Today's Music

[lisajo]

Sorry i brought up the agency thing, but i think arguing about it as free or not free has gotten of the track, I my self had know clue about how Ben has put it, maybe just the way i learned it,

[Guest Member_Deleted]

Originally posted by lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 03:57 PM

Sorry i brought up the agency thing, but i think arguing about it as free or not free has gotten of the track,    I my self had know clue about how Ben has put it, maybe just the way i learned it, 

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Now what was the topioc again? Oh...yeah... the evils of music... LOL yeah... I think there are...

[Outshined]

Yeah, when Mariah Carey did that remake of Def Leppard's Bringin' On The Heartbreak?

Completely evil.

[lisajo]

Originally posted by Please+Nov 18 2005, 01:59 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 03:57 PM

Sorry i brought up the agency thing, but i think arguing about it as free or not free has gotten of the track,    I my self had know clue about how Ben has put it, maybe just the way i learned it, 

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Now what was the topioc again? Oh...yeah... the evils of music... LOL yeah... I think there are...

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Please your giraff is winking at meeeeeee, Sexual harassment i tell ya!!! or is it A homosexual giraff..........

AHHHHHHH it must like devil warshiping music LOL J/K

[Guest Member_Deleted]

Originally posted by lisajo+Nov 18 2005, 04:07 PM-->

Originally posted by Please@Nov 18 2005, 01:59 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 03:57 PM

Sorry i brought up the agency thing, but i think arguing about it as free or not free has gotten of the track,    I my self had know clue about how Ben has put it, maybe just the way i learned it, 

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Now what was the topioc again? Oh...yeah... the evils of music... LOL yeah... I think there are...

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Please your giraff is winking at meeeeeee, Sexual harassment i tell ya!!! or is it A homosexual giraff..........

AHHHHHHH it must like devil warshiping music LOL J/K

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ROLF.... it is all in the interpretation... LOL

[BenRaines]

Now that is funny and I will agree to disagree with how we view agency. I did look it up in the scriptures and never did find free agency. I found free and I found agency but not free agency. It has been used in terms of talks and things but not in the scriptures.

Oh well agree to disagree.

[seamusz]

Originally posted by Outshined@Nov 18 2005, 04:02 PM

Yeah, when Mariah Carey did that remake of Def Leppard's Bringin' On The Heartbreak?

Completely evil.   

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evil pronounced ee-vil, as in the fru-its of the de-vil.

[BenRaines]

Guess I don't listen to the right wrong music. That Simon and Garfunkel stuff about a bridge over troubled water just gets me thinking about slow dancing with girls back in high school. Oh now there is an evil thought

[seamusz]

Originally posted by Please+Nov 18 2005, 03:50 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-BenRaines@Nov 18 2005, 03:48 PM

This is silly but!!!!

God gave man agency.  That in and of itself is free.  Agency to choose or agency to act.  That is freedom to choose or freedom to act or not to choose or not to act.

What is compelled agency?  Is there such a thing?  Can we be compelled to be free to choose.  I don't think so.  Agency is freedom.

Satan's plan in pre-existence did not have agency.  God's plan did.

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You need to read a little more in the scriptures... LOL and then do some pondering... you have... like seamus stated... got the general idea... but not the deeper more technical one... which leads to a lot more interesting knowledge and understanding...

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Actually I think that Ben is probably right. I think that it is more important to teach our childeren that every choice has its concequences, than to explain how technically it can be thought of as free agency. I think that calling it plain agency is the deeper meaning.

[BenRaines]

Thank you, the check is in the mail

[seamusz]

Originally posted by BenRaines@Nov 18 2005, 04:21 PM

Guess I don't listen to the right wrong music.  That Simon and Garfunkel stuff about a bridge over troubled water just gets me thinking about slow dancing with girls back in high school.  Oh now there is an evil thought 

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That'll date ya.

