More Changes to Come in 2019

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, Rob Osborn said:

We have this problem as LDS where we are afraid to mention anything whatsoever from inside of temples. Much of what goes on inside of temples is public knowledge. What we dont discuss are the sacred parts and details of our covenants with accompanying signs, tokens and rites.

Most non members don't care what happens in an LDS temple. It is of great importance to members, anti-LDS people, and absolutely no one else. 

[Rob Osborn]

Just as a refresher, for those who are unaware what happens inside our temples-

https://www.lds.org/temples/inside-temples?lang=eng

[BJ64]

1 minute ago, Rob Osborn said:

We have this problem as LDS where we are afraid to mention anything whatsoever from inside of temples. Much of what goes on inside of temples is public knowledge. What we dont discuss are the sacred parts and details of our covenants with accompanying signs, tokens and rites.

You have pointed out in my view what should not be discussed. There are things in the temple which we covenant not to reveal. Other than those things most of what goes on is taught in temple preparation classes or has otherwise been published by the church. Brigham Young himself said “Let me give you a definition in brief. Your endowment is, to receive all those ordinances in the house of the Lord, which are necessary for you, after you have departed this life, to enable you to walk back to the presence of the Father, passing the angels who stand as sentinels, being enabled to give them the key words, the signs and tokens, pertaining to the holy Priesthood, and gain your eternal exaltation in spite of earth and hell”

This lesson on lds.org reveals much more about the temple than I would speak of. https://www.lds.org/ensign/1995/02/endowed-with-covenants-and-blessings?lang=eng

[Rob Osborn]

6 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Most non members don't care what happens in an LDS temple. It is of great importance to members, anti-LDS people, and absolutely no one else. 

Every nonmember I have come to know and befriend asks me what happens inside of temples.

[Guest MormonGator]

4 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

Every nonmember I have come to know and befriend asks me what happens inside of temples.

I was 99% sure you'd say that. I knew it! I knew it! Of course they do, Rob. You seriously made my day. 

And oh yeah, 99% of my non member friends have never asked. 

Edited January 10, 2019 by MormonGator

[Rob Osborn]

6 minutes ago, BJ64 said:

You have pointed out in my view what should not be discussed. There are things in the temple which we covenant not to reveal. Other than those things most of what goes on is taught in temple preparation classes or has otherwise been published by the church. Brigham Young himself said “Let me give you a definition in brief. Your endowment is, to receive all those ordinances in the house of the Lord, which are necessary for you, after you have departed this life, to enable you to walk back to the presence of the Father, passing the angels who stand as sentinels, being enabled to give them the key words, the signs and tokens, pertaining to the holy Priesthood, and gain your eternal exaltation in spite of earth and hell”

This lesson on lds.org reveals much more about the temple than I would speak of. https://www.lds.org/ensign/1995/02/endowed-with-covenants-and-blessings?lang=eng

Aye, and I have never discussed the material we are asked not to. Some think we cant even discuss the names of rooms in the temple like the telestial room or the baptistry. This is all public knowledge and free info for anyone going through an openhouse.

[Rob Osborn]

6 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

I was 99% sure you'd say that. I knew it! I knew it! Of course they do, Rob. 

And oh yeah, 99% of my non member friends have never asked. 

Well, I dont have friends who live in a swamp or a lagoon...

[Guest MormonGator]

Whenever a prominent LDS member gets excommunicated (Kate Kelly, John Dehlin, Sam Young), they like to pretend it's a big deal. After all, it was in the New York Times! It feeds their ego, makes them feel important, makes them feel influential, etc. What these people (the excommunicated ones) fail to comprehend is that 97% of people don't read the New York Times, and outside of the LDS world, no one cares who gets excommunicated or not. It's a non-issue. 

It's the same for what goes on in the temples. Oh, I'm sure there are exceptions, but in reality 97% of people outside of the west don't care what happens in LDS temples. It's a non issue for them just like who the church has excommunicated. 

