Here we go again

[carlimac]

LDS Church: Aims of 'Ordain Women' detract from dialogue | Deseret News

I thought the graphs were especially telling. Oh well. To each his/her own. Some people just have to rock the boat for a little attention.

[carlimac]

Oops, meant to post this under general discussion. Mods can change it if you want.

[estradling75]

Moved

[Meerkatarmy]

Good on them. I question the meaningfulness of any discussion without women involved

[Guest]

What makes you think women have no part in discussion?

[Just_A_Guy]

I thought the letter itself was worded very well and was quite conciliatory in tone. It's a shame that DesNews and KSL chose to present it primarily as a smackdown.

[Meerkatarmy]

What makes you think women have no part in discussion?

I'll eat my crusty socks if the discussion doesn't take place in a meeting where only priest hood are allowed

[applepansy]

I'll eat my crusty socks if the discussion doesn't take place in a meeting where only priest hood are allowed

I wouldn't be one bit surprised to find that the RS and YW presidencies are involved in discussions. :) And, why wouldn't they be? Women have been in Leadership roles in the church since the RS was organized. Their opinions and responses are valued. I would be shocked if the General RS President said they were shut out of meetings about the role of Women in the church.

[carlimac]

I thought the letter itself was worded very well and was quite conciliatory in tone. It's a shame that DesNews and KSL chose to present it primarily as a smackdown.

Depends on what you mean by a smackdown. I think the letter was pretty straightforward.

"Women in the Church, by a very large majority, do not share your advocacy for priesthood ordination for women and consider that position to be extreme."

"Your organization has again publicized its intention to demonstrate on Temple

Square during the April 5 priesthood session. Activist events like this detract from

the sacred environment of Temple Square and the spirit of harmony sought at

General Conference. Please reconsider."

That's not flowery RS language. That's just plain old telling it like it is.

[Guest]

My husband and I always discuss what was talked about in the Priesthood meeting. We can watch it online if we want to. It's in the Ensign the month after conference. We're not banned from any discussion.

I don't see why men can't have a meeting where they discuss things pertaining to their roles and callings and specific issues and bond as brothers. Women do their "own" things all the time.

[carlimac]

I'll eat my crusty socks if the discussion doesn't take place in a meeting where only priest hood are allowed

Like I said...some people just like to rock the boat.

[Wingnut]

I thought the letter itself was worded very well and was quite conciliatory in tone. It's a shame that DesNews and KSL chose to present it primarily as a smackdown.

I very much agree, on both counts.

I'll eat my crusty socks if the discussion doesn't take place in a meeting where only priest hood are allowed

To be fair, the priesthood session of General Conference (heck, all sessions of General Conference) are not discussion-like at all. They are instructional. Less "class participation," more "professor lecture." Also, to be fair, men are not allowed into the Conference Center during the Women's session of Conference, except for the First Presidency.

Meerkatarmy, you'll find me to be one of the more liberal members of the board, and I've been quite vocal about increased rights and visibility for women in the Church. I try to stay somewhat objective (some may disagree with that :) ), and this is an issue that I have a hard time with at present. I understand and sympathize with both sides. I feel the desires are righteous, but the methods are, perhaps, not well thought out and somewhat lacking.

[Meerkatarmy]

I have no desire to hold the pristhood I just respect people that stand up for what they believe in

[dahlia]

This people always want it both ways - priesthood for women, but men stay out of RS because the women need their 'space.' On campuses it's separate organizations for minorities, but heaven help you if all of the other organizations don't have minority members.

I'm getting kinda tired of it.

btw - Are these women being disingenuous when they say the support the Church and its leaders and then do this stuff?

[Meerkatarmy]

I have never seen anything that they have written that says they don't want men in RS.

As a uni student at my uni at least there is not rule you have to have minority members or anything like that

[Meerkatarmy]

Hough to be fair I'd do anything to get out of RS

[skippy740]

Here's the problem I would see if women held the priesthood:

Men would no longer participate and contribute. Why? Women just do it better. There would be less of a feeling of 'need' and 'belonging' and 'duty' because there are typically a LOT more women at church who could then fulfill these duties.

No, it wouldn't happen 'all at once', but it would be a gradually increasing problem.

Without men needing to hold the priesthood, would they strive to be worthy holders of the priesthood - ready and willing to give a blessing as faithful home teachers? I would guess that the desire, drive, and duty to do so would be reduced.

Of course, later on, where would you draw the line of 'who goes to Elder's Quorum?" and "who gets to go to Relief Society?"

Just some thoughts.

[carlimac]

Hough to be fair I'd do anything to get out of RS

You don't need an excuse. Just get out if you want to. I know that's not the Lord will for you but you do have your free agency.

[Meerkatarmy]

RS is good and the teachedr was awesome this week it is just the old bats that make really igronant remarks that make me want to strangle them

[dahlia]

There are rules and there are demands. People get awfully snippy if they feel they aren't represented in student orgs across the spectrum. Yet, there are separate spaces for minorities (usually blacks) at many schools, including public universities, which shouldn't allow it since they take tax dollars.

I will sometimes use the word 'uni' as I've picked it up from the Brits and Canadians on an academic message board I'm on, however, Americans don't really use it. Since you did use it, perhaps you are British or Canadian and aren't familiar with the racial issues on US campuses?

Re men in RS, I was making a statement based on a lifetime of experience regarding women complaining about stuff and then demanding the exact opposite for themselves.

[Meerkatarmy]

Usally blacks?! Hmm I am seeing big differences between the UK and US.

Where I am from we use evidence and facts to back up our opinions not just tired old arguments with no factual base

[carlimac]

RS is good and the teachedr was awesome this week it is just the old bats that make really igronant remarks that make me want to strangle them

Those old bats have most likely been on this earth a whole lot longer than you. Maybe you should respect their life experience a little more.

[Meerkatarmy]

Those old bats have most likely been on this earth a whole lot longer than you. Maybe you should respect their life experience a little more.

Age doesn't equal wisdom as pointed out by some of the remarks the make. Homeles people are willful sinners, judgemental statements about people with disabilities etc etc

[estradling75]

I have no desire to hold the pristhood I just respect people that stand up for what they believe in

Correction you respect people that stand up for what you believe in... I think you would show a whole lot less respect to people who stand up for something you disagree with...

RS is good and the teachedr was awesome this week it is just the old bats that make really igronant remarks that make me want to strangle them

ding ding ding.

[Dravin]

Usally blacks?! Hmm I am seeing big differences between the UK and US.

Where I am from we use evidence and facts to back up our opinions not just tired old arguments with no factual base

Really?

I'll eat my crusty socks if the discussion doesn't take place in a meeting where only priest hood are allowed

Is threatening to eat crusty socks if you are incorrect what passes for the use of evidence and facts in the UK?

I have never seen anything that they have written that says they don't want men in RS.

As a uni student at my uni at least there is not rule you have to have minority members or anything like that

Evidence and facts? I'm sure it exists, one could easily find a suitable citation, but I don't see it here. Unless we're accepting you citing your experience, but that's exactly what Dahlia did and it appears to be objectionable to you.

RS is good and the teachedr was awesome this week it is just the old bats that make really igronant remarks that make me want to strangle them

Where is the evidence and facts that RS is good and that your teacher was awesome this week? We have a similar situation to the above concerning using personal experience as a satisfactory form of evidence.

You may indeed use evidence and fact where you are from to back up opinions, but rather amusingly, there is no evidence of that in your posts. Which leaves me wondering where the evidence and fact is to back up your opinion that where you are from you use evidence and fact to back up your opinion.