When You Are Divorced And Lds....

[Guest Mishmash]

.......people treat you like a pariah. Suddenly you are no longer within the "inner circle". You are a freak. I think it may be human nature to treat divorced people that way when you are a church member. What do you guys think??

I know because when I was married and my ex-husband was in the Bishopric (the first Bishopric member in the family) I felt like a real part of the church AND my own family. I remember a young women with 2 very young children who was abandoned by her husband. I didn't know what to say to her really, I didn't want to offend her so any mention of my husband might have hurt her, so I walked on eggshells around her. Plus she acted somewhat weird, which I have since come to understand, so it was just...awkward....I "knew" that I would never be in her position, "the poor girl" was what I thought. Too bad she didn't choose her companion wisely, like I did. Wasn't I blessed?!

When my ex quit going to church, I figured he would snap out of it. All he did do was descend lower and lower until he was a lying adulterer. When he finally left, the people who knew us at church no doubt felt the same way as I did in the paragraph above. Also my many siblings.

Now I am in a "sub-group" that includes my drug-addicted, twice divorced sister, even though I have remained faithful to my covenants, have a son on a mission (in ENGLAND, how lucky can you get, plus he's doing great!), my oldest daughter makes more money than me, goes to college and is active in the church, my 15 yr old son is more than any parent could ask for in a son, as are my two younger daughters.

My church leaders have been wonderful to me...I'm talking about the people (other women) who were very friendly with me before all this and then barely acknowledged my presence--as if divorce was something communicable. It's been 5 years since the divorce and I am still firmly shut out.

I will not let it deter me from going to church of course...I just wondered what the concensus out there, or if anyone has had similar experience/feelings.

[Palerider]

What part of England is your son serving in??????? I served in England myself and have a son serving in Panama and he will be home at the end of July.

[Guest Yediyd]

huuummmmm...never thought about it this way....maybe THAT is why I don't feel like I fit in? I'm a seperated mother of two...convert of 3 yrs, so I never had a Temple marraige...but I don't feel comfotable in relief sociaty...never have.

I am in the primary now and I like it much better.

[pam]

I actually know of what you speak. I was living in a very close knit community and ward. We had all built homes at the same time (new subdivision) so basically were all moving in at the same time. Everyone was friends, everyone helped each other. You have no idea how many sod laying parties we had. Once people found out I was getting divorced I saw an instant transformation come over people. Those that used to call me everyday or I them no longer called. I was no longer invited to parties in the neighborhood. I became an outcast. I don't know if they felt I was then a threat or no longer fit into their mold. I moved to a new community and new ward and the people have been wonderful. It was a good move for me.

[the Ogre]

.......as if divorce was something communicable. It's been 5 years since the divorce and I am still firmly shut out.

I've been divorced now for five years. I've not remarried and am not currently interested. I can tell you the one joke that stuck to me from the movie Singles Ward is the label in the protagonist's forehead: "Recalled."

Often, I feel my lack of calling means I have "quaranteed" across my forehead.

Aaron the Ogre

[Palerider]

huuummmmm...never thought about it this way....maybe THAT is why I don't feel like I fit in? I'm a seperated mother of two...convert of 3 yrs, so I never had a Temple marraige...but I don't feel comfotable in relief sociaty...never have.

I am in the primary now and I like it much better.

you have me curious now.....are your children primary aged???? I am asking cause....some of the divorced couples I have worked with the sisters asked me tp please not call them to primary while they had kids in primary due to not feeling like they are getting a break away from their kids....

[Guest Yediyd]

I've said it before...I'll say it again, I don't fit into the "Mormon mold" I think it is just awkward...nobody means to be rude, they just don't want to hurt me by saying the wrong thing.

I can't tell you how many times a lady who has to give a talk about the priesthood or some "family" thing...has called me before she gave her talk to ask how she can not hurt or offend me in what she was going to say...Just this fathers day it happened again, and I wasn't even in relief sociaty, but I still got the nervious call...she told me that she just needed my imput...but well...it was awkward for me...again.

<div class='quotemain'>

huuummmmm...never thought about it this way....maybe THAT is why I don't feel like I fit in? I'm a seperated mother of two...convert of 3 yrs, so I never had a Temple marraige...but I don't feel comfotable in relief sociaty...never have.

I am in the primary now and I like it much better.

you have me curious now.....are your children primary aged???? I am asking cause....some of the divorced couples I have worked with the sisters asked me tp please not call them to primary while they had kids in primary due to not feeling like they are getting a break away from their kids.... nope...I got my call to the primary the same month my youngest one moved out of primary...I didn't see the connection then...but you have a point. I didn't ask to not be called...I was THRILLED to get the call. I LOVE to teach.

