophet and not an Apostle. But he does retain the authority from Peter and is considered the Father over the whole church. And while he may not be a seer or a revelator, he is inspired and led by God.

Is this understanding correct? I hope I am getting it right. :) Which brings me to my next Catholic question: if Peter was an Apostle, why isn't the Pope if he has the same authority?

And as always, simply trying to understand how my Catholic friends see this issue. I am afraid I do see it thru Mormon eyes as was my upbringing.

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Hi Hijolly,

Was Joseph Smith excommunicated??:confused: HUH I didn't know that.

You have an excommunicated prophet who will judge you at the end????

God bless,

Carl

Nice thing about an open canon, ceeboo. Joseph was not excommunicated, and for good reason. I suppose you disagree.

And no, Joseph will not judge me, or you, regardless.

HiJolly

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The Catholic Church has 2000 years of history-many times/places.

I can only deal in the present and I cannot predict the future based on the past.

So-yes-I disagree-as I cannot predict the future.

I am glad you are a prophet-congratulations to you.

-Carol

As a member of the LDS church, it is perfectly acceptable for me to be a prophet...

But I am speaking not of the discussions in the two churches amongst the leadership, the inevitable discussions of consequences or appropriate censure and so forth, but rather of the historical record concerning disciplinary actions of leaders of the two institutions.

Do you disagree?

HiJolly

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Hi Hijolly,

Was Joseph Smith excommunicated??:confused: HUH I didn't know that.

You have an excommunicated prophet who will judge you at the end????

God bless,

Carl

I am getting confused lol, who said JS was excommunicated

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Guest ceeboo

Hi Carl, what part has Changed got wrong, i dont know a lot about Catholic church, but i do hope its the part about Little Babies.

Hi jimuk,

I see Carol gave you a link as to the Catholic teaching of unbaptized infants, I will just add that the following is a teaching as well: With respect to children who have died without baptism, the liturgy of the Church tells us to trust Gods mercy. In addition, it also teaches that ALL those, without knowing, who act with the inspiration of God, seek God in sincerity and strive to fullfill his will, are saved.

I have never heard the mass in Latin ( although I would like to ) It is offered in Latin " special masses and such.

Latin is the very ancient language ALL the saints spoke and is considered by many Catholics as revered, sacred, respectfull, traditional. This ancient language ( now extinct )

is the very language our brothers and sisters in Christ spoke in the Early Church days.

SO, these reasons ( and many more ) are why I thought the previous post was nothing short of disrespectfull, bias, and certainly unChristian.

God bless,

Carl

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The Catholic Church has 2000 years of history-many times/places.

I can only deal in the present and I cannot predict the future based on the past.

So-yes-I disagree-as I cannot predict the future.

I am glad you are a prophet-congratulations to you.

-Carol

I see that I have offended you. I am sorry for that. I do not intend to insult nor denigrate, but to show a difference between the institutions in relation to the role of the leading position, Prophet and Pope. I think the original context of my first comment shows no hard feelings or negativism toward your church. Indeed, I truly do respect the Catholic church.

I do not feel it takes a prophet to see that due to the oppositional doctrinal positions of the two churches regarding Donatism, that these scenarios are reasonable and, in fact, have occurred and will most likely continue to occur, as circumstances arise, based on well accepted doctrine.

I'm sorry you object.

HiJolly

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Guest ceeboo

sorry, did not mean to get anyone up in a dander. Have the beliefs of Catholics changed sense the dark ages? If so, why would a church change what they believe?

And before then?

Perhaps you should read about William Tyndale...

William Tyndale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

He was killed by the Catholic church for translating the Bible into a language that commoners could read... Why would any church not want it’s members to read the Bible?

sorry, but why are they baptized at all then? If you don’t think the baptism saves them why do it?

OK - I really don't want to get into any bashing stuff :( Really, Mother T - great lady. I love Saint Frantis, etc... great beautiful people...

Hi again changed,

You dont want to get into any bashing:eek::confused: I think you have already done so, this post is another illustration of that.

I will not respond in kind :)

I will simply and kindly suggest that you do not have a full understanding of what Catholic baptism means. Because you have already demonstrated you can " google things " :):):)

Maybe you can google " Catholic baptism" also

God bless,

Carl

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