Are we approaching another revolution?

[DigitalShadow]

You are spot on.....people tend to become more conservative with age. I would definitely have described myself as (gasp) liberal 20 years ago. What changed? Well, for me it was more life experience. Economic issues began to have real meaning because it was directly affecting me.....got a real job, family, etc. I wasn't as idealistic....became more of a realist and began to understand that the government is way too big, spends/wastes my money without any real accountability, the same problems ALWAYS seem to exist and are never really solved by government intervention. SO I began to believe in a limited role for government, lower taxes, etc. The social issues really didn't sway me until I became active in church....I just thought, why should government be involved in that?????

I agree that the government is a bloated bureaucratic mess that struggles to get anything done, let alone done efficiently, but I haven't really seen much from the conservative side that indicates they do any better.

When it comes to social issues, I tend to lean far more liberal, but as for the rest of it I firmly believe both sides are full of crap.

[MarginOfError]

I would love to say we have emerged from our racist past but news like this make me wonder

Man carrying assault weapon attends Obama protest - Yahoo! News

When guns go to political rallies reasonable discussion ends.

Please explain to me what about this article is indicative of any kind of racism. They guy on which the story reports showed up with a gun. Big deal! He did so legally. He even moved off of school property when asked by police. All things considered, it looked like an effective display of his desire for no more gun control laws. Kudos to him!

On the other hand, the guy that had the gun isn’t really the guy I’m worried about. I’m worried about some other nut job taking the gun and using it. However, as much as I think that it is unwise to carry weapons into a protest (a situation where emotions run high), I don’t see any slant on racism in this story.

[bytor2112]

I agree that the government is a bloated bureaucratic mess that struggles to get anything done, let alone done efficiently, but I haven't really seen much from the conservative side that indicates they do any better.

When it comes to social issues, I tend to lean far more liberal, but as for the rest of it I firmly believe both sides are full of crap.

The problem is there aren't that many real conservatives. Republican doesn't necessarily = conservative.....and I agree that both sides are full of crap. What is going on now down right sickens me.

[bytor2112]

Please explain to me what about this article is indicative of any kind of racism. They guy on which the story reports showed up with a gun. Big deal! He did so legally. He even moved off of school property when asked by police. All things considered, it looked like an effective display of his desire for no more gun control laws. Kudos to him!

On the other hand, the guy that had the gun isn’t really the guy I’m worried about. I’m worried about some other nut job taking the gun and using it. However, as much as I think that it is unwise to carry weapons into a protest (a situation where emotions run high), I don’t see any slant on racism in this story.

and the picture I saw showed a black fellow carrying an assault rifle.

[bytor2112]

Please explain to me what about this article is indicative of any kind of racism. They guy on which the story reports showed up with a gun. Big deal! He did so legally. He even moved off of school property when asked by police. All things considered, it looked like an effective display of his desire for no more gun control laws. Kudos to him!

On the other hand, the guy that had the gun isn’t really the guy I’m worried about. I’m worried about some other nut job taking the gun and using it. However, as much as I think that it is unwise to carry weapons into a protest (a situation where emotions run high), I don’t see any slant on racism in this story.

and the picture I saw showed a black fellow carrying an assault rifle.

[Guest]

In my humble opinion it's about time America enters the 21'st century. Many nations have had socialized medicine. I grew up in Germany and we knew that if you were sick you could see the doctor. Okay , maybe there was a waiting period but never the less we saw a doctor. But, I am now one of a majority of Americans who do not have health insurance. Hence I can't afford to see a doctor... So, I thank President Obama for standing his ground! Perhaps this will lose me friends around here. But , I don't care what you label it people need healthcare we are the richest nation in the world and yet its citizens go with out proper healthcare. Shame on us!!! If you want to call it socialism then I say Long live socialism!! I voted for President Obama and I think he is doing a wonderful job!

I have to disagree with this post. A socialist America is not what got herself on the top of the World power ladder. A socialist Europe is what got them under America on the ladder.

A self-provident Cebu is what got her on the rank of most successful province of the Philippines. Look it up. I can cite you example after example.

These are 2 differing cultures at play. There is no "right" or "wrong". There is only "different" and "what has worked through the lens of history". For America to remain the successful nation that it has become in the past 300-some years, it needs to maintain the American culture of self-providence.

Unfortunately, American culture has gone so far from self-providence that people who has the means to have a computer and an internet connection and cable service to their big screen TV cannot afford to pay the $60 visit to the doctor because "they have no health insurance". (No, I'm not talking about you - although, you might be one of them - I'm talking about everybody that I have talked to personally who are claiming the same).

