Movie ratings and what is exceptable

[Guest Dalbinder101]

You can determine watching a movie by doing a number of things. Going to Kids-In-Mind: Movie ratings & parents' reviews that actually work, going to imdb, talking to people who have seen it. The truth is there are a number of ways. My examples of movies that should not have been R rated is proof that not all R rated movies are bad. "There Will be Blood" for example. No swearing, no sex, no nudity, it has one very brief violent scene but it occurs off screen and thats it. Why was it R rated? who knows but it should be a Pg-13 movie. and how do you know no one has ever gained salvation by watching an R rated movie? You can't say that

[Backroads]

You may consider Card's article "great", but it is demonstrably wrong. The Brethren have, in fact, specifically counseled to avoid 'R'-rated movies..

Not doubting you, but I've always wondered where this counsel was. I always feel at a loss when it comes up in conversation.

[idahommie]

Are you guys trying to make me feel guilty while anticipating the season premier of "The walking dead"? Sorry, my bad , I like zombies........

[Vort]

and how do you know no one has ever gained salvation by watching an R rated movie? You can't say that

Of course I can. Salvation is not gained by watching popular movies.

[Vort]

Not doubting you, but I've always wondered where this counsel was. I always feel at a loss when it comes up in conversation.

Interestingly, Card himself provides one quote:

Ensign, May 1986, p 43

Don't see R-rated movies or vulgar videos or participate in any entertainment that is immoral, suggestive, or pornographic.

Like Card, you can rationalize away what this says. But you cannot honestly say that our leaders have not offered very specific counsel to avoid R-rated movies.

[Guest Dalbinder101]

Of course I can. Salvation is not gained by watching popular movies.

Sorry I thought you were saying If you watch R rated movies you will not gain salvation.

If you go to lds.org and type in R rated movies you will only fined ONE president of the church who specifically said dont watch R rated movies. Also he was talking to the YOUTH of the church. Also if you notice, all the talks that mention it are directed at the youth. I'm guessing that if the primary had a special conference they could hear don't go to PG-13 movies. Does that mean we dont go see them? Just because the president of the church says something it doesnt mean it's doctrine. Sometimes they are stating their opinion. (I mean didn't Brigham Young say he believed that there were people living in the sun?) The way we find out is if it is constantly being taught and published today. Now adays we hear "dont watch entertainment that detracts from the spirit." Its really up to us now. There are a lot of R rated movies that are very inspirational and sometimes for no reason at all its given an R rating.

[Vort]

Sorry I thought you were saying If you watch R rated movies you will not gain salvation.

Not sure why. I didn't say anything like that.

If you go to lds.org and type in R rated movies you will only fined ONE president of the church who specifically said dont watch R rated movies. Also he was talking to the YOUTH of the church. Also if you notice, all the talks that mention it are directed at the youth. I'm guessing that if the primary had a special conference they could hear don't go to PG-13 movies. Does that mean we dont go see them? Just because the president of the church says something it doesnt mean it's doctrine. Sometimes they are stating their opinion. (I mean didn't Brigham Young say he believed that there were people living in the sun?) The way we find out is if it is constantly being taught and published today. Now adays we hear "dont watch entertainment that detracts from the spirit." Its really up to us now. There are a lot of R rated movies that are very inspirational and sometimes for no reason at all its given an R rating.

I'm trying to understand your mental model. Do you think this life is merely a performance? That, after we die, we stand before God, and he says, "Okay, it looks like you danced the dance pretty well. You kept the rules, mostly. So I grant you entrance."?

Is that who and what you think God is, and what you think this life is about?

Do R-rated movies help you to become more Christlike? Or do they numb and deaden your spiritual sensitivity?

Go ahead. Watch R-rated movies. Enjoy. Quite dramatically fun to watch a man's head blown off. And you can find endless ways to justify watching such "entertainment", as Card has done. Say that it only applies to youth (since we teach youth the law of chastity, too, and everyone knows the law of chastity does not apply to adults).

I will teach my children to hearken to prophetic counsel and try not to think themselves wiser than their leaders. I will try to teach them to ignore self-justification, as you exemplify. I will also try to teach them not to be concerned when others call them "sheep" for being so foolish and mindless as to think prophetic counsel should be taken seriously.