[Guest Mishmash]

Where is my son? He is in Leeds..actually, in a wee town called Selby.

So it seems I am not alone in this (I kinda figured as much, unfortunately). Thank you all for your replies!

Being a divorced woman sealed to someone who has left the church feels strange.

[Palerider]

Where is my son? He is in Leeds..actually, in a wee town called Selby.

So it seems I am not alone in this (I kinda figured as much, unfortunately). Thank you all for your replies!

Being divorced woman sealed to someone who has left the church feels strange.

I served in Leeds myself......I was only in 4 areas.....Huddesfield...Whitehaven.......Scarborough.....Worksop.

Yediyd...thats awesome what you said....

[Alaskagain]

I don't have a wonderful solution for you to try. Just want to offer some support. Yes, being divorced and in the church can be a lonely existence. Sounds like you have been doing a great job with raising your kids for the past five years.

I don't know that people see you as a "freak", just different, but I know it is easy to feel that way. It is a different relationship than what you had before, because before, you were a part of a couple. A lot of times, people don't know how to accept that difference and maintain the same level of friendship. But, the very same thing happens when we leave singlehood to get married. . . we leave behind our single friends because our marriage is more important to us, and we suddenly are involved in the married couples social set.

The only thing I can offer, is the example of a woman I knew in a ward I used to live in. Her husband left her and 3 children, and this lady was one of the most faithful members of the church I have ever known. She took all of her energies and poured them into the ward choir, boy scouts, parenting, earning a living, her callings. I never heard her make a negative comment about anybody. She went out of her way to be friendly to everyone who walked into the church building. Obviously, she was closer to some people than to others; some of her closer friends were married, and some were single. I think she retained her friendships with married women as a matter of purposeful choice --- she decided she simply wasn't going to give up the friends she had before. Still, I am sure those relationships changed - perhaps there was more individual socializing, or lunches with "the girls" rather than couple-oriented dinners, etc. But she still worked hard to maintain the friendships.

I don't know if that helps you any at all, but there it is. Maybe if you choose one friend that you used to have when you were married and tried to rekindle the friendship, relying heavily on the Spirit and Sisterhood, perhaps you could inch in to that "inner circle" place you want to be, or somewhere closer to it than where you feel you are now.

Good luck to you

[susieSA]

While I am not divorced... I have felt the same feelings that you all speak of...

I do not fit the "mormon mold"... My family sometimes think that they do... This honestly doesn't bug me... I like who I am...

I have never felt like I have fitted in RS (I was born into the church) and have NEVER enjoyed RS... Okay, I admit I enjoyed it when I was actually teaching a lesson once a month...

I grew up in a small(ish) town in South Africa... Allot of the members view themselves as "Molly Mormons" and try hard to fit that mold....

When I left that town for better things in one of the bigger cities my Stake President conveniently "forgot" my name.... Very nice... It seems that 8 years later he still does not "remember" my name.... Gives me the cold shoulder too... After a year I moved back to the small town & it was still the same....

I love to visit my parents (only short visits) but hate going to church in my hometown because of how some people seem to see me....

Now that we are not even living in South Africa at the moment I love to visit my old ward that we belonged to before leaving SA.... It took me months and month of hard work to feel like I actually belonged there... I would go home from church every Sunday almost in tears..... I hated it.... But what did it for me was that I eventually got a calling in RS... Still don't enjoy RS.... I am defenitly a Primary person... .I love it...

[Guest Mishmash]

Thank you for your advice, Alaskagain. I know that losing yourself in service to others is the only answer to heartache of this magnitude. This sister you know has really dealt with her divorce exactly as the Lord would have her do it.

We had moved around a lot and had only been in our ward for about a year when this all started, so I didn't have real close friends. After writing this post and reading the feedback, I think my real issue is being relegated to the outer rim by my own family, because no matter what any fellow church members do or how anyone else treats you, a person should be able to count on their own family.

I know it is all just part of the test...we all have our burdens....my family of origin was pretty messed up, definitely not your typical LDS family, not even close!! So that is just what I will have to work with.

My children will do better, I know it, and that is what I really care about! :)

[lair007]

This is my first attempt at posting anything on an LDS website... this conversation is interesting. I am twice divorced both times as a result of pornography addiction. Currently I am a student at BYU and for my senior research I am looking at the impact of rampant pornography use among the priesthood brethren on the sisters of the church. The stigma associated with divorce is closely linked I believe... as there has been little or no direction/support offerred to those who are suffering collaterally, specifically spouses and children. When a woman decides to divorce she is often isolated... try being divorced twice! Anyway, if anyone out there has had experience with this topic and feels to reply I would love to hear from you. I'm looking at how your spouse's use affected 1) your relationship 2) your sense of self-worth and desirability and 3) your feelings about the character of your spouse. Further, what support did you receive from your local authorities?