[seamusz]

Originally posted by BenRaines@Nov 18 2005, 04:23 PM

Thank you, the check is in the mail 

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No prob, I can't be caught actually agreeing with Please.

[Guest Member_Deleted]

Originally posted by BenRaines@Nov 18 2005, 04:18 PM

Now that is funny and I will agree to disagree with how we view agency.  I did look it up in the scriptures and never did find free agency.  I found free and I found agency but not free agency.  It has been used in terms of talks and things but not in the scriptures.

Oh well agree to disagree.

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Okay... but if we expected all the doctrines and principles to be mapped out in such a 'complete way' where would be the mystery and what would be the need of pondering and praying and being taught understanding from the Holy Ghost?

[BenRaines]

There are many things that I find clear and concise in the gospel that I do not have to interpret or find the deeper mysteries. Here are a few.

Don't watch R rated movies. I have not found one yet that has a great social redeeming value that I just must see to enlighten me.

Don't commit sexual transgression.

Don't gamble

Don't , well you know all the ten commandments.

Do, you know the two great commandments.

I live the gospel basically and not mysteriously. I practice, Faith, Repentance, renew covenants at baptism by partaking of sacrament and rely on Holy Ghost's direction.

The rest of the stuff I leave to the intellectuals. :)

[Guest LDSister]

Ozzy Osbourne was inducted into the Hollywood Walk of Fame by none other than Satanist Marilyn Manson who said of Ozzy "This star right here proves that it's quite obvious that Ozzy has managed to succeed…despite his various crimes against God and nature." God's word tells us that we do not wrestle against flesh and blood but against spiritual forces of wickedness in high places (Eph. 6:12). We are told that Satan is the "god of this world" who blinds the minds of the lost to the "glorious gospel of Jesus Christ," (2 Cor. 4:4). God's word tells us that Satan is "the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient." (Eph. 2:2) Thus Satan is adept at using willing people to his own end. Ozzy was the front man of Black Sabbath who pioneered Heavy Metal in the late 60's and throughout the 1970's. After selling several million albums with Sabbath, Ozzy was fired and took up a solo career and sold over 70 million albums in the 80's and 90's. Now, in the 21'st century, Ozzy is the "star" of MTV's most successful show ever. To be sure, Satan has received a lot of mileage out of Ozzy Osbourne.

Incredibly, President Bush heaped praise upon Ozzy Osbourne for his "accomplishments" like an MTV-VJ. Ozzy who has helped Satan lead untold millions to destruction via drugs, occultism, rebellion and Satanism was given a respectable facelift by Bush before the world media. Ozzy's wife Sharon said in response to Bush's honoring of Ozzy, "What can you say? It's the most incredible thing that he would even mention Ozzy. It's a bit overwhelming." Bush praised Ozzy for a string of hits stating, "The thing about Ozzy is, he's made a lot of big hit recordings…'Party With the Animals,' 'Sabbath Bloody Sabbath,' 'Facing Hell,' 'Black Skies' and 'Bloodbath in Paradise.' Ozzy, Mom loves your stuff."

Sadly, while Bush has spent millions of the taxpayer's money fighting against international terrorism he has given moral support and public honor to one of the most accomplished spiritual terrorists and corrupters of youth the world has ever known. For Bush to Support one who unabashedly glorifies evil and praises Satan is unconscionable. Nationally syndicated columnist Joseph Farah stated poignantly of Bush's praise of Ozzy:

"Satanic lyrics, evil worldview, disgusting mouth, no musical ability, drug abuse. This is Osbourne. He is a depraved moral terrorist, seducing young kids who don't know any better into deadly lifestyles. President Bush knew all this, but still felt it was appropriate to acknowledge him for special attention at the dinner last week." (Joseph Farah, The Ozzy and Dubya show, 2002 WorldNetDaily.com)

