Reasons Why You Left?

[Winnie G]

Recently wile flying home from my father-in-laws funeral my husband finely replied about something I whispered to him at after the funeral. (Did you remember church being this pagan when you were growing up?) we attended the next Sunday service as well.

We were both raised as Anglicans / Episcopalian.

He said your right I don’t ever remember church growing up being that way. I said Oh I remember but seeing it face to face again was a rude awaking. No wonder we both looked else were.

We were surprised how much we remember all the reply’s and even the Apostles Creed.

Need less to say we did not repeat every thing. They modanised it from the way I remember it as well.

I was wondering of those who have converted to the church have you gone back and seen the reasons why you left?

The Apostles Creed

I BELIEVE in God, the Father almighty,

creator of heaven and earth.

I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit

and born of the Virgin Mary.

He suffered under Pontius Pilate,

was crucified, died, and was buried.

He descended to the dead.

On the third day he rose again.

He ascended into heaven,

and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit,

the holy catholic Church,

the communion of saints,

the forgiveness of sins,

the resurrection of the body,

and the life everlasting.

Amen.

[shanstress70]

Recently wile flying home from my father-in-laws funeral my husband finely replied about something I whispered to him at after the funeral. (Did you remember church being this pagan when you were growing up?) we attended the next Sunday service as well.

We were both raised as Anglicans / Episcopalian.

He said your right I don’t ever remember church growing up being that way. I said Oh I remember but seeing it face to face again was a rude awaking. No wonder we both looked else were.

We were surprised how much we remember all the reply’s and even the Apostles Creed.

Need less to say we did not repeat every thing. They modanised it from the way I remember it as well.

I was wondering of those who have converted to the church have you gone back and seen the reasons why you left?

The Apostles Creed

I BELIEVE in God, the Father almighty,

creator of heaven and earth.

I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit

and born of the Virgin Mary.

He suffered under Pontius Pilate,

was crucified, died, and was buried.

He descended to the dead.

On the third day he rose again.

He ascended into heaven,

and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit,

the holy catholic Church,

the communion of saints,

the forgiveness of sins,

the resurrection of the body,

and the life everlasting.

Amen.

What part of the Apostle's Creed do you have issues with, Winnie? Just curious...

[Winnie G]

the holy catholic Church,

the communion of saints,

There is also a whole confession that went along with the service before you line up to knell at the front of the alter and receive communion, wine and paper tin wafers, taste like past and I remember being nagged by my grandmother for trying to remove the little round wafer that stuck to the roof of my mouth.

No we did not recive communion.

[Ray]

I didn’t hear about ‘The Apostles Creed’ while I was a member of the ‘Church of Christ’, but here is what I think about it now.

The Apostles Creed

I BELIEVE in God, the Father almighty,

creator of heaven and earth.

Jesus Christ actually created these heavens and this Earth, and He has also been our Mediator since the beginning

I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God, our Father, but He is not the only Son of God.

He was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit

True, but Jesus Christ is not the Son of the Holy Spirit

and born of the Virgin Mary.

Some people believe Mary remained a virgin after giving birth to Jesus, and I do not agree with them there.

He suffered under Pontius Pilate,

True, Pontius Pilate was governor over the land during that time

was crucified, died, and was buried.

True, but He was laid or “hidden” in a sepulcher, not “buried” in the sense some may think of as a grave

He descended to the dead.

True, and do you know what He did while with them?

On the third day he rose again.

He ascended into heaven,

How many times?

and is seated at the right hand of the Father.

All so true, but He is not always sitting down

He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit,

the holy catholic Church,

depending on your definition of “catholic”, I agree

the communion of saints,

that’s what we called it

the forgiveness of sins,

to those who Repent with Faith in Christ

the resurrection of the body,

ALL bodies

and the life everlasting.

though some people won’t have the same quality or degree of life.

Amen.

[Maureen]

...(Did you remember church being this pagan when you were growing up?) we attended the next Sunday service as well.

We were both raised as Anglicans / Episcopalian....

