Record High Temps in U.S. - Pending Doom

[Vort]

I agree with you that the scientific observation that the earth is experience a climate change does not imply that humanity is completely to blame, but the way you put it makes it out to be a false dilemma.

Wrong. That's not how I put it; that's how the lefties put it. That's why the term is "anthropogenic global warming".

[bcguy]

I can recall way back into the 70s, 80s, 90s that the record or max temps for the region reached 98F. Two years ago, all those records where smashed. For a whole week, the temperatures reached a staggering 105F. We never at least in my life, ever seen such high temps.

I do know that global warming is being created by excess C02. But that is not the biggest contributor. It is also the melting of the polar ice caps and the melting of the Quadrillion ton methane permafrost in the arctic that is going to cause some serious temperature increases. Methane has a much more profound effect on trapping heat then C02 does. A Arctic ice cap that is ice free, absorbs heat, rather then reflecting it back into space.

By increasing the arctic temperatures, the methane deposits will be released into the atmosphere in record amounts.

Now as far as heat is concerned, summer and drought should be the biggest concerns and storing away large amounts of water, food is a good way to survive extreme summer droughts and forest fires.

[bcguy]

Here, take a look at the carbon dioxide levels at Mt Mauna Loa, the observatory on the Hawaiian islands. NOAA has been taking C02 test there since the 1960s.

Draw your conclusion, Its pretty obvious it is from burning of fossil fuels..and the ever increasing population expansion of the world.

World population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[bcguy]

Here, take a look at the carbon dioxide levels at Mt Mauna Loa, the observatory on the Hawaiian islands. NOAA has been taking C02 test there since the 1960s. Trends in Carbon Dioxide

Draw your conclusion, Its pretty obvious it is from burning of fossil fuels..and the ever increasing population expansion of the world.

World population - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Vort]

I can recall way back into the 70s, 80s, 90s that the record or max temps for the region reached 98F. Two years ago, all those records where smashed. For a whole week, the temperatures reached a staggering 105F. We never at least in my life, ever seen such high temps.

What were the record highs in BC 150 years ago? 500 years ago? 1000 years ago?

Your data set is far, far too small to draw any reliable conclusions.

I do know that global warming is being created by excess C02.

And you "know" this...how? Do you firmly understand exactly how all the variables related to climate interact? Did the Spirit bear witness to you? Or do you "know" because a bunch of people claimed it was so?

Here, take a look at the carbon dioxide levels at Mt Mauna Loa, the observatory on the Hawaiian islands. NOAA has been taking C02 test there since the 1960s.

How about since the 1860s? What were the CO2 levels in the 1760s? Or in the 1760s BC?

In fact, your data set is so incredibly limited that you can have no firm idea how modern CO2 levels are being affected. Right?

Draw your conclusion, Its pretty obvious it is from burning of fossil fuels..and the ever increasing population expansion of the world.

Pretty obvious because that's what you have been told, not pretty obvious because it's pretty obvious.

I already know your opinion, BC. I am not asking for your opinion, because your opinion is not worth anything. I want real evidence. So far you have suggested some short-term numbers that, at most, indicate trends no more than 50 years old. Please provide actual, hard evidence of anthropogenic global warming. Then provide solid evidence that such a thing is deleterious -- moreso, say, than the earth returning to the ice age conditions that have typified its recent history.

[annewandering]

Lefties? Please. I think the term you are more accurately looking for is Liberal. Not all lefties are liberal. In fact in my family with three 'lefties' only one of us is liberal.

[Vort]

Lefties? Please. I think the term you are more accurately looking for is Liberal. Not all lefties are liberal. In fact in my family with three 'lefties' only one of us is liberal.

This is why "leftie" is exactly the term I'm looking for. Most lefties are not "liberal" in any reasonable definition of the word.

[annewandering]

This is why "leftie" is exactly the term I'm looking for. Most lefties are not "liberal" in any reasonable definition of the word.