The meaning behind the songs that President Bush praised Ozzy for are alarming to say the least. Ozzy's song, Party With The Animals, is self-explanatory yet it is worth looking at just a few of the lyrics of some of the others. The song Sabbath Bloody Sabbath, which Bush mentioned, is about a man overcome by demonic powers and on his way to hell. In fact the front of the album, by the same title, has a man being terrorized by demons while lying in bed with "666" emblazoned on his headboard (see pic, left). President Bush also praised Ozzy for the song Bloodbath In Paradise. Incredibly, this song relishes in and glorifies the Charles Manson murders: "Your comin' home, there's blood on the walls, when Charlie and the Family made house calls…As you lie bleeding, murdered in your bed… But no one wakes when Charlie creeps behind, YEAH! Execution, Halts your breath, Helter Skelter, spiral death, YEAH!"

In another song that Bush mentioned when giving praise to Ozzy, Facing Hell, Ozzy sings about how he is facing eternal judgment in hell for his wicked ways:

"Evil one is coming and he's knocking on your door cause today is the day you pay…I'm praying that you'll never know that I'm facing hell."

Ozzy's hero, Satanist Aleister Crowley called, the family "Public Enemy Number One." Ozzy praised Satanist Aleister Crowley and even wrote a song about Him. In Ozzy's song Mr. Crowley he sings about Crowley "waiting on Satan's call." Ozzy went so far as to dedicate his album Blizzard of Oz to Aleister Crowley, stating:

"I really learned to believe in the devil. I dedicated The Blizzard of Oz to Aleister Crowley". (From Rock to Rock, Eric Barger, p.133)

Ozzy Osbourne was a high school drop out and juvenile delinquent who spent time in prison for theft before he made his deal with the devil. Osbourne claims that he was drawn to Satan from the time of his childhood: "I've always had this thing about Satan from the time I was small…The Devil is within us all the time. " (Circus, Aug. 26, 1980, p. 26)

Sadly, Ozzy sought to find acceptance and success by opening himself up to dark satanic powers that are always seeking to exploit willing and open mediums. Ozzy would admit at the pinnacle of his success with Black Sabbath that he believed he was a medium for forces greater than himself who had given him such fame and accomplishment. Ozzy stated: "I don't know if I'm a medium for some outside source. Whatever it is, frankly, I hope it's not what I think … Satan." (Hit Parader, Feb. 1975, p. 24)

Ozzy has continued to serve Satan because of the worldly success he has been rewarded for his eternal soul. Most people are not aware that Black Sabbath was named after a Satanic being that appeared at the foot of Sabbath's bass player, "Geezer" Butler's, bed. This satanic being has been called Black Sabbath's "fifth mystical member". The demonic spirit entity has been credited for channeling Sabbath's first three albums. Sabbath opened themselves up to these satanic forces after Terry "Geezer" Butler had already immersed himself in the occult. Butler's descent into Satanism began after reading occultic literature, which inspired him to turn his home into a satanic shrine in veneration of the Devil. Butler admitted:

"I read a magazine [on black magic] and thought, 'Oh yea, I never thought of it like that'-Satan's point of view. I just started reading more and more…I'd been having loads of these experiences since I was a child and finally I was reading stuff that was explaining them. It led me into reading about the whole thing-black magic, white magic, and every sort of magic. I found out Satanism was around before any of it and was putting upside-down crosses on my wall and pictures of Satan all over. I painted my apartment black was getting really involved in it and all of these horrible things started happening to me. You come to a point where you cross over and totally follow it and totally forget about Jesus and God." (Seconds magazine, 1996, Issue 39, p. 64)

After Butler had forgotten about "Jesus and God" and jumped headlong into Satanism his friend, Ozzy Osbourne, had given Butler yet another book on "black magic". Ozzy's gift was said to precipitate a decisive mystical experience and transformation of consciousness. Butler had a visitation by a powerful demonic principality and discovered that he and the band that was soon to be called Black Sabbath were the "chosen one" to take Satan's message to the masses. Butler stated:

"I just got this really weird vibe off it [the book] and I put it in this cupboard of the apartment I was living in and that night I just woke up and there was this black shape at the bottom of my bed…the next day I told Ozzy about it and about three days after that we came up with our first song Black Sabbath and Ozzy just related my experience in the lyrics." (Terry Butler, video interview)

We find out how Butler and Ozzy understood the meaning of this experience in the lyrics to the song Black Sabbath wherein it is stated:

What is this that stands before me?