Pagan

The term pagan is from Latin paganus, an adjective originally meaning "rural", "rustic" or "of the country." As a noun, paganus was used to mean "country dweller, villager." From its earliest beginnings, Christianity spread much more quickly in major urban areas (like Antioch, Alexandria, Corinth, Rome) than in the countryside, and soon the word for "country dweller" became synonymous with someone who was "not Christian," giving rise to the modern meaning of "pagan."[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism

I'm curious Winnie how you are defining pagan here. Are you asking "Do you remember church being this rustic?" or are you asking "Do you remember church being this "not Christian"? And if it's the second one, what felt not Christian about it? They did not mention God or Jesus? Or was it just the ceremony itself that you found different than what you're use to?

the holy catholic Church,

the communion of saints,

There is also a whole confession that went along with the service before you line up to knell at the front of the alter and receive communion, wine and paper tin wafers, taste like past and I remember being nagged by my grandmother for trying to remove the little round wafer that stuck to the roof of my mouth...

catholic here with a small "c" means universal, so you can read that as the holy universal Christian church (see dictionary.com)

communion with the saints can be read as - fellowship with the body of believers of Christ

The wafers are wafers and usually just melt in your mouth, I've never had any problem with them.

Many churches now also have a social get-together after the service and they serve coffee.

M.

[Winnie G]

I

am curious Winnie how you are defining pagan here. Are you asking "Do you remember church being this rustic?" or are you asking "Do you remember church being this "not Christian"? And if it's the second one, what felt not Christian about it?

I guess pagan is not the right word for it under that thought. It was very Roman, carrying cross-fallowed by alter attendance, sp (Al ca lights) swinging incense what my Jewish stepfather called swing the stink. I loved him 

Oh yes I felt like a Christian wile I attended church growing up but there was something missing.

The wafers are wafers and usually just melt in your mouth, I've never had any problem with them.

You never had one slip to the roof of your month? Oh, I did many times and yes they would melt but I could not help but pick them off the roof of my mouth.

As fare as the other wording I was just unconvertible with it.

I’m not conferrable with man made words for faith.

I don’t need to repeat the same words week after week as fare as some kind of rite in order for the Lord to know me.

Its like the Book of Mormon and praying in public places. Do you see what I mean.

[Maureen]

I don’t need to repeat the same words week after week as fare as some kind of rite in order for the Lord to know me.

Its like the Book of Mormon and praying in public places. Do you see what I mean.

You say the same prayer (the same words) week after week when you take sacrament - is that different?

A church is a public building - people shouldn't pray in church? I am probably not understanding what you mean by praying in public.

M.

[Jason]

I

am curious Winnie how you are defining pagan here. Are you asking "Do you remember church being this rustic?" or are you asking "Do you remember church being this "not Christian"? And if it's the second one, what felt not Christian about it?

I guess pagan is not the right word for it under that thought. It was very Roman, carrying cross-fallowed by alter attendance, sp (Al ca lights) swinging incense what my Jewish stepfather called swing the stink. I loved him 

Oh yes I felt like a Christian wile I attended church growing up but there was something missing.

The wafers are wafers and usually just melt in your mouth, I've never had any problem with them.

You never had one slip to the roof of your month? Oh, I did many times and yes they would melt but I could not help but pick them off the roof of my mouth.

As fare as the other wording I was just unconvertible with it.

I’m not conferrable with man made words for faith.

I don’t need to repeat the same words week after week as fare as some kind of rite in order for the Lord to know me.

Its like the Book of Mormon and praying in public places. Do you see what I mean.

Winnie,

I don't understand what you're complaining about? You don't think that Roman Catholics are Christians, and therefore anything that even remotely resembles Catholicism is therefore pagan?

As Maureen said, you say the same prayers for blessing the Sacrament, when baptising, when doing vicarios work in the Temples, the Endowment....what's your complaint? I mean, if you're going to pick on Christians for repitition, you should take a look in your house first, eh?

With few exceptions, I hear the exact same prayer over food at ever Mormon's house I visit. Even though there's no prescribed prayer method for food, it seems that the entire Rocky Mountain west prays the same.

