Evidences Of The Great Apostasy

[vinny15]

Ok so were getting somewhere.

So why do you believe in reincarnation? What made you think it was real.

What made you think the lds church was a hoax?

[Jason]

Ok so were getting somewhere.

So why do you believe in reincarnation? What made you think it was real.

What made you think the lds church was a hoax?

You're asking the wrong questions, and not answering the others.

[vinny15]

I dont understand. Why didnt you jsut answer it.

[Jason]

I dont understand. Why didnt you jsut answer it.

That's what I'm asking you. Why do you believe Jesus needed to incarnate in more than one place?

Then I'll respond.

[CrimsonKairos]

It's like watching a tennis match...first I crane my neck to the left, then I crane my neck to the right, then back to the left...

C'mon guys, you're killing me here!

[Jason]

You're right CK. I'll take up his questions while I wait for a reply for mine.

So why do you believe in reincarnation? What made you think it was real.

Like anything outside the realm of the scientific method, I cannot prove that reincarnation is real. I believe that the faithful in Jesus' day believed in reincarnation, and there are several New Testament verses that teach it and allude to it.

Off the top of my head, John the Baptist's disciples asked him if he wasn't Elias or some other prophet reincarnated, for example.

What made you think the lds church was a hoax?

Vinny, Mormonism is true. Just not in the way you think it is.

[vinny15]

<div class='quotemain'>

I dont understand. Why didnt you jsut answer it.

That's what I'm asking you. Why do you believe Jesus needed to incarnate in more than one place?

Then I'll respond.

Oh Im sorry. I forgot. I believe this because of this.

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be cone fold, and one shepherd.

John 10:16

This was his sermon on the mount. I also believe that a loving god would visit all his children and not make them rely on the word of one people.

You're right CK. I'll take up his questions while I wait for a reply for mine.

<div class='quotemain'>

So why do you believe in reincarnation? What made you think it was real.

Like anything outside the realm of the scientific method, I cannot prove that reincarnation is real. I believe that the faithful in Jesus' day believed in reincarnation, and there are several New Testament verses that teach it and allude to it.

Off the top of my head, John the Baptist's disciples asked him if he wasn't Elias or some other prophet reincarnated, for example.

What made you think the lds church was a hoax?

Vinny, Mormonism is true. Just not in the way you think it is.

In what way than?

[Jason]

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be cone fold, and one shepherd.

John 10:16

This was his sermon on the mount. I also believe that a loving god would visit all his children and not make them rely on the word of one people.

Bible scholars tell us that this verse is talking about Israel and Judah. Not Middle East and somewhere in the Western Hemisphere.

But you can interpret it differently if you wish.

I believe that a loving God would not ask us to rely on the words of any book. I believe a loving God will save us all unconditionally.

I believe if we did not require a belief to be born, we will not require one when we die.

In what way than?

In the same way that Buddhism, Taoism, Jainism, Judaism, Orthodox Christianity, Hinduism and every other religion are true.

All religions will lead us back to God (or what you call being exalted in the Celestial Kingdom).

[Guest Yediyd]

Will you two just accept the fact that the other guy isn't going to see it your way? Jason, you are waisting your time...Vinny will never see it your way, his mind is made up...and Vinny...vise versa!!!!

A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still!!!

Just agree to dissagree already!!!!!

[vinny15]

<div class='quotemain'>

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be cone fold, and one shepherd.

John 10:16

This was his sermon on the mount. I also believe that a loving god would visit all his children and not make them rely on the word of one people.

Bible scholars tell us that this verse is talking about Israel and Judah. Not Middle East and somewhere in the Western Hemisphere.

But you can interpret it differently if you wish.

I believe that a loving God would not ask us to rely on the words of any book. I believe a loving God will save us all unconditionally.

I believe if we did not require a belief to be born, we will not require one when we die.

In what way than?

In the same way that Buddhism, Taoism, Jainism, Judaism, Orthodox Christianity, Hinduism and every other religion are true.

All religions will lead us back to God (or what you call being exalted in the Celestial Kingdom).

Thats a very optimistic outlook.

:)

[Jason]

I think it certainly qualifies as the "Good News".

[CrimsonKairos]

If it were true, it'd be the best news in the history of time. Seriously.

[vinny15]

God doesnt make it that easy.

"I never said it would be easy I only said it would be worth it" -Jesus Christ

If every religion is the right one and everyone will return than you are defying god a bit. arent ya?

[CrimsonKairos]

Christ never actually said that vinny. It's on a poster, and while I think the quote is cool, it's not from Christ's mouth (as in sciptural record).

[Jason]

If it were true, it'd be the best news in the history of time. Seriously.

Lucky for you, if it is true, then you don't have anything to worry about. :)

God doesnt make it that easy.