[Guest Dalbinder101]

Well I don't know where you go to church but the Law of Chastity is taught to everyone where i go to church. I'm also not saying ALL R rated movies are good. they aren't There is a BIG difference between American Pie and Slumdog Millionaire. The American Pie type movies are ones to avoid. But Slumdog Millionaire is ok. It's all about content. You can't trust anything the MPAA does. Frankly i have seen a few R rated movies that have really inspired me to be better. Slumdog Millionaire for example is one of the most inspirational movies to come out in the past 10 years. United 93 is another very powerful movie. There are a lot of "numbing" movies, those ones, yes avoid. The only point i'm making is we cant say ALL R rated movies are bad. Yes, a lot are. But there are a few that in the end SHOULD NOT have been R rated. There is no sex, no violence, no swearing. (There are R rated movies out there like these) And these movies are ok to watch.

[Vort]

I'm also not saying ALL R rated movies are good. they aren't There is a BIG difference between American Pie and Slumdog Millionaire.

How do you know? Maybe American Pie has shown me the pathway to God. Who are you to say otherwise? Maybe NC-17 movies and porn sites expose me (so to speak) to the beauty of God's creations. Who are you to say that I shouldn't watch porn, given how edifying I find it?

You can't trust anything the MPAA does.

If the MPAA says, "We have found this movie sufficiently offensive to give it an R rating", then I can trust perfectly well that it's a movie I do not want in my brain.

The only point i'm making is we cant say ALL R rated movies are bad.

Sure we can. But even if that is not justified, we can say that ALL R-rated movies should be avoided. Nothing wrong with that.

And these movies are ok to watch.

President Benson disagrees with your assessment. Why ought we to trust you over him?

[Guest Dalbinder101]

You've really taken all what i said out of context. Read all of my post...Not ALL R rated movies are bad because some R rated movies have NO VIOLENCE, NO SEX, NO NUDITY, NO SWEARING. NOTHING! Sometimes the MPAA rate things R because a younger audience won't understand the importance of what the movie is addressing and to avoid bad word of mouth they rate it R so that younger audience wont spread bad word of mouth.

[Guest Dalbinder101]

How do you know? Maybe American Pie has shown me the pathway to God. Who are you to say otherwise? Maybe NC-17 movies and porn sites expose me (so to speak) to the beauty of God's creations. Who are you to say that I shouldn't watch porn, given how edifying I find it?

Also. Big difference. All prophets in the past 30 years or so have repeatedly told us to not watch Porn, it is brought up in every General Conference. It is repeatedly mentioned. R Rated movies havent been specified in a very long time...

[Vort]

You've really taken all what i said out of context.

I have taken nothing you said out of context. If you think I have, please provide an example.

Read all of my post...

I have. Your thesis appears to be, "It is morally acceptable and even virtuous to watch some R-rated movies." I disagree.

Also. Big difference. All prophets in the past 30 years or so have repeatedly told us to not watch Porn, it is brought up in every General Conference. It is repeatedly mentioned. R Rated movies havent been specified in a very long time...

Much R-rated stuff is pornographic. But the Church is a world-wide organization, and the ratings system apply at best to a minority of Church membership.

We should be greatly restricting our viewing of PG-13 and PG materials. If it gets an R rating, that should be enough to make it off the list. Consider that President Benson offered his counsel in 1989. Do you suppose that R-rated movies have gotten less violent and sexual or more Godly in content in the last 23 years?

Edited September 29, 2012 by Vort

[Dravin]

You've really taken all what i said out of context. Read all of my post...Not ALL R rated movies are bad because some R rated movies have NO VIOLENCE, NO SEX, NO NUDITY, NO SWEARING. NOTHING! Sometimes the MPAA rate things R because a younger audience won't understand the importance of what the movie is addressing and to avoid bad word of mouth they rate it R so that younger audience wont spread bad word of mouth.

Now you've peaked my curiosity as I'm not even sure I've encountered a PG-13 film that meets those criteria. Can you provide an example of such a movie?

[Guest Dalbinder101]

Yes i agree a lot of R rated stuff is pornographic. But not all of it. What i feel you took out of context was when i said "Not all R rated movies are bad" Because you didnt put my reasoning behind it and i'm not going to again becasue i already have 3 times. But i agree. A lot of r rated movies are bad, but there are a few yes a few that re good and shouldnt have been r rated in the first place.

[Guest Dalbinder101]

Now you've peaked my curiosity as I'm not even sure I've encountered a PG-13 film that meets those criteria. Can you provide an example of such a movie?

