Dow down 31% since election

[bytor2112]

The market is getting crushed......

[Hemidakota]

Edited: repeated on what others had said already. I thought I was the only seeing this since I don't watch the new channels.

[aranyborju]

I think that investor confidence has been shaken by all of the stories in recent months detailing the level of incompetence and selfishness at the corporate level. Obama is like a tree falling in the forest. He can make anouncments and purchase stock in failing companies all day, but no one will take notice because they are all so mesmorized and awe-struck by the fact that the upper echelons of some of our most prestigious companies are totally bereft of talented executives.

I also believe that bailing out a company has an overall negative effect on investor confidence. If I see the government purchasing 25% of a company, that signals to me that it is poorly run, dying, or both, and I would avoid purchasing that stock like the plague.

[bytor2112]

The real kick in the face is that there is 10 trillion dollars sitting on the sidelines. The market doesn't see any thing in the Obama plan that it believes is going to help. He really needs to address the real issue....the toxic assets and soon.

[LittleWyvern]

I don't think anybody should be really surprised, the market has been heading in this direction (the slope of the slope, essentially) for a year and a half. Blaming this on Obama makes no sense.

[bytor2112]

I don't think anybody should be really surprised, the market has been heading in this direction (the slope of the slope, essentially) for a year and a half. Blaming this on Obama makes no sense.

Continually defending the President because you voted for him makes no sense. Obama and the Democrats control the purse strings........his economic team has not addressed the cause of the economic downturn. I don't blame President Obama for the down turn, but he is in the hot seat now and needs to rapidly take steps to correct the problem. Spending trillions to increase the size of the government does not address the cause of the problem. If he and the Democrats do something that addresses the problem, I will be the first to praise him/them. I am the President of a Financial Planning Group and manage money for a living and I see people losing their life savings every day. The markets react to uncertainty and right now they do not believe that what the President is doing is any reason for optimism.

Edited March 6, 2009 by bytor2112

[beefche]

I don't think anybody should be really surprised, the market has been heading in this direction (the slope of the slope, essentially) for a year and a half. Blaming this on Obama makes no sense.

I think it's interesting that the market takes a downtown whenever the stimulus bill or that spending bill is discussed. The market is reacting to measures instituted by Congress as encouraged by Pres. Obama. That makes me think that the market isn't liking these bills too much.

[bytor2112]

I think it's interesting that the market takes a downtown whenever the stimulus bill or that spending bill is discussed. The market is reacting to measures instituted by Congress as encouraged by Pres. Obama. That makes me think that the market isn't liking these bills too much.

That's exactly right. President Obama is in a very strong position to correct the problem. But thus far, his spending has been focused on enlarging the government and hoping for economic stimulus through infrastructure expansion, The crux of the economic downturn is bad debt and the housing market. Elphaba posted an excellent video detailing the credit crisis and it was spot on. The attention and focus of the spending should have been laser like focused on dealing with those toxic assets that have the credit markets clogged. Instead we get a huge increase in government spending that simply does not address the problem at all. If he and his team of economic advisers would put forth a plan to deal with the mortgage obligations, the market would react immediately. Think back to Bush and Quail and the savings and load debacle.......

[DigitalShadow]

If he and his team of economic advisers would put forth a plan to deal with the mortgage obligations, the market would react immediately.

What measures would you propose? It seems like you are saying there is a simple solution to all this and that Obama is simply not doing it, I'm curious exactly what steps you would take in his position. I know we disagree a lot, but I'm not particularly well versed in economics and genuinely curious here.

[LittleWyvern]

I was going to make a post here about derivatives and other calculus terms to support my first point, but then everybody would be confused (even me) except Moe, who would probably find an error in my math somewhere and make me look even more silly.

*goes back to his corner*

[Moksha]

I think that investor confidence has been shaken by all of the stories in recent months detailing the level of incompetence and selfishness at the corporate level. Obama is like a tree falling in the forest.

You are right, the stage has been set over many years, the ax is in motion and things will get worse regardless of what we do.

[captmoroniRM]

Is it me, or does every time Obama talks about the economy and his plans to fix it, the stock market drops dramatically?

[captmoroniRM]

My Bailout Plan: Instead of giving 780 Billion dollars to try and save the economy, lets do the following: Give $2228.57 to every person in the US (780 Billion divided by 350 Million). If you are under the age of 18, your parents get it (because apparently parents are more responsible).Tell me if people each had another 2000 dollars in their pocket, they wouldn't stimulate the economy. They would be able to catch up on their mortgage payments, pay off their credit cards, or simply go out and buy something.

Alternate Plan: Give me millions of dollars. That would stimulate my economy

[blusun7]

DOWN DOWN DOWN DOWN...... This has been going on for a decade. It's been planned for many years.

Part of revelations.

Here

listen to 20 secs. in especially..

Listen to this one

Talks about mormon church and how the goverment gets into religion and he says Mormon church is clean from a dirty plot to destroy peoples believes and mindset on religion. 4:09-4:17

This is why there are so many churches in the nation... National Council of Churches exposed. Almost three decades ago.

