Caffeine

[Snow]

Originally posted by srm@Apr 13 2004, 06:39 PM

It was Hyrum Smith (in the 1840s) that said that hot drinks mean coffee and tea. It is not just the Church's current interpretation.

That may be but I am reasonably certain that the Church doesn't base it's currently policies on what Hyrum said.

[AFDaw]

Caffiene is addictive. In fact, as I stated earlier, it's so addictive that if introduced today, the FDA would not approve it. When you get addicted to ANYTHING (regardless of what it is) then you lose control over yourself. And I think we can all admit that that's not a good thing.

[Snow]

Originally posted by Tr2@Apr 13 2004, 07:06 PM

snow, your opinion is not required.

Trident, the back of your scalp is splotchy.

[Faerie]

Not to mention the sugar contained in said drinks...oy veh!

[DisRuptive1]

If we followed the word of wisdom to the word and not by the spirit then we'd be a bunch of fat asses dieing of heart disease at an early age. We wouldn't be drinking alcohol or caffeine but all that bread (made from grain) and lack of meat could really hurt us signifigantly. If that should ever happen it looks like we could get ourselves a D&C 139.

[juliejalago]

Originally posted by Outshined@Apr 13 2004, 02:53 PM

Some people actually eat the way the Bible commands in Leviticus; those laws were not rescinded, you know. Men just chose to stop following them.

Hmm. I thought that Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses, which did away with all those culturally-based minutia of rituals. I mean, do you really want to go back to animal sacrifice and stoning and all? I prefer to follow modern-day revelation, which supercedes the Levitical priesthood manual.

[Guest bizabra]

Originally posted by srm@Apr 13 2004, 02:54 PM

Why deny yourself something pleasurable if it's harmless?

Yeah and maybe drugs...if it's pleasurable. How about a little adultry...if it's pleasurable?

And do if because you want to, not because your church has a policy.

How about if it is from God?

Yeah, and sleep is pleasurable, and a hot bath, and foot rubs, and mint tea. Many other things are too.

Your point?

[Guest bizabra]

Originally posted by broadway+Apr 13 2004, 06:28 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (broadway @ Apr 13 2004, 06:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Ammon@Apr 13 2004, 01:20 PM

I love Coca-Cola. It is, hands down, my favorite beverage. A day without a Coke is like a day without sunshine. Nevertheless, I know that many members refuse to drink caffeinated beverages of any kind, especially here in California. And I remember as a youth in the 70s hearing General Authorities speak against caffeinated beverages such as Coke, Pepsi, etc.  Clearly, coffee and tea are out of bounds; that much is taught in the missionary discussions forthright. Nevertheless, what is the position on drinks such as Coke or candy such as chocolate? I honestly don't know at this point. Any insight?

EDIT: this question has nothing to do with my postings on other sites.  I am simply curious, as I thoroughly enjoy ice-cold Coca-Cola.

A really wise man, a friend of our family's who served as a bishop, said this...

If you get to the weekend and don't drink any sodas at all, and begin getting headaches and other withdrawal signs, you are drinking too much. The WOW is about health. Being addicted to a drug (regardless of how 'small' the drug may be) isn't healthy. If you can go all weekend without sodas and do not get affected by it, then odds are, you aren't drinking so much that it is unhealthy for you.

Pretty wise insight, isn't it?

broadway

How about if you are addicted to exercise? Or knitting? Or watching TV?

[Guest bizabra]

Originally posted by AFDaw@Apr 13 2004, 07:37 PM

Caffiene is addictive. In fact, as I stated earlier, it's so addictive that if introduced today, the FDA would not approve it. When you get addicted to ANYTHING (regardless of what it is) then you lose control over yourself. And I think we can all admit that that's not a good thing.

Anything? Even religion?

. . . just asking. . . . . .

[shanstress70]

Out of curiosity, if the word of wisdom says no hot drinks, why is iced tea prohibited, and not hot cocoa? Just always wondered that!

It seems that it is so fuzzy.

[Outshined]

Originally posted by juliejalago+Apr 14 2004, 12:07 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (juliejalago @ Apr 14 2004, 12:07 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Outshined@Apr 13 2004, 02:53 PM

Some people actually eat the way the Bible commands in Leviticus; those laws were not rescinded, you know. Men just chose to stop following them.

Hmm. I thought that Jesus Christ fulfilled the Law of Moses, which did away with all those culturally-based minutia of rituals.

I'm just pointing out that if people want to nitpick and preach over the dietary habits of Latter-day Saints, they have to realize that the biblical dietary laws were never rescinded, and that they were not "culturally-based", but from God.