Why is this? Because, America has gotten to the point that people are looking to employers, government, etc., to provide for their healthcare instead of taking care of it on their own at the same time filling their coronaries with a daily supersized Big mac, fries, and coke.

This is the same with education. Kids settling for crappy public schools because they can't afford education elsewhere, when these same kids wear the latest Nike shoes and spend all day playing all 50 games in their wii and zoning out in their iPods.

Why is the WII of a higher priority than their education? Why is their HDTV of a higher priority than their doctor visits? Because - the new American culture is now in the "gimme" stage where they expect somebody else (oh, yes, the rich! why not?) to provide for their basic needs so they can spend their assets on unadulterated FLUFF!

Eventually, those who make enough money to provide healthcare to the masses is going to move to Cebu, or else, just slide down into the ranking of the masses, - add to that the inherent incompetency of an elected government - and where are you gonna be?

EDIT:

I don't want anybody to think that I'm so incapable of compassion that those who are TRULY poor should be left to struggle on their own. There are those who are TRULY poor that healthcare is impossible - what... 5% of the population? 10%? And how does 5-10% of a population get control of what 100% of the population's healthcare system should be? I say, let the states help their poor, leave the rest of America alone.

Edited August 18, 2009 by anatess

[James_Fryman]

in a sense this country is facing a revolution but its not going to be a violent one, hopefully, most people will protest and exaust all peaceful means to fix whats going on before it turns violent, I think it was 20 years of protesting by the colonists before they were FORCED to turn violent, and even then they still wouldve pefered to stay citizens under the crown.

[Guest Believer_1829]

Dick Morris (former Clinton adviser) is reporting that Obummer and Senate Demoncrats are looking to overturn a Senate rule and make it possible to pass bills with only 50 votes. If that happens I guarantee there will be problems.

Edited August 18, 2009 by Believer_1829

[threepercent]

I would love to say we have emerged from our racist past but news like this make me wonder

Man carrying assault weapon attends Obama protest - Yahoo! News

When guns go to political rallies reasonable discussion ends.

depends on who has the guns.

of course, I cannot yet make the connection to racism. so.... i guess I just dont get it.

as to the OP... no, we are not, if you want to know what we are approaching read helaman and 3rd nehpi.

[talisyn]

Dick Morris (former Clinton adviser) is reporting that Obummer and Senate Demoncrats are looking to overturn a Senate rule and make it possible to pass bills with only 50 votes. If that happens I guarantee there will be problems.

That's President Obummer to you.

I always thought that 51 votes passed the bills, and it was only the ones that passed with 60 votes that were veto-proof. I'm wrong? The senate is super-majority?

Well the part that concerns me about the guns is why now? Where were the guns when Pres. Clinton was in office? When Pres. Bush was? I'm sorry but when I see guns for the first time at a protest against the first black president I get worried.

Edited August 19, 2009 by talisyn

[bytor2112]

That's President Obummer to you.

I always thought that 51 votes passed the bills, and it was only the ones that passed with 60 votes that were veto-proof. I'm wrong? The senate is super-majority?

Well the part that concerns me about the guns is why now? Where were the guns when Pres. Clinton was in office? When Pres. Bush was? I'm sorry but when I see guns for the first time at a protest against the first black president I get worried.

Did you see the pic I posted of the black guy carrying an assault rifle????? MAybe it's not a race thing........

[Hemidakota]

As we are watching this healthcare reform debate spread across the US. It is seeming that the people are very much on the same page, alot of them in not wanting the goverment to control the healthcare, the people are uniting and speaking out against the government, such is protected under the 1st amendment, and principles this country was FOUNDED upon. I saw a clip in where Alren Spectot sentator from PA, said the following

"We can't let town hall meetings dominate the political process, that would be destructive to what we need to do to figure out what is the best approach..."

Is that not DISGUSTING????

If he'd of said that in 1775 wearing a powdered wig? how would WE the PUBLIC of reacted to that???? What would Thomas Payne said about it? Benjamin Franklin? These people are wanting to take over the country, and not make the voice of the people imporatant, Town Hall meetings are what started the movement for independence. THE BIG QUESTION IS...will the colective WE remember all of this next November? probably not...but that is the only way we can get real CHANGE is to throw all these....*poopyheads* out of office...some of these guys are in the senate and congress for 60 years!!!!!!

I really don't like where we are headed as a country, I think we are headed towards disaster...

To quote the man eleceted President...

You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them...And they fell through the Clinton Administration, and the Bush Administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not.