[blusun7]

i dont mean to hijack the post. If you need to delete my post i can post directly to the subject. I just got overexcited. I dont think that second comment should been in there but i already clicked the post reply button.

[bytor2112]

What measures would you propose? It seems like you are saying there is a simple solution to all this and that Obama is simply not doing it, I'm curious exactly what steps you would take in his position. I know we disagree a lot, but I'm not particularly well versed in economics and genuinely curious here.

There isn't an easy solution to the problem. The issue of the distressed debt has to be addressed. Right now credit markets are frozen and banks hold enough of this bed debt to be insolvent. When Tim Geitner presented his plan to deal with the "toxic" assets, the market declined because there wasn't any details to the plan. These assets need a market so that the banks can get them off the books. The problem is that no one knows the real value of the assets and thus there is no real market for them. Banks are reluctant to sell the debt at say 20 cents on the dollar, obviously because the losses would be huge and may cause the banks to fold. So, it is critical that that issue be dealt with in a very specific manner and soon. The irksome thing to me is that Geitner isn't a dummy and they should by now have a workable solution to a problem that everyone has been aware of for quite some time. Instead they are passing massive spending bills that frankly doesn't excite the market either.

[Hemidakota]

It was partially his fault since he served in the Senate. Now, I know he was not the governor of Illinois. When Clinton enter the office of the Presidency, it was not his fault seeing his last position was governor of Arkansas.

[Hemidakota]

DOWN DOWN DOWN DOWN...... This has been going on for a decade. It's been planned for many years.

Part of revelations.

Here

listen to 20 secs. in especially..

Listen to this one

Talks about mormon church and how the goverment gets into religion and he says Mormon church is clean from a dirty plot to destroy peoples believes and mindset on religion. 4:09-4:17

This is why there are so many churches in the nation... National Council of Churches exposed. Almost three decades ago.

I planned this back 2003. That is when I noticed something was wrong, seeing Greenspan turned over large mounts of stocks.

[Hemidakota]

You are right, the stage has been set over many years, the ax is in motion and things will get worse regardless of what we do.

Government should allow it to fail so correction can come swiftly. Right?

[Moksha]

Government should allow it to fail so correction can come swiftly. Right?

Not exactly. It should be allowed to fail so no political mileage can be made of its correction. Things will inevitably get worse before they get better. Doesn't matter who is in charge. Too many fast and loose policies have made this inevitable. Greed was rampant and now the consequences have arrived. It has been a long time coming. Obama has merely become The Conductor before the final train car plunges over the cliff.

[Hemidakota]

It will never get better Moksha...since my last personal vision posting and given the riot act, still being patience though, I am quite reluctant now even to post it here in explaining the whys.

Those who had attended President Packers meetings know what I am referring too on why it won't get better.

[Moksha]

Those who had attended President Packer's meetings know what I am referring too on why it won't get better.

The contents of the mystery email, eh. You must be well placed to have attended that. Ah, the burdens of responsibility in the last days... I trust you in assisting the Saints to be safe.

:)

[Book_of_Mormon_Warrior]

The market is getting crushed......

It's a vast right-wing conspiracy.

[JohnBirchSociety]

That's exactly right. President Obama is in a very strong position to correct the problem. But thus far, his spending has been focused on enlarging the government and hoping for economic stimulus through infrastructure expansion, The crux of the economic downturn is bad debt and the housing market. Elphaba posted an excellent video detailing the credit crisis and it was spot on. The attention and focus of the spending should have been laser like focused on dealing with those toxic assets that have the credit markets clogged. Instead we get a huge increase in government spending that simply does not address the problem at all. If he and his team of economic advisers would put forth a plan to deal with the mortgage obligations, the market would react immediately. Think back to Bush and Quail and the savings and load debacle.......

The real crux of this problem began with the abandonment of sound money as demand by the United States Constitution.

Absent a return to sound money (gold or silver coin or notes backed 1:1 by them, issued by the Treasury, no FEDERAL RESERVE), the problem will NEVER be resolved.

There are laws of economics at play here. They are being violated. Now we are beginning to see the fruits of our folly.

I blame my Great-grandparents (circa 1880-1930) for this mess. They are the ones who abandoned our Constitution. They are the ones who allowed the "secret combination" to murder and get gain. And now we are left to mop up their mess! Disgusting.

Simply put, no sound money, and we are doomed, no matter who is President.

[bytor2112]

The real crux of this problem began with the abandonment of sound money as demand by the United States Constitution.

Absent a return to sound money (gold or silver coin or notes backed 1:1 by them, issued by the Treasury, no FEDERAL RESERVE), the problem will NEVER be resolved.

There are laws of economics at play here. They are being violated. Now we are beginning to see the fruits of our folly.

I blame my Great-grandparents (circa 1880-1930) for this mess. They are the ones who abandoned our Constitution. They are the ones who allowed the "secret combination" to murder and get gain. And now we are left to mop up their mess! Disgusting.

Simply put, no sound money, and we are doomed, no matter who is President.

Yep....the genie is out of the bottle and he's not going back in.......