Personally, I love bacon............

And Biz, the first step in overcoming your knitting problem is admitting that you have a problem.

[shanstress70]

The reason I ask this is because I have conflicting views on this subject.

In the past, tea was thought to have adverses effects, but new studies suggest otherwise. I think now, the benefits outweight these adverse effects. Is it possible that church officials will ever change this position, based on the new evidence?

Tea is good for the heart (decreases the risk of heart attack, stroke, lowers cholesterol), skin (protects from sunburn, and therefore, skin cancer), prevents colorectal and stomach cancer, and is good for bones and teeth.

http://magazines.ivillage.com/townandcount..._582728,00.html

This southern girl loves her some iced tea!

[Jenda]

Anything (and everything) in excess can be bad for you. I think the main point in the WOW is to take all things in moderation. Hopefully, that way, you might avoid addiction and the harmful side effects for those things that are not addictive.

[AFDaw]

Originally posted by bizabra+Apr 13 2004, 11:33 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bizabra @ Apr 13 2004, 11:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--AFDaw@Apr 13 2004, 07:37 PM

Caffiene is addictive.  In fact, as I stated earlier, it's so addictive that if introduced today, the FDA would not approve it.  When you get addicted to ANYTHING (regardless of what it is) then you lose control over yourself.  And I think we can all admit that that's not a good thing.

Anything? Even religion?

. . . just asking. . . . . .

Come on...Religion is not addictive.

[shanstress70]

Also, the way I read it, the Atkins diet would be against the WOW. We should eat mainly whole grains and little meat. So, why do people who eat the Atkins way get a temple recommend?

It just looks to me like certain parts are enforced and others aren't. If everyone else can pick and choose, why can't I? Let me drink tea, but not do Atkins, and still go to the temple.

Sorry, this IS a little 'tongue in cheek'. Just trying to make a point.

My father in-law, who was Branch President, eats meat like a freakin' caveman. Yet if I oredered a tea when I was with him, he would think I'd lost my mind!

[AFDaw]

Originally posted by shanstress70@Apr 14 2004, 07:22 AM

Also, the way I read it, the Atkins diet would be against the WOW. We should eat mainly whole grains and little meat. So, why do people who eat the Atkins way get a temple recommend?

It just looks to me like certain parts are enforced and others aren't. If everyone else can pick and choose, why can't I? Let me drink tea, but not do Atkins, and still go to the temple.

Sorry, this IS a little 'tongue in cheek'. Just trying to make a point.

My father in-law, who was Branch President, eats meat like a freakin' caveman. Yet if I oredered a tea when I was with him, he would think I'd lost my mind!

The key is everything in moderation. It's not healthy to eat a lot of meat, but one can technically do the Atkins diet and not eat a lot of meat. I know this because I use to work with a vegetarian who was on Atkins.

[shanstress70]

But it still says that meat should be eaten only in winter and in moderation.

What about people (most people) who eat it in the summer?

Plus, he doesn't eat meat in moderation, and still as a temple recommend.

And, why not allow tea in moderation?

[AFDaw]

Originally posted by shanstress70@Apr 14 2004, 07:40 AM

But it still says that meat should be eaten only in winter and in moderation.

What about people (most people) who eat it in the summer?

Plus, he doesn't eat meat in moderation, and still as a temple recommend.

And, why not allow tea in moderation?

It doesn't say that it should only be eaten in winter, it says that it is pleasing unto the Lord if its only eaten in winter, etc. The difference between meat and tea is tea also has caffiene, which is addictive. Meat is not addictive, you don't have meat withdrawls from not eatting a hamburger one day. When something is addictive, you allow it to control your body.

I would ask your father in law next time you're having a cookout and he's cooking up all beef hot dogs and sausage dogs and has a pot of baked beans on the stove with all sorts of meat it in about that aspect of the WOW. See what he says :) I'm curious to hear his opinion.

[shanstress70]

The difference between meat and tea is tea also has caffiene, which is addictive.

Coke also has caffeine, but that doesn't keep you out of the temple.

[Guest curvette]

Originally posted by Outshined@Apr 14 2004, 04:27 AM

Some people actually eat the way the Bible commands in Leviticus; those laws were not rescinded, you know. Men just chose to stop following them.

Many people believe that those laws were "rescinded" when Peter had his vision in Acts 10. I personally believe that his dream was more about Gentiles being accepted into the fold, but it could also have changed dietary requirements.