And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." Barrack Hussien Obama

yeah, thats me I'll gladly cling to God and my guns while you steer this great ship called America into the dirt......

btw..here is the clip that set me off

YouTube - Specter: Health care protesters dont represent America

Eventually, the righteous in the land will have to end this form of government in order to bring forth a greater order of Jesus the Christ.

[Guest Believer_1829]

That's President Obummer to you.

I always thought that 51 votes passed the bills, and it was only the ones that passed with 60 votes that were veto-proof. I'm wrong? The senate is super-majority?

Well the part that concerns me about the guns is why now? Where were the guns when Pres. Clinton was in office? When Pres. Bush was? I'm sorry but when I see guns for the first time at a protest against the first black president I get worried.

This is the e-mail I got...

Dear Friend:

I am supporting only one organization to stop Obama's healthcare program: the League of American Voters. And I am encouraging concerned Americans to funnel their support to the League as their main venue for donations.

I believe the League has the most effective program to confront directly and stop Obama's radical healthcare takeover plan.

Obama is moving to ram through Congress his plan and all our resources need to be focused to stop him.

Please donate today and help put its powerful ad on air by Going Here Now.

Also read the League's urgent message below!

Dick Morris

Obama Caught in AARP Lie, More to Come

Dear Supporter:

In our last message, we warned that Obama was on the run, desperate to get his radical health plan rammed through Congress.

But Obama's falling poll numbers, and the fact that outlets such as Fox News and Newsmax are fully informing Americans about the dangers of the plan, have hurt him and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi's efforts for their healthcare fiasco.

They are desperate. Obama out-and-out lied this week when he claimed that the AARP, the nation's largest seniors organization, backed his healthcare plan.

The organization does not support it.

Nancy Pelosi has even compared citizens protesting against the health plan with Nazis.

These futile attempts of Obama and Pelosi to twist reality prove that our efforts are working!

This weekend, we will begin our national TV ad campaign. We are rolling out our powerful new TV ad — devised by Dick Morris, our chief strategist.

Dick's ad exposes how Obama's plan will lead to healthcare rationing if he succeeds in adding 50 million people to the government system.

You can see the TV ad and donate by Going Here Now.

Remember, you can't let your guard down. Obama and the Democrats know they no longer have the 60 votes to pass the radical health plan in the Senate.

We are told they are working behind the scenes to change long-standing Senate rules so that they can pass their health plan with just 50 votes!

This is again a desperate measure and an attempt to subvert our democratic and constitutional system.

I can assure you the League of American Voters is working day and night to stop Obama's plan.

We are also preparing for contingencies.

When Congress returns after Labor Day, we must line up all our forces for the final battle.

I realize many people are on vacation or feel confident we can defeat Obama's plan.

Please don't fall victim to overconfidence.

It is critically important that you join with the League of American Voters today and help us defeat Obama.

Please Go Here Now to Donate.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Bob Adams

Executive Director

P.S. Next week, we want to roll out our powerful TV ad to eight more states. We have a goal to raise $5 million for our campaign to stop Obama's plan. We are well on our way to this goal, but we need more help. Please take a moment today and show your support — Go Here Now.

Paid for by the League of American Voters. Contributions to the League of American Voters are not tax deductible as charitable contributions for federal income tax purposes. Contributions from individuals and corporations are permitted by law and welcome.

[ADoyle90815]

In the LA area for the past 3 days, there was a free clinic for the uninsured, run by a charity that usually provides medical care in third world countries. I'm just saying that something needs to be done, but I'm not sure exactly what.

At free clinic, scenes from the Third World -- latimes.com

[James_Fryman]

In the LA area for the past 3 days, there was a free clinic for the uninsured, run by a charity that usually provides medical care in third world countries. I'm just saying that something needs to be done, but I'm not sure exactly what.

At free clinic, scenes from the Third World -- latimes.com

The problem with just handing out free care is that most people become lazy and dont try to fix things, I understand that we need to help everyone if there going through a hard time but people need to quit abusing it, just look at what happened with wellfare.

[James_Fryman]

Eventually, the righteous in the land will have to end this form of government in order to bring forth a greater order of Jesus the Christ.

Yes but that will happen years from now, look how long it took for the thirteen colonies to overthrough britian, Im not just alking about the war Im talking about the 20 years they took to try and peacefully settle things.

We must exaust all others means of protest before we began to even consider turning to violence to solve the problems going on. But if it does turn to violence and I think weve used all other means to fix our government then ill be one of the people on the front lines and the first shot fired on that day will have more of an impact than anything else in our modern history. There also probly wont be set battle lines like there was in the north south civil war I think itll be more of an anarachy situtation in which small groups of people will band together than two sides that each have an entire army.