Figure in black which points at me,

Turn 'round quick and start to run,

FIND OUT I'M THE CHOSEN ONE

Big black shape with eyes of fire,

Telling people their desire

SATAN'S SITTING THERE HE'S SMILING…

It would be a very short time after this initial satanic visitation that Sabbath would be catapulted to colossal success and end up being used to construct a new musical genre called Heavy Metal. Heavy Metal would be used by Satan to turn countless millions of unsuspecting youth on to Satanism, drugs, sexual perversion, blasphemy, the occult, violence, murder, animal and human sacrifice, suicide and the breakdown of the family. God only knows how many eternal souls are now writhing in hell as a result of Black Sabbath and Heavy Metal. Rock stars have gone on record in their admissions regarding selling their souls to Satan for fame, power and money as we have documented in our video, They Sold Their Souls for Rock 'n' Roll. Ozzy has admitted: "I've got many, many demons that affect me on many, many levels…" (Harry Shaw, Ozzy Talking, p. 126)

Sabbath removed any guesswork regarding their desire to turn the world's youth to their lord Satan. In their song N.I.B. the forces that used Ozzy as a medium pleaded with Sabbath's millions of young and impressionable fans to take Satan's hand and follow him:

Some people say my love cannot be true

please believe me, my love, and I'll show you

I will give you those things you thought unreal

The sun, the moon, the stars all bear my seal

Follow me now and you will not regret

leaving the life you led before we met

You are the first to have this love of mine

forever with me 'till the end of time…

Look into my eyes, you will see who I am

MY NAME IS LUCIFER, PLEASE TAKE MY HAND

Now I have you with me, under my power

Our love grows stronger now with every hour

Look into my eyes, you will see who I am

MY NAME IS LUCIFER, PLEASE TAKE MY HAND

Ozzy's influence on countless young people toward Satanism with lyrics like those above is apparent. Ozzy boasts "…the kids are coming up and saying, 'Hey Ozzy, Satan Rules'" (Harry Shaw, Ozzy Talking, p. 87)

The lyrics above represent Satan's lie. It is true that Satan offers a measure of "success" in this world but he cannot give the universe. The money and fame he offers in this world is but temporary and then those gullible enough to play the devil's game must pay for eternity. "Lucifer" of course is one of Satan's many names (Isaiah 14:12) and means "shining one". Lucifer played a significant role in bringing worship to God before He sought to rob God of His glory and direct worship to himself (Ezek. 28:13-19). Jesus Christ stated that Hell was created for the devil and his angels (Matthew 25:41). But Satan hates God's creation and wants to bring as many people to hell with him as possible. Black Sabbath, or at least the satanic forces using Ozzy Osbourne and Black Sabbath, recognized that they had been successful in drawing many young people to Satan through their music. In their song Master of Reality Black Sabbath fans are mockingly told that they have succumbed to Satan's power over their lives:

Your soul is ill, but you will not find a cure

Your world was made for you by someone above

But you choose evil ways instead of love

You made me [satan] master of the world where you exist

The soul I took from you was not even missed

Lord of this world…evil possessor…He's your confessor now!