[mom_of_jcchlsm]

I'm just taking a stab at things here -- I think she means that some churches are very ritualistic, and that that feels strange to her now, although it didn't when she was young because it was what she was raised knowing.

[Winnie G]

Jason

Here again you assume I am complaining or picking on someone or something.

My first and only thought at the start of this Topic was how after 28 years returning to witness a service that at one time I was comfortable with and yet, how uncomfortable I was many years later.

I wanted more witch lead me to finding the LDS way of life.

My remarks about the repetitive service out of the BOOK OF COMMON PRAYER.

Nothing is different but from the priest, thank heavens he was intuned and I think will make a difference in that small fishing village.

You have to invasion a liturgy of chanting and responding to what the priest is chanting.

It is now so foreign to me and yet both my husband and myself could remember the congregational responses and did not need to look at the prayer book to respond.

mom_of_jcchlsm

Thank you very much.

[shanstress70]

I

am curious Winnie how you are defining pagan here. Are you asking "Do you remember church being this rustic?" or are you asking "Do you remember church being this "not Christian"? And if it's the second one, what felt not Christian about it?

I guess pagan is not the right word for it under that thought. It was very Roman, carrying cross-fallowed by alter attendance, sp (Al ca lights) swinging incense what my Jewish stepfather called swing the stink. I loved him 

Oh yes I felt like a Christian wile I attended church growing up but there was something missing.

The wafers are wafers and usually just melt in your mouth, I've never had any problem with them.

You never had one slip to the roof of your month? Oh, I did many times and yes they would melt but I could not help but pick them off the roof of my mouth.

As fare as the other wording I was just unconvertible with it.

I’m not conferrable with man made words for faith.

I don’t need to repeat the same words week after week as fare as some kind of rite in order for the Lord to know me.

Its like the Book of Mormon and praying in public places. Do you see what I mean.

It was kind of a pet peeve of mine when I was LDS that prayers were always of the same format, and many times the exact same words, no matter who was saying them, like Jason said. I think that prayers should come from the heart, and should sound like a conversation. I also don't think it's necessary to close your eyes and fold your arms. I think that God would like us to feel comfortable with Him and be able to just talk to Him, no matter what we're doing.

I always found the following piece of a meal blessing funny - it kind of gets squashed together: "... nourish and help our bodies..." always sounds like "...nourish up our bodies..." Or maybe that's just the way southern Mormons say it!

[prisonchaplain]

the holy catholic Church,

the communion of saints,

The "holy catholic church," is not the Roman Catholic Church, but the church, universal and triumphant. It is a generic term for all believers. Keep in mind that there was no division of denominations at the time the Apostle's Creed was formulated.

The communion of saints is not a phrase that endorses praying to Catholic Saints, but an understanding that we follow in a line of "saints"--believers who have gone before us--and they continue to cheer us on, and await us at our final home-going.

Did you understand these phrases differently?

[inactivetx]

I also came from an Episcopal background but don't feel the church is 'pagan'. Granted I keep quiet during the Nicence (sp) Creed but have no real problem with the Apostle's Creed.

When I really miss the Episcopal Church is at Easter. The LDS Church doesn't do enough to celebrate the season while the other church has a full week long list of events each bringing the joy of Christ's atonement to life.

My dh is not a member and we compromise on my re-activity in the LDS by attending the Episcopal service at 8:30 as a family and then I attend LDS Sacrament at 11:30. The contrast is quite stark and I feel the spirit so much more at Sacrament.

InActiveTx

[Jason]

The communion of saints is not a phrase that endorses praying to Catholic Saints, but an understanding that we follow in a line of "saints"--believers who have gone before us--and they continue to cheer us on, and await us at our final home-going.

I is also not a phrase the prohibits the veneration (not praying) to Catholic Saints. Catholics don't pray to the Saints, the ask them to pray on their behalf. No different than asking your neighbor to say a prayer for you.

[prisonchaplain]

I is also not a phrase the prohibits the veneration (not praying) to Catholic Saints. Catholics don't pray to the Saints, the ask them to pray on their behalf. No different than asking your neighbor to say a prayer for you.

My wording was imprecise. You, of course, are right, that Catholics, in essence, pray through not to the saints.