Well that leaves me confused. So you are not saying it is the liberals that are pushing this idea of global warming but it is left handed people?

[Echo2002]

Who's to say this isn't a normal weather cycle?

[LittleWyvern]

Wrong. That's not how I put it; that's how the lefties put it. That's why the term is "anthropogenic global warming".

Whoever thinks that antrhopogenic global warming means that humans are entirely and completely to blame obviously do not understand the science behind it. The fact that climate cycles occur naturally is a known fact as this point (as we know by measuring solar output). I don't think any serious climate scientist has ever held that climate cycles are completely created by humans, that would be stupid.

Well that leaves me confused. So you are not saying it is the liberals that are pushing this idea of global warming but it is left handed people?

"leftie" is just a term used for name-calling, I doubt it has any real meaning.

[annewandering]

"leftie" is just a term used for name-calling, I doubt it has any real meaning.

Actually that is why I was pointing it out. It is not the topic of this thread but it is wrong to insult people here isnt it? And its not good to insult left handed people either. We still get enough of that even today,

[estradling75]

Whenever I hear people saying we need to stop global warming or that mankinds influence is a big factor that needs to stop I like to look at these charts

This one shows the temperate changes for nearly half a million years. The human influence is a tiny tiny dot at the very end.

It would appear the earth has been happy reeling from one extereme to another long before we had any influence on the matter.

Then there is this next one

It only covers 11,000 years (since the last ice age) and man kinds influence is a slightly bigger dot at the very right.

To make the claim that we can somehow stop this process that has been going on for thousands of years without our help by capping our CO2 emission and freezing our progress is simply stupid. Instead of trying to stop it, we should be preparing to adapt to it.. which is wildly different from what the current political agenda is

[Vort]

Whoever thinks that antrhopogenic global warming means that humans are entirely and completely to blame obviously do not understand the science behind it.

Whoever doesn't think that "anthropogenic global warming" means "global warming caused by humans" does not understand the plain meaning of words. LittleWyvern, please look up the definition of "anthropogenic".

"leftie" is just a term used for name-calling, I doubt it has any real meaning.

"Leftie" is a term used to replace the ill-used American political term "liberal". Modern American Leftists are rarely liberal in the true, historical sense of the word. They are hidebound and reactionary, in many ways almost the polar opposite of liberal.

[LittleWyvern]

Whoever doesn't think that "anthropogenic global warming" means "global warming caused by humans" does not understand the plain meaning of words. LittleWyvern, please look up the definition of "anthropogenic".

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here, a definition debate would take this thread way off-topic.

[Vort]

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here, a definition debate would take this thread way off-topic.

There's no "agree to disagree" in this case, LittleWyvern. The term "anthropogenic global warming" means what it means. Your claim that it does not is simply wrong.

[Vort]

Well that leaves me confused. So you are not saying it is the liberals that are pushing this idea of global warming but it is left handed people?

C'mon, anne. You know exactly what I'm saying. In computer programming terms, words are "overloaded". If I said that the cops arrested a neighbor who was "high", would you ask if I lived next door to a skyscraper?

[pam]

Actually that is why I was pointing it out. It is not the topic of this thread but it is wrong to insult people here isnt it? And its not good to insult left handed people either. We still get enough of that even today,

Anne he isn't talking about left handed people. He's talking about the political term.

[annewandering]

Anne he isn't talking about left handed people. He's talking about the political term.

True although I had always thought that meant liberal. :)

[Vort]

True although I had always thought that meant liberal. :)

If you acknowledge that "leftie" means "liberal", what are you complaining about?

[annewandering]

lol but YOU said it didnt!! anyway enough. :)

Today it is raining and warm. The temp has to be in the 50's. Daffodils are blooming. This is NOT the usual climate for this area.

Still remember the dog days in the 40's? Me either but I have heard about them. For many years it was very hot in NY and the Northeast. Dont remember if it was widespread. Remember the dust bowl days? No rain for years in the OKlahoma area. By the way they are experiencing the same thing now.