Spin magazine recently pointed out that Ozzy Osbourne's has an autographed copy of one of Satanists Aleister Crowley's books. This should not be such a surprise as Osbourne wrote a song glorifying Crowley entitled Mr. Crowley. Osbourne also dedicated his album Blizzard of Oz to Aleister Crowley. (From Rock to Rock, p. 133) Crowley not only did rituals wherein he crucified frogs calling them "Jesus" and himself Satan while torturing them but wrote extensively about sacrificing children to Satan for power. If Ozzy has sacrificed anything beyond the dove whose head he bit off to gain more notoriety the public at large will probably not know of it until judgment day as it will probably not be aired anytime soon on MTV. One thing though that is a fact is that Osbourne has done Satan's bidding by his own admission. Moreover he has helped to sacrifice untold multitudes of souls to Satan as he has been used as a pawn to draw them into Satan's destructive web

[Outshined]

I'm sure the author of that piece of "journalism" is a big fan of The Godmakers as well...

You can even find "evil" in "Christian rock"! http://www.av1611.org/crock/crockex1.html

[lisajo]

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dead horse

US<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Wack ,,,,punch............Slam,

This dead horse is starting to smell!

[Outshined]

Originally posted by lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 04:41 PM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dead horse

US<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Wack ,,,,punch............Slam,     

This dead horse is starting to smell!

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Wait! I have an emoticon somewhere...

[lisajo]

Originally posted by Outshined+Nov 18 2005, 02:42 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 04:41 PM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dead horse

US<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Wack ,,,,punch............Slam,     

This dead horse is starting to smell!

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Wait! I have an emoticon somewhere...

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LOL>>>>>>>>>way to funny

[Guest Member_Deleted]

Originally posted by Outshined+Nov 18 2005, 04:42 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-lisajo@Nov 18 2005, 04:41 PM

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dead horse

US<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Wack ,,,,punch............Slam,     

This dead horse is starting to smell!

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Wait! I have an emoticon somewhere...

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LOL

[Guest LDSister]

Ozzy's Suicide Solution

One should also consider the fact that Ozzy's influence goes far beyond the occult. The demons that possess Ozzy not only inspired him to murder his own wife and take his own life but they channel music through Ozzy that encourages his millions of fans to not only live lives in rebellion to God but to take their own lives. Parents of children who claimed that Ozzy's song "Suicide Solution" inspired their children to kill themselves sued Ozzy repeatedly but unsuccessfully. Ozzy's "Suicide Solution" declares:

Evil thoughts and evil doings

Cold, alone you hang in ruins

Thought that you'd escape the reaper

You can't escape the Master Keeper…

Where to hide, suicide is the only way out

One boy, 19-year-old, John McCollum was found dead after shooting himself in the head while listening to Ozzy's Suicide Solution. Still compressed on his head were headphones with Ozzy's Suicide Solution coming out of the speakers. The Times reported that paramedics and officials at local hospitals in Los Angeles were swamped with emergency as a result of Ozzy's concerts. Some of these visits resulted in death. (Times, June 16, 1986) The McCollum's attorney said that he had received "at least 20 phone calls from parents indicating their kids committed suicide - not just listening to rock music but specifically to Ozzy Osbourne." John mcCollum's brokenhearted father lamented:

"They know what they are putting out . . .They have no hesitation to sell your kids down the drain . . . you see a perfectly normal kid there who doesn't show any signs of depression at all - happy. Then six hours later, he's dead. Nobody can explain it. The only thing we know is that he was listening to this music."

Ozzy Osbourne callously dismissed all the lawsuits referring to those who had committed suicides as freaks:

"Parents have called me and said, 'When my son died of a drug over-dose, your record was on the turntable.' I can't help that. These people are freaking out anyway, and they need a vehicle for the freakouts." Only the most ignorant or those in denial would claim that a song with suggestive lyrics about suicide, sung with passion by ones rock hero could not push adolescents who battle with deep emotional problems over the edge.