It's a struggle dealing with the stigma of divorce... and puzzling to picture the altenative... in both situations that I was involved in violence or infidelity resulted - I can not believe that the Lord would have either myself or my children remain in that situation... yet my decision to divorce was strongly resisted. Yesterday I talked to someone about working in the temple... I have a recommend and my children are grown... I was told that I needed to be divorced for 5 years before I could be considered for service as an ordinance worker... ironically my first husband who just finished is last bout with his addiction (which has persisted for over 30 years) within the past year received a call to work in the temple when he received permission to return to the temple... I'm puzzled....

[the Ogre]

This is my first attempt at posting anything on an LDS website... this conversation is interesting. I am twice divorced both times as a result of pornography addiction. Currently I am a student at BYU and for my senior research I am looking at the impact of rampant pornography use among the priesthood brethren on the sisters of the church. The stigma associated with divorce is closely linked I believe... as there has been little or no direction/support offerred to those who are suffering collaterally, specifically spouses and children. When a woman decides to divorce she is often isolated... try being divorced twice! Anyway, if anyone out there has had experience with this topic and feels to reply I would love to hear from you. I'm looking at how your spouse's use affected 1) your relationship 2) your sense of self-worth and desirability and 3) your feelings about the character of your spouse. Further, what support did you receive from your local authorities?

There is a CES study that reported 60% of LDS men have suffered from one sort of porn-addiction or another and that 100% of Aaronic Priesthood holding young men have seen pornography. I heard the above information from Bro. Eggett at the UVSC Institute. I have not read the study personally. I think that study might be interesting for your research, but I have no idea how accurate the information I heard is.

An associate of mine from work just went though a divorce because of his multiple on-line porn subscriptions. He is thinking about leaving the church because his Bishop "came out on her side." I have no idea what he is talking about, but he doesn't think porn is that big a deal. My divorce was not about porn, but about my ex leaving to marry another man (she met him at her work). I would say my associate's porn addiction affected his relationship with not only his wife, but his mother (she sided with his ex) and children. I have known this guy since I went to the Y in the early nineties and he has never had much self-esteem. My guess is that porn only deflated him further by subjectifying his relationships and understanding of women to such a degree that he doesn't deal with reality and misinterprets all advise and rejection. He hates his ex, his mother, his therapists, and his bishop. He can only visit his children when they are at his parents. His temper is so bad right now that unless he satisfies the courts regarding his emotional stability, he will never be able to be in an unescorted situation with his kids (I don't know much about the divorce details, but there has to be more going on).

I can’t stand being around him, but he is always going on about it and has gotten warnings about these conversations from management.

It's a struggle dealing with the stigma of divorce... and puzzling to picture the altenative... in both situations that I was involved in violence or infidelity resulted - I can not believe that the Lord would have either myself or my children remain in that situation... yet my decision to divorce was strongly resisted. Yesterday I talked to someone about working in the temple... I have a recommend and my children are grown... I was told that I needed to be divorced for 5 years before I could be considered for service as an ordinance worker... ironically my first husband who just finished is last bout with his addiction (which has persisted for over 30 years) within the past year received a call to work in the temple when he received permission to return to the temple... I'm puzzled....

Regarding your ex, I bet the dude lied to his ecclesiastical leaders. It happens. You could report it, but I doubt anything happens.

[Guest Username-Removed]

Mishmash,

Welcome! I've been divorced and totally -- wait ... T O T A L L Y agree with you! HAHA! Its hard for members to know what to do with Divorced couples, especially when you are the one still in your ward. They had no idea what to do with me other than speculate, gossip, and accuse just to see what would stick. I can laugh at it now, but it wasnt funny at the time. I do still get the occational comment, but they are few in far between.

My advice ..

MOVE TO ANOTHER WARD. Yep, dont stay in your ward anymore. Start fresh, keep your history to yourself at first. Let people know who you are.

Learn to have quick "come back" comments to try and see where people are coming from. For example, as a divorced father, the stereotype is that I am on the run, dont give child support and never see my kids.

I often, (and still do) get the comment from someone saying, "how often do you see your kids" to which I reply ... "As often as I can .... But you know, its really never enough is it?????" If they get offended, then you know who they really are.