There Will Be Blood is a perfect example. There is like one or two minor cuss words (when i said no swearing i meant F bombs and S words since those many peole consider the "major ones") and one scene of violence that occurs off screen. It was R rated purely because it has asomewhat dark tone.

[Dravin]

Is this review of the correct movie? There Will Be Blood [2007] [R] - 3.7.3

►A man holds a gun to the head of a sleeping man, he asks him questions and then shoots him in the head (we see blood spray, the man twitches, gasps and dies).

That's not off screen violence when you're seeing sprays of blood and twitching bodies. We also have this:

► A man strikes a young man hard in the face several times, the young man falls to the ground and we see that he has a bloody nose; the man drags him by the hair, straddles him, continues to slap him in the face, smears his face with oil and pushes his face into the ground. A man throws a young man to the floor and rolls bowling balls at him (the young man is struck in the foot with one and he yells).

That's violence.

[Guest Dalbinder101]

Is this review of the correct movie? There Will Be Blood [2007] [R] - 3.7.3

That's not off screen violence when you're seeing sprays of blood and twitching bodies. We also have this:

That's violence.

The first one, from what i remember is so dark you cant see it. The second one is nothing short of a Pg-13 violence.

[Vort]

The first one, from what i remember is so dark you cant see it. The second one is nothing short of a Pg-13 violence.

So in other words, you are hardened enough to be numb to such scenes of violence, and therefore you think there is nothing spiritually damaging about watching them as a form of entertainment.

[Misshalfway]

I don't watch R rated stuff as a general rule. I've made a couple of exceptions. "Glory" with Denzel Washington was one of them. And I was "pushed" to see Schindler's list but I walked out half way through.

Anyway, what I want to say is that I can testify that this kind of discretion works. It helps me keep my mind spiritually clear. It keeps influences (subtle and otherwise) out of my being. Just the other night, my husband and I tried a program that his coworker said we "had" to see. We were both disgusted and turned it off. I actually really loved the distain that came out of me. It felt good to have that kind of quick repulsion for the yuck and the longing for a return to the light. I've decided over and over in my life that I want this state of being MORE than I want entertainment. It's not that I'm a tight wad about it or judgy if someone tells me they like a certain show. It's just that I really like feeling clean and connected to heaven. And that means that I avoid popular media sometimes. Even when the show is actually a pretty "great" creative production.

[Dravin]

The second one is nothing short of a Pg-13 violence.

Your claim wasn't that there were R-rated movies that weren't any worse than P-13 movies, your claim was:

Not ALL R rated movies are bad because some R rated movies have NO VIOLENCE, NO SEX, NO NUDITY, NO SWEARING. NOTHING!

Of which you proposed There Will Be Blood as an example with the adjustment of swearing to be no serious swearing (and implicitly) adjusted no violence to be no onscreen violence.

[Backroads]

Are you guys trying to make me feel guilty while anticipating the season premier of "The walking dead"? Sorry, my bad , I like zombies........

"The Walking Dead" is one of the shows that fills my "Lost" niche.

Back to topic...

I don't generally seek out Rated-R movies, but I do admit that my profile on this site lists "The Shawshank Redemption" as one of my favorite movies.

[Traveler]

Ratings are interesting - I know an LDS director that felt to communicate a very strong family message in a movie he was directing. He wanted the movie to be available to families to help families deal with a possible situation. He was very careful to make sure there was no violence; there is no swearing and there is no nudity or skin. Yet his movie received an R rating. The reason for the rating becomes obvious in the title. So watch for this movie soon to be in theaters - titled "Amber Alert". If you have not guessed the movie is rated R because of subject matter. It will be sad if many LDS forgo this movie just because of the R rating not realizing the movie is intended to help families deal with a very difficult possibility and situation that some of us (including our very innocent children) may be forced to deal with either directly or indirectly.

The Traveler

[Irishcolleen]

pluggedinonline.com is an excellent resource for determining which movies, music, video games, tv shows, etc... are worth watching from a moral standpoint. It describes what is uplifting or objective in terms of sexuality, substance abuse, violence, spiritual content, etc... It is very in-depth. For instance, a movie may be rated G, but my kids won't be able to see it if it treats being disrespectful to parents as normal. Pluggedin gives me the info I nee to make an informed decision.