[Rob Osborn]

8 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Whenever a prominent LDS member gets excommunicated (Kate Kelly, John Dehlin, Sam Young), they like to pretend it's a big deal. After all, it was in the New York Times! It feeds their ego, makes them feel important, makes them feel influential, etc. What these people (the excommunicated ones) fail to comprehend is that 97% of people don't read the New York Times, and outside of the LDS world, no one cares who gets excommunicated or not. It's a non-issue. 

It's the same for what goes on in the temples. Oh, I'm sure there are exceptions, but in reality 97% of people outside of the west don't care what happens in LDS temples. It's a non issue for them just like who the church has excommunicated. 

Mainly, the only ones who really care are the members. And then, they dont want to talk about it. Its a giant paradox.

[wenglund]

18 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

We have this problem as LDS where we are afraid to mention anything whatsoever from inside of temples. Much of what goes on inside of temples is public knowledge. What we dont discuss are the sacred parts and details of our covenants with accompanying signs, tokens and rites.

Actually, the entirety of the temple ceremony, including the portions you mentioned shouldn't be discussed, has illegitimately been made public on the internet.The fact that it has been made public doesn't alter our obligations to keep things sacred.

Granted, there are also portions of the ceremony that are contained in scriptures, and are thus public. Even there-though, one may rightlydiscuss what is in the scripture without discussing what is in the temple.

In short, some of us LDS have a problem blurring lines to the point of inadvertently stepping over them.  

As such, other LDS find it useful to avoid blurring the line--and leave possible blurring to those authorized to do so.

Those who own and run this discussion board have a right to  exercise this prerogative. 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

 

[Guest MormonGator]

1 minute ago, Rob Osborn said:

Mainly, the only ones who really care are the members.

Yup. 

[BJ64]

22 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

I was 99% sure you'd say that. I knew it! I knew it! Of course they do, Rob. You seriously made my day. 

And oh yeah, 99% of my non member friends have never asked. 

Even amid the highly publicized renovation and open house of the Idaho Falls temple my non member friends did not ask about the temple nor were they interested in attending the open house. 

I don’t remember ever being asked about the temple in my entire life. 

[Guest MormonGator]

2 minutes ago, BJ64 said:

I don’t remember ever being asked about the temple in my entire life. 

Thanks bud, I was pretty confident that was the case for most members. 

[BJ64]

14 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Whenever a prominent LDS member gets excommunicated (Kate Kelly, John Dehlin, Sam Young), they like to pretend it's a big deal. After all, it was in the New York Times! It feeds their ego, makes them feel important, makes them feel influential, etc. What these people (the excommunicated ones) fail to comprehend is that 97% of people don't read the New York Times, and outside of the LDS world, no one cares who gets excommunicated or not. It's a non-issue. 

It's the same for what goes on in the temples. Oh, I'm sure there are exceptions, but in reality 97% of people outside of the west don't care what happens in LDS temples. It's a non issue for them just like who the church has excommunicated. 

I’d go on to say that 99.9% of church members have never heard of Kate Kelly, John Dehlin or Sam Young, let alone know that they were excommunicated or why they were excommunicated. I think that’s a Utah thing. 

[BJ64]

1 minute ago, MormonGator said:

Thanks bud, I was pretty confident that was the case for most members. 

Except for when I was on my mission I’ve never even been asked about the church. 

[Guest MormonGator]

Just now, BJ64 said:

I’d go on to say that 99.9% of church members have never heard of Kate Kelly, John Dehlin or Sam Young, let alone know that they were excommunicated or why they were excommunicated. I think that’s a Utah thing. 

Yup, agree on that too. The people on the forum know those names, because virtually all of us have more than a slight interest about our religion. We wouldn't be here otherwise. 

 

[BJ64]

3 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Yup, agree on that too. The people on the forum know those names, because virtually all of us have more than a slight interest about our religion. We wouldn't be here otherwise. 

 

I think the only people who are concerned about “apostates” who are excommunicated are members who are walking down that path themselves. 

[BJ64]

Back to the ministering topic, I think it’s best done as an individual rather than a companionship. Of course there are times when visiting someone by yourself may be inappropriate but I think ministering needs to be done spontaneously as guided by promptings. Calling a companion and setting up appointments takes away spontaneity and may cause you to miss someone in a time of need. 