God does, you don't.

If every religion is the right one and everyone will return than you are defying god a bit. arent ya?

Nope.

[vinny15]

Christ never actually said that vinny. It's on a poster, and while I think the quote is cool, it's not from Christ's mouth (as in sciptural record).

Wow dont I feel dumb. Ive seen it in my house all my life and couldve sworn Ive seen a scripture at the bottom.

<div class='quotemain'>

If it were true, it'd be the best news in the history of time. Seriously.

Lucky for you, if it is true, then you don't have anything to worry about. :)

God doesnt make it that easy.

God does, you don't.

If every religion is the right one and everyone will return than you are defying god a bit. arent ya?

Nope.

How do you know god makes it that easy.

THis is a test. Am I right?

I dont mean to pry, but many people think the way you do to hide a past so that they dont feel so guilty.

[CrimsonKairos]

I remember the hilarious poster some missionaries showed me on my mission. It reversed the quote, and under a picture of the pope it said:

I never said it would be worth it, I only said it would be easy.

Of course, I have respect for the Catholic faith (both Holy Roman and Greek Orthodox), but the poster cracked me up. Hey, as a missionary, you gotta' stay sane and laughter helps alot. B)

[Jason]

How do you know god makes it that easy.

Why not?

I dont mean to pry, but many people think the way you do to hide a past so that they dont feel so guilty.

Guilty of what? Sinning?

Vinny, why would you even think that people would leave the LDS church because they wanted to sin?

[vinny15]

Is that a serious question?

Are you really serious.

People leave the lds church a lot because they want to sin.

Did you vent your self from reality for 20 years.

It happens more times than I can count.

I remember the hilarious poster some missionaries showed me on my mission. It reversed the quote, and under a picture of the pope it said:

I never said it would be worth it, I only said it would be easy.

Of course, I have respect for the Catholic faith (both Holy Roman and Greek Orthodox), but the poster cracked me up. Hey, as a missionary, you gotta' stay sane and laughter helps alot. B)

LOL I know... Im with the missionaries all the time. I take them on splits once a week(maybe two times)lol. They are some crazy guys, but very spiritual. I love them.

[BenRaines]

I would remind all that personal attacks are not appropriate. To call someone a sinner or to imply so would mean that you are their judge. Judge not least ye be judged.

You are all welcome to share opinions but I just want to detour this from becoming a personal attack about who is a sinner and who isn't and uneducated guesses.

Thank you,

Ben Raines

[vinny15]

Who isnt a sinner. Everyone is. I was merely asking if he left becuase he wanted to sin.

It fits doest it. I did ask didnt I?

[the Ogre]

Cultural phenomenon maybe. I don't think we need apostles and prophets because Christ fulfilled all during his visit to Earth and the established Bible scriptures (OT & NT). I think He's told us everything we need to know about salvation and we do not need current prophets.

So then by your reasoning it might be said we are still in the dark ages. I think it is good to think of the dark ages as the silent ages where G-d did not actively converse with humanity.

If it is true then that we are still in the silent ages, then the period of apostasy in question at the beginning of this thread still exists and began when the last apostle received revelation from heaven.

I'm not saying you're wrong Vinny. I'm saying Mormonism isn't the only "right".

I love this line. I think there are many Mormons who would agree with you.

[prisonchaplain]

it might be said we are still in the dark ages. I think it is good to think of the dark ages as the silent ages where G-d did not actively converse with humanity.

Those Christians who believe the canon closed with the Bible are not suggesting that God has been silent for the past 1,920 years. Rather, that God has spoken eloquently and prolifically through his Word, and He continues to do so.

If it is true then that we are still in the silent ages, then the period of apostasy in question at the beginning of this thread still exists and began when the last apostle received revelation from heaven.

Does this mean that if there was no "silent ages," then there was no apostasy?

I'm not saying you're wrong Vinny. I'm saying Mormonism isn't the only "right".

Perhaps a more concrete question is whether Mormonism is the most right?

[Jason]

Is that a serious question?

Are you really serious.

People leave the lds church a lot because they want to sin.

Did you vent your self from reality for 20 years.

It happens more times than I can count.

It is a serious question, and I would like to see your statistics proving that "a lot" of people leave because they want to sin.

Knowing you don't have any statistical information to back up your theory, I would ask just how many people you've met personally who left because they wanted to "sin".

Then I want to know what sins they specifically wanted to commit: ie. Word of Wisdom, Adultery, Homosexuality, etc.

Then I'll tell you I have first hand experience with hundreds of people who left the LDS Church because of it's theology alone. And I'll point out that I am one of those people.

[Dr T]

I would answer like PC did. Thank you for your thoughts P.C. :)