[srm]

Originally posted by Snow+Apr 13 2004, 07:16 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Snow @ Apr 13 2004, 07:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--srm@Apr 13 2004, 06:39 PM

It was Hyrum Smith (in the 1840s) that said that hot drinks mean coffee and tea.  It is not just the Church's current interpretation.

That may be but I am reasonably certain that the Church doesn't base it's currently policies on what Hyrum said.

Yes but to infer that is a new interpretation is also inaccurate.

[Guest Starsky]

Originally posted by bizabra+Apr 13 2004, 11:32 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (bizabra @ Apr 13 2004, 11:32 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Originally posted by -broadway@Apr 13 2004, 06:28 PM

<!--QuoteBegin--Ammon@Apr 13 2004, 01:20 PM

I love Coca-Cola. It is, hands down, my favorite beverage. A day without a Coke is like a day without sunshine. Nevertheless, I know that many members refuse to drink caffeinated beverages of any kind, especially here in California. And I remember as a youth in the 70s hearing General Authorities speak against caffeinated beverages such as Coke, Pepsi, etc.  Clearly, coffee and tea are out of bounds; that much is taught in the missionary discussions forthright. Nevertheless, what is the position on drinks such as Coke or candy such as chocolate? I honestly don't know at this point. Any insight?

EDIT: this question has nothing to do with my postings on other sites.  I am simply curious, as I thoroughly enjoy ice-cold Coca-Cola.

A really wise man, a friend of our family's who served as a bishop, said this...

If you get to the weekend and don't drink any sodas at all, and begin getting headaches and other withdrawal signs, you are drinking too much. The WOW is about health. Being addicted to a drug (regardless of how 'small' the drug may be) isn't healthy. If you can go all weekend without sodas and do not get affected by it, then odds are, you aren't drinking so much that it is unhealthy for you.

Pretty wise insight, isn't it?

broadway

How about if you are addicted to exercise? Or knitting? Or watching TV?

Moderation in all things... I don't believe any one scripture was meant to stand on it's own. through two or three witnesses shall every word be established:

Mosiah 4: 27

27 And see that all these things are done in wisdom and order; for it is not requisite that a man should run faster than he has strength. And again, it is expedient that he should be diligent, that thereby he might win the prize; therefore, all things must be done in order.

2 Ne. 2: 24

24 But behold, all things have been done in the wisdom of him who knoweth all things.

Prov. 4: 7

7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

When you are studying any promise or blessing, you should study every scripture pertaining to that blessing. Note the promise and blessing mentioned at the end of section 89. You will find these same blessings and promises in Isaiah 59...and many other places.

It is by knowing your scriptures (studying and praying and searching) that you will know and gain wisdom in all things....including health issues being covered by the WoW.

[AFDaw]

Originally posted by shanstress70@Apr 14 2004, 08:16 AM

The difference between meat and tea is tea also has caffiene, which is addictive.

Coke also has caffeine, but that doesn't keep you out of the temple.

I said it also has caffiene. I'm not so sure that caffiene is the ONLY reason we're told not to drink tea. It also has tanic acid in it, which is what they use to cure leather.

[shanstress70]

I always get the tannic acid argument, even from my husband. But tannic acid isn't a bad thing. Read the following from http://www.farsinet.com/hottea/tannic_acid_in_tea.html

A 1985 WHO global assessment of anaemia indicated that 51% of under-five-year-old children in developing countries were anaemic. Breast milk contains enough iron for infants up to four months of age. Artificial feeding and weaning diets, however, are often very low in iron, and the iron from vegetable sources is very poorly absorbed partly owing to inhibiting substances -- such as tannic acid in tea or phytates in flour -- or low levels of vitamin C in the diet.

Coffee and the tannic acid in tea will also decrease absorption of iron from foods.

Take iron supplements with orange juice, suggests the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center at Dallas. The vitamin C in the juice helps the body to absorb more of the iron, whether the iron is in the form of a supplement or from dietary sources (such as red meat, tofu or black-eyed peas). Avoid drinking milk or tea with iron supplements because the calcium and phosphorus in milk and the tannic acid in tea can interfere with iron absorption.

Medically, the tea leaf contains a number of chemicals good for one's health. The tannic acid in tea is known for its anti-inflammatory and germicidal properties. Tea also contains an alkaloid which stimulates the nerve center and the process of metabolism. Tea with aromatics in it helps dissolve fat and promotes digestion. This makes tea especially important to the meat centered diets.

[shanstress70]

Also,

http://www.teatalk.com/science/tannin.htm