If you are driving past someone’s house and you feel you should stop and check on them then do it. Don’t wait until next Sunday to talk to your companion and set up a time to make a visit. 

[Rob Osborn]

1 hour ago, wenglund said:

Actually, the entirety of the temple ceremony, including the portions you mentioned shouldn't be discussed, has illegitimately been made public on the internet.The fact that it has been made public doesn't alter our obligations to keep things sacred.

Granted, there are also portions of the ceremony that are contained in scriptures, and are thus public. Even there-though, one may rightlydiscuss what is in the scripture without discussing what is in the temple.

In short, some of us LDS have a problem blurring lines to the point of inadvertently stepping over them.  

As such, other LDS find it useful to avoid blurring the line--and leave possible blurring to those authorized to do so.

Those who own and run this discussion board have a right to  exercise this prerogative. 

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

 

In reality all of our covenants, and thus, all of tge gospel are sacred. And yet, here we are discussing them. There is a defined line about what we can and cannot speak about regarding the temple and the work we do there. Generally, the basic overview is all made public by the church itself through gospel manuals and lessons, talks, magazine and internet pages and articles, temple open houses, temple visitor centers, etc. Even the things I talk about from time to time are on the public side of the line. We as members should be aware what we can and cant discuss.

[Rob Osborn]

1 hour ago, BJ64 said:

Even amid the highly publicized renovation and open house of the Idaho Falls temple my non member friends did not ask about the temple nor were they interested in attending the open house. 

I don’t remember ever being asked about the temple in my entire life. 

And yet, I also live in the IF temple district and pretty much all my nonmember friends asked about it...But then again, different circumstances may apply.

[BJ64]

24 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

And yet, I also live in the IF temple district and pretty much all my nonmember friends asked about it...But then again, different circumstances may apply.

We must not live too far apart then. 

Perhaps there is a difference between the type of friendship. While I have a lot of non member friends they are the type of friends that I only see at club and sports type events, not the type I have a close working relationship with or invite to my house. 

[BJ64]

41 minutes ago, Rob Osborn said:

In reality all of our covenants, and thus, all of tge gospel are sacred. And yet, here we are discussing them. There is a defined line about what we can and cannot speak about regarding the temple and the work we do there. Generally, the basic overview is all made public by the church itself through gospel manuals and lessons, talks, magazine and internet pages and articles, temple open houses, temple visitor centers, etc. Even the things I talk about from time to time are on the public side of the line. We as members should be aware what we can and cant discuss.

It seems to me that the church likes to say that we don’t discuss these things not because they are secret but because they are sacred. However in my view the reason we don’t discuss the specific things that have been mentioned is in fact because they are secret. 

The things mentioned about the temple in church literature are sacred but not secret. 

Edited January 10, 2019 by BJ64

[Rob Osborn]

3 hours ago, BJ64 said:

We must not live too far apart then. 

Perhaps there is a difference between the type of friendship. While I have a lot of non member friends they are the type of friends that I only see at club and sports type events, not the type I have a close working relationship with or invite to my house. 

Aye, I live just outside of Blackfoot in Groveland. Most of my non-member friends know me and my church callings and so they ask cause I talk a lot about stuff.

[Rob Osborn]

3 hours ago, BJ64 said:

It seems to me that the church likes to say that we don’t discuss these things not because they are secret but because they are sacred. However in my view the reason we don’t discuss the specific things that have been mentioned is in fact because they are secret. 

The things mentioned about the temple in church literature are sacred but not secret. 

There definitely is a sacred element to it and as such I don't discuss those sacred parts. When discussing such topics as the plan of salvation and the endowment with how it plays out the plan Is don't see an issue with discussing the general elements because, after all, it is the plan of salvation.

[askandanswer]

7 hours ago, MormonGator said:

And oh yeah, 99% of my non member friends have never asked. 

 

7 hours ago, MormonGator said:

It's the same for what goes on in the temples. Oh, I'm sure there are exceptions, but in reality 97% of people outside of the west don't care what happens in LDS temples. 

Hey look, the percentages are dropping, from 99 to 97%, with both posts having been made 7 hours ago. If this continue at this rate, by early Sunday morning at the latest, everyone will be caring about what happens in LDS temples.