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Traveler

All Things in Moderation

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In the Fall Conference Elder Bednar talked about "Middle Ground".  In essence, at least from my view, he recounted a prophetic revelation that the time will come when the middle ground (compromise) will no longer be an option - especially for those that covenant with G-d.  That standing with one foot in the world and one foot in the kingdom will be taken away.

I have pondered this concept in light of the idea that all things are basically okay - in moderation.  For example, some feel that the reason that we are commanded to abstain from alcohol is because of its addictive properties and the propensity of "drinking" too much.   Some think the opposite, that any use of alcohol, even in cooking, is the essence of transgressions against our covenants with G-d.

Must we become extreme, in our fashions, foods, drinks, entertainments, associations, politics and our studies in science.  To what extent can we or ought we experiment with the world and with spiritual things?  The word "Disciple" comes from the same root as "Discipline".  How do we become well rounded and also experts is Sainthood?

 

The Traveler

Edited by Traveler

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This seems to be a perennial idea - that things are ever becoming more themselves, and distinct from other things. Things which were tolerated in the past are not tolerated now, and things tolerated now will not be tolerated in the future.

Alcohol is a case in point. Some people will tell you that alcohol was always forbidden to God's people, and that "wine" in the Bible actually refers to unfermented grape juice. This is utter nonsense: Noah did not get drunk on Dr. Welch's Grape Juice. Neither would the guests at the wedding at Cana have talked about "serving the inferior wine later, once everyone was drunk" if what Jesus had turned the water into was non-alcoholic grape juice. On the day of Pentecost, no one would have claimed the disciples were "drunk on new wine" if "new wine" were 0% proof.

"Wine", in Biblical times, was alcoholic.

On the other hand, if you say that God instituted a new commandment for the "Latter Days" - that idea I can respect. I can understand how the distinction between the Saints and the World has widened, and the "middle ground" where one could be both a wine drinker AND a disciple has now disappeared.

Edited by Jamie123
I put the same point a different way - I was unhappy with the way I initially put it.

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7 hours ago, Jamie123 said:

This seems to be a perennial idea - that things are ever becoming more themselves, and distinct from other things. Things which were tolerated in the past are not tolerated now, and things tolerated now will not be tolerated in the future.

Alcohol is a case in point. Some people will tell you that alcohol was always forbidden to God's people, and that "wine" in the Bible actually refers to unfermented grape juice. This is utter nonsense: Noah did not get drunk on Dr. Welch's Grape Juice. Neither would the guests at the wedding at Cana have talked about "serving the inferior wine later, once everyone was drunk" if what Jesus had turned the water into was non-alcoholic grape juice. On the day of Pentecost, no one would have claimed the disciples were "drunk on new wine" if "new wine" were 0% proof.

"Wine", in Biblical times, was alcoholic.

On the other hand, if you say that God instituted a new commandment for the "Latter Days" - that idea I can respect. I can understand how the distinction between the Saints and the World has widened, and the "middle ground" where one could be both a wine drinker AND a disciple has now disappeared.

Here is a thought that comes in the form of a question (I hope the symbolism is not too difficult to understand):

Does a wise and smart coach look at "film" and prepare his team to face certain things for one game and then - seeing other film later prepare his team for a different team (different threats)  in a very different manner?

 

The Traveler

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7 hours ago, Traveler said:

Here is a thought that comes in the form of a question (I hope the symbolism is not too difficult to understand):

Does a wise and smart coach look at "film" and prepare his team to face certain things for one game and then - seeing other film later prepare his team for a different team (different threats)  in a very different manner?

 

The Traveler

I'm assuming that the "wise and smart coach" is God, the team being coached is "the saints/disciples", the "different threats" are "sins/temptations then and now". But what do the "films" represent?

Edited by Jamie123

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5 hours ago, Jamie123 said:

I'm assuming that the "wise and smart coach" is God, the team being coached is "the saints/disciples", the "different threats" are "sins/temptations then and now". But what do the "films" represent?

The films represent the knowledge of the current threats/temptations being prepared and utilized by the opposition.  So as we look at the Word of Wisdom - perhaps we are being prepared for something specific to the Last-days.

 

The Traveler 

 

 

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32 minutes ago, Traveler said:

The films represent the knowledge of the current threats/temptations being prepared and utilized by the opposition.  So as we look at the Word of Wisdom - perhaps we are being prepared for something specific to the Last-days.

 

The Traveler 

So "forewarned is forearmed". Good thought!

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