Edited August 19, 2009 by James_Fryman

[Guest Believer_1829]

In the LA area for the past 3 days, there was a free clinic for the uninsured, run by a charity that usually provides medical care in third world countries. I'm just saying that something needs to be done, but I'm not sure exactly what.

At free clinic, scenes from the Third World -- latimes.com

Perhaps encourage other such charities to do similar work through grants and tax incentives.

[Maxel]

Unfortunately, American culture has gone so far from self-providence that people who has the means to have a computer and an internet connection and cable service to their big screen TV cannot afford to pay the $60 visit to the doctor because "they have no health insurance". (No, I'm not talking about you - although, you might be one of them - I'm talking about everybody that I have talked to personally who are claiming the same).

I remember one particular person who said capitalism was based on selfishness and socialism was the way to go. One of his big problems with America's current system was that he couldn't afford healthcare for his family.

I clearly remember one discussion in my roommate's house's basement: his new Nintendo DS game was on the table (next to his 3 other DS games and his new Nintendo DS). He was hanging out at the house before going to his LARP (Live-Action Roleplaying Game) which he spent over $200/year to be a part of (including a yearly conference in New Orleans). He drove a relatively new car that he was still paying off. All I could think about was that if this person went to school and tried to improve his lot in life he would be able to afford insurance. Heck, if he lived within his means he would be able to afford insurance.

Not everyone who wants nationalized healthcare is like that (of course), but I can't help but wonder how many are. Entitlement programs seem to be supported most vehemently by those with entitlement attitudes.

[talisyn]

Perhaps encourage other such charities to do similar work through grants and tax incentives.

I think the point was this should not have to happen here in the first place

[Guest Believer_1829]

I think the point was this should not have to happen here in the first place

Well, if government had proper incentives and tax breaks for the existing entities it wouldn't.

[Guest Godless]

Well, if government had proper incentives and tax breaks for the existing entities it wouldn't.

And how is incentive-driven altruism any better than a government system that guarantees health care for people who can't afford it? You're basically telling poor Americans "I'm sorry that too few people care enough to give to charities". The government cares enough about our children to (poorly) fund public education, even though many parents forgo this option. It cares enough about our health to regulate the food we eat. Why shouldn't it care enough to provide health care for citizens who can't come by it through private providers?

[Jbs2763]

just on a personal note, i have been extremely ill (but getting better) over the last several days... this included a trip to the ER, a trip to my personal doctor, generic meds that were only 30 bucks, and abotu 500 bucks worth of samples from my personal doc. Im guessing this lil excursion is gonna cost me between 500-1000 bucks..probably 1000 if i didn't get the homeboy hookup on the meds. I DON'T have insurance right now...but still, this 1000 bucks or so..is a heckuva lot less than I'd pay in increased taxes, even on the pennance I make in this post Obamalipitic world....

[Guest Believer_1829]

And how is incentive-driven altruism any better than a government system that guarantees health care for people who can't afford it? You're basically telling poor Americans "I'm sorry that too few people care enough to give to charities". The government cares enough about our children to (poorly) fund public education, even though many parents forgo this option. It cares enough about our health to regulate the food we eat. Why shouldn't it care enough to provide health care for citizens who can't come by it through private providers?

I am speaking of existing companies, not just charities. Incentives and tax relief to provide easy access, more extensive, better coverage would open up the free market which would work itself out to the benefit of everyone. When you start accepting handouts from the government you are bound to the government, being under the thumb of government is not American.

Schools are not poorly funded, the money is mismanaged. Since when is it the governments business to regulate what I eat? I am not a child.

[Guest Godless]

I am speaking of existing companies, not just charities. Incentives and tax relief to provide easy access, more extensive, better coverage would open up the free market which would work itself out to the benefit of everyone. When you start accepting handouts from the government you are bound to the government, being under the thumb of government is not American.

Incentives and tax breaks won't keep private companies from competing for our money. Health care shouldn't be sold as a commodity in an economy where many Americans can't afford it. I'd much rather be "bound by the government" than be faced with medical bills that I can't afford, not because I like handouts, but because I don't make enough money to pay for both food and doctor's visits. BTW, I'm speaking as one of the American workers fortunate enough to receive coverage from my employer. I personally don't have to worry about medical coverage, but many hard-working Americans aren't so lucky.

Since when is it the governments business to regulate what I eat? I am not a child.

Ever heard of a little organization called the FDA? Edited August 20, 2009 by Godless

[talisyn]

Not to mention the USDA