Another one is. "Where does your ex-wife live?", to which I reply, (with a smile) "Why do you want to know that? Do you want to make a phone call?"

I know these sound jaded, but I am now in Utah. I've been divorced for 8 years, I've moved through three states over the last 3 years. Now, only in my present ward for just over a year and one of the people in my ward called me my nickname that my exwife used to call me ..... over 8 years a ago!!!

People will stop at nothing to try and find out anything they can, even if its just rumor based on 8 year old gossip.

If you get any of that in your situation, because men and women get it equally, just forgive the people that have too much time on thier hands. I've learned to only reley on Heavanly Father, my Bishop and a few other very close friends.

I can tell you after a year, my bishop and I are very close. He knows who I am, and I am amazed that he does not let gossip and rumor change is thoughts of me. I've been lucky to find someone like that. Its sad but true, there arent that many out there like him.

I had the very fortunate opportunity to meet a GA. He asked me what I would do differently. I told him I should have moved to another ward right off the bat. Instead, I endured such ugly rumors that I dare not even repeat. Just move, and ignore the rumor mungors.

[Guest Yediyd]

There is a CES study that reported 60% of LDS men have suffered from one sort of porn-addiction or another and that 100% of Aaronic Priesthood holding young men have seen pornography. .

What IS it with all this porn addiction?I just don't get it!!!! What is the big draw? I've seen some of these pictures....they are UGLY!!!! beautiful women made to look repulsive and vulger. Am I on some other planet? Like maybe Venis?...I just don't understand the attraction. I've seen porn moves, too...My friends used to get me to watch them with them because they had more fun watching ME than the movie!! This was long before my LDS days, BTW.

[Guest Username-Removed]

<div class='quotemain'>

There is a CES study that reported 60% of LDS men have suffered from one sort of porn-addiction or another and that 100% of Aaronic Priesthood holding young men have seen pornography. .

What IS it with all this porn addiction?I just don't get it!!!! What is the big draw? I've seen some of these pictures....they are UGLY!!!! beautiful women made to look repulsive and vulger. Am I on some other planet? Like maybe Venis?...I just don't understand the attraction. I've seen porn moves, too...My friends used to get me to watch them with them because they had more fun watching ME than the movie!! This was long before my LDS days, BTW.

I dont have a problem with looking at great looking woman. My mission president used to say, if you dont look once, you are not a man, if you look twice you are not a missionary.

Im always shocked at those studies with regards to Porn. Its sad, but I hope those married men are getting thier need taken care of. If they are, there is no need for it, and no excuse regardless one way or the other.

But so far, I dont think Porn is the issue here in this thread.

[Guest Mishmash]

.

WordFLOOD

Im always shocked at those studies with regards to Porn. Its sad, but I hope those married men are getting thier need taken care of. If they are, there is no need for it, and no excuse regardless one way or the other.

But so far, I dont think Porn is the issue here in this thread.

Thank you, WordFLOOD, for the welcome!

How interesting this has become......I was 10 years and 3 children into the marriage when my husband sat me down and to my utter shock, confessed to having had a serious porn addiction, that he'd already discussed it with the Bishop and it was never going to happen again. I couldn't believe my ears!!!! He then asked me, " You know what that means, right?" I realized he meant masturbation.

I was extremely concerned that he not feel my disgust and bewilderment (our personal life was...frequent, let's say...his needs were definitely being met! ) so I tried to comfort him and be NOTHING but supportive. I believed him when he said it would never happen again.

He became a Temple worker and stayed very close to the gospel, even becoming a Bishopric member at 33 (a bit young) due to his zealousness in wanting to serve.

After we moved again and he wasn't asked to be in the Bishopric when a position needed to be filled, he took it personally and quit going. He was CONSTANTLY on the computer, was into porn, shut everyone, even the children out of his life and took up with women on the internet. It took me quite a while to figure this out as I didn't think him capable of cheating. Not long after, he quit wearing his garments and began an affair with a co-worker. She was soon transfered to Texas and he followed.

That woman is but a distant memory for him now...he sowed his wild oats for a few years, then realized he wanted to be with his kids again, so he moved back here, met a woman who is very anti-mormon and married her. They drink and have porn readily available in their bedroom.

My fear is that my 2 younger daughters will be exposed to it...2 of my older children were sent out to his garage to retrieve Christmas ornaments last year and they found a large plastic container full of porn mags. Due to a court order I am forced to allow them to go over every other weekend, though my 15 yr old has never submitted to visitation and his father has accepted that.