The Institute for Bio-Acoustics Research, Inc. (IBAR) evaluated the song Suicide Solution in one of the court hearings. IBAR discovered subliminal lyrics that were not printed on the lyric sheet. The subliminal lyrics they found declared, "Why try, why try? Get the gun and try it! Shoot, Shoot, Shoot". After the command to kill oneself IBAR found that there is then hideous laughter. The IBAR institute reported that the subliminal lyrics were recorded one and one-half times slower than normal and would only be understood after hearing the song several times. IBAR stated that the subliminal lyrics "are audible enough that their meaning and true intent becomes clear after being listened to over and over again." IBAR's intense investigation of the song also revealed that Suicide Solution contained hemisync tones, which "result from a patented process that uses sound waves to influence an individual's mental state. The tones have been found to increase the rate at which the human brain assimilates and processes information." IBAR stated that the use of hemisync tones contributed to John McCollum's vulnerability to Ozzy's lyrics suggesting Suicide.

Perhaps an answer to John McCollum's father as too how his son could change from a seemingly happy child overnight to committing suicide can be understood when one realizes the power of music. Medical Dr. and brain specialist, Richard Pelegrino, who is a consultant to the entertainment industry, in an article for Billboard magazine speaks of the incomparable power of music upon the human brain, stating that music has the uncanny power to "…trigger a flood of human emotions and images that have the ability to instantaneously produce very powerful changes in emotional states." Pellegrino went on to state:

"Take it from a brain guy. In twenty-five years of working with the brain, I still cannot affect a persons state of mind the way that one simple song can." (Billboard, January 23 1999)

[Outshined]

No, it's not comedy; it's an actual website! Just as THIS ONE is...

EVIL!!! EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEVILLL!!

[pushka]

Thanks for those interesting Website links Outshined...

Thanks for the interesting Biog. stuff on Ozzy, Ari!

Btw, although George Harrison may have been worshipping his 'god' Krishna, it still doesn't prove he was a 'satanist'!

I think I'll carry on listening to my extensive record collection, many of which I've listened to with my children...and carry on being who I am, not a devil worshipper or anything, just a normal mum doing what I can :)

My children seem to be pretty well balanced too, so I'm not gonna interfere with their musical preferences...btw, my son doesn't listen to Marilyn Manson because he said he either abused or killed a dog in one of his concerts (correct me if I'm wrong...I may have forgotten exactly what he told me)...so, far from being influenced to be evil because of M.M.'s songs/actions on stage, my son has disassociated himself from him...without any influence on my part whatsoever...he's only 12 btw.

[Guest LDSister]

Originally posted by pushka@Nov 18 2005, 06:10 PM

Thanks for those interesting Website links Outshined...

Thanks for the interesting Biog. stuff on Ozzy, Ari!

Btw, although George Harrison may have been worshipping his 'god' Krishna, it still doesn't prove he was a 'satanist'!

I think I'll carry on listening to my extensive record collection, many of which I've listened to with my children...and carry on being who I am, not a devil worshipper or anything, just a normal mum doing what I can :)

My children seem to be pretty well balanced too, so I'm not gonna interfere with their musical preferences...btw, my son doesn't listen to Marilyn Manson because he said he either abused or killed a dog in one of his concerts (correct me if I'm wrong...I may have forgotten exactly what he told me)...so, far from being influenced to be evil because of M.M.'s songs/actions on stage, my son has disassociated himself from him...without any influence on my part whatsoever...he's only 12 btw.

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______________________

Smart boy...like his mom!

I've not heard of that about Manson...I would think he'd be in big trouble with animal rights if he did a stupid thing like that. But then again, look how stupid

Frank Zappa was, taking a crappa on stage...where was the health dept.?

BTW, I tried to dig up some info about Harrison, but I couldn't get anything in print, so I'll have to transcribe it from the video...let me know if you're interested...or we'll just chalk it up! lol

[pushka]

I'd be really interested, as I'm a big Beatles fan, and especially of George Harrison and John Lennon...

Must admit that I don't fancy having to spend money to see the video which apparently proves them to be satanists, as I do feel this is probably a money making exploitative venture on the part of the website concerned...wouldn't object to receiving a copy of it on a cdr tho, if anyone is able to 'capture' it? :)