I think it will take a lot more years before we know if its just a usual kind of fluctuation. We have not kept records for nearly long enough to be able to tell for sure whats going on.

When I was in college I took a class supposedly on geography. It ended up being on climatology since that was the professors interest. He was one of the early leaders in the global warming warnings. It was predicted then that within 50 years we would be well into the greenhouse effect and it would be way past the time when we could change things that would soon lead to a new ice age. He said we had 50 years absolute maximum to get it controlled. Well that was in 1970. So where are we today? Do we see the massive warming that covers the planet in a coat of clouds from the evaporation of the oceans which then leads to the massive freezing because the sun is blocked by the heavy cloud layers. It looks pretty clear to me outside today.

Admittedly he was in the earlier vanguard but we are only seeing bits and pieces of their prophesies.

[Vort]

lol but YOU said it didnt!! anyway enough. :)

Anne, I'm not understanding you. Do you seriously fail to comprehend my meaning, or are you just having fun stirring the pot?

[HEthePrimate]

How I wish that were true. "Global warming", or as the Lefties now want to rename it, "Global Climate Change", has been a political football since its inception. I am not sure at this point that it is even possible to depoliticize the issue.

It is a political football only because of the deniers.

Consensus? Really? I was always taught that science depended on observations and real data, not just the opinions of the majority of scientists. Which of course is a particularly naive view; everything in science is basically a popularity contest, and the only reason it usually works is that "popularity" is generally determined by best-fit with the facts.

Nonsense. It's not as though the scientists are pulling their opinions out of thin air. They observe. They record the data. They look for patterns. They use logical reasoning to try to figure out what the data mean. The data consistently point to a certain conclusion, and so the vast majority of climatologists agree about it.

But therein lies the problem: The great majority of the scientific community is politically leftist, and pronouncedly so.

This may be a "which came first, the chicken or the egg" situation. I suspect that the reason a majority of scientists are "leftist" is because the Right has been very unfriendly to science, not because the scientists have some sort of agenda. You have Right Wingers insisting that school teachers should teach religion in the classroom and call it science. You have Right Wingers cutting funds for education and for scientific research. You had the Bush Jr. Administration that told scientists to rewrite their findings on climate research in order to support the Administration's agenda. Of course scientists don't like being treated that way, and will tend to support those who do value science.

You use the word "probably" as though it means scientists are really quite unsure of their conclusions, and so they can be easily dismissed. I say "probably" actually means "probably," as the data strongly suggest the conclusions that the earth is actually getting warmer, and that human activity contributes to the warming trend. I'd rather base my actions on what is "probably" true, based on the evidence, rather than on what is "probably not" true, or "less likely."

Anthropogenic global warming has serious enough consequences that it seems wisest to act now to reverse the trend as much as possible, and to make preparations for the changes that will come despite our best efforts. Even without global warming, who wants polluted air?

[john doe]

Last year in Utah many of the ski resorts were open until July 4th. This year they probably won't make it to Memorial Day. That's all the proof needed by those who believe in it to show how quickly the climate changes, and it's obviously caused by humans since we were around to witness it. At this rate we will be waterskiing on Mirror Lake in January next year.

[annewandering]

Anne, I'm not understanding you. Do you seriously fail to comprehend my meaning, or are you just having fun stirring the pot?

hmmm I seriously read that you said lefty was not liberal. Other than that I was just referring to the fact that lefty is used in a derogatory way often and it is insulting to left handed people. Another topic so I am content to drop it if you are. :)

[annewandering]

Last year in Utah many of the ski resorts were open until July 4th. This year they probably won't make it to Memorial Day. That's all the proof needed by those who believe in it to show how quickly the climate changes, and it's obviously caused by humans since we were around to witness it. At this rate we will be waterskiing on Mirror Lake in January next year.

There is a lot of thought that we might be able to water ski in the Artic Ocean soon. Within 10 years even. That would be an interesting feat but probably still to cold there to enjoy!