Sorry for the length of this post!! I DO believe that porn can be the catalyst for the downfall of a person, his marriage and the well-being of his children. Satan has it all figured out and will wage a merciless war on our families...porn is one of his most powerful weapons!

It's so wonderful that knowing the true Gospel, we are assured that Satan will ultimately be defeated.

[Fiannan]

There is a CES study that reported 60% of LDS men have suffered from one sort of porn-addiction or another and that 100% of Aaronic Priesthood holding young men have seen pornography. I heard the above information from Bro. Eggett at the UVSC Institute. I have not read the study personally. I think that study might be interesting for your research, but I have no idea how accurate the information I heard is.

Let's not forget the young women and RS women who alsö surf porn sites.

Okay, at the moment I am rocking my youngest to sleep so I cam't make this long. However, I will say that porn addiction is extrenely rare and even in tose cases there is a dispute in psychology if one can really come up with valid diagnostic criteria to actually label "porn addiction".

[Guest Mishmash]

If your point is that a grown man CAN control himself, I believe it. Perhaps the word "compulsion" is more fitting than "addiction"?

[Fiannan]

And women need to control themselves too:

http://english.pravda.ru/society/sex/94318-0/

I'll post some stats on women and porn surfing soon.

[Fiannan]

Interesting info:

One of the great myths about pornography addiction is that it's only a male problem. Although the church has begun to recognize that pornography addiction is almost an epidemic among Christians, most ministry programs still focus on men as addicts and their wives as victims.

Yet the statistics are both startling and terrifying: One out of every six women, including Christians, struggles with an addiction to pornography. That's 17 percent of the population, which, according to a survey by research organization Zogby International, is the number of women who truly believe they can find sexual fulfillment on the Internet.

http://www.christianitytoday.com/tcw/2003/sepoct/5.58.html

One might note that these might just be women who feel their habit is a problem and think of it as an addiction. I have seen other articles that say young women are MORE likely than young men to become frequent users of internet porn and are way more likely than males to play around with pornographic SMS messages.

[Guest Mishmash]

I don't know about that..it seems any researcher can skew a studies results to satisfy their own personal agenda. I only know about my own experience and a few others.

This thread wasn't originally about this subject but it is a natural outcropping of the subject of divorce, which is noteworthy.

I'm sure there are more women looking at porn than there used to be, but I still say men have the market cornered- by far.

It's too bad that people are willing to be paid for creating it...if people (mainly women) refused to do it, no matter how much money they are offered, this world would be a better place.

[Fiannan]

My poblem with the porn issue in on several fronts though. These are:

A) Too many people in the church go all hysterical over porn and start labeling any viewing of it as "addiction" (a term used in religious circles but rarely in psychological arena in regards to porn) and I believe this can threaten marriages -- no, not the viewing of the porn in most instances but the reactions like "If he loved me he would not look at another woman, much less one without clothes or on the internet". Give me a break -- I knew this Catholic couple married for like 40 years. Sometimes he would go with his younger co-workers to the strip club and I once got into a conversation with her about that. When I asked her if she was jealose over it she responded that if some cute striper wanted his old wrinked backside she was welcome to him. I will note that one of her nephews went through a divorce and it w the first in her extended family -- which the family was really down on him for it.

B If viewing porn is an addiction then what's the criteria?

C) Unless one's husband is gay (and even then...) he will look at other women. The positive thing is that he notices other women and still is devoted to his marriage -- even when getting nagged about looking.

D) Porn is not a male thing anymore. On the whole less women view porn than men but if one looks at ages then things equal out. Numbers tend to be the same if you are looking at women and men under the age of 25. If you are looking at men and women over 60 then males will be the overwhelming majority of users. Also, I have yet to see men hosting parties where a bunch of people get together and look over items (if you know what I mean) -- and I am not talking about Tupperware.

I feel porn is indeed a morals issue and that viewing it is not good. However, if I were counseling someone whose husband had a tremendous habit of porn viewing and she asked if she should divorce him, and in all other areas of his life he ws wonderful, I would point her to the scriptures that condemn divorce, as well as the harmful impact of divorce on family members, and try to find a way to deal with it.

[Guest Yediyd]

Fiannan,

You can say and believe what you want...but until you have cleaned up the sticky socks under YOUR spouse's computer...who are you to say it is or isn't an addiction? I ended my marraige, but the last two years...before the end...I was in direct competition with his computer. I've been single for 8 yrs now, and just last month I broke down and got a computer...I never touched the computer that my husband and I had "together"....All I wanted to do was toss it out a window!!! That computer was the beginning of the end of our marraige.

Yes, all men will look at beautiful woman...but there is nothing beautiful about porn.