I'm a Christian.

[zil2]

14 minutes ago, Traveler said:

You have left me with a lot to ponder...

Your idea has a lot of stuff that needs reconciliation if one is going to believe it.  (But then, I don't know that it's necessary for anyone to believe it.)

I comprehend the ideas you've laid out which I didn't quote.  There's logic to them, but I'm not sure it's enough.  You have lots of assumptions about things that haven't been (publicly) revealed - such as assuming this planning, that it was a group effort, the degree of Lucifer's involvement, etc.  While you've laid out a reasonable scenario, it's still just your speculation.

And all of it is based on your idea that we had to know pretty much everything about mortality before coming here. I don't think that was necessary.

19 minutes ago, Traveler said:

I am not the same person that I once was

The person you once were made you into the person you are, so, I'm thinking the person you are was always inside the person you once were, but hadn't fully developed yet.

[Traveler]

On 6/3/2025 at 5:13 PM, zil2 said:

Your idea has a lot of stuff that needs reconciliation if one is going to believe it.  (But then, I don't know that it's necessary for anyone to believe it.)

I comprehend the ideas you've laid out which I didn't quote.  There's logic to them, but I'm not sure it's enough.  You have lots of assumptions about things that haven't been (publicly) revealed - such as assuming this planning, that it was a group effort, the degree of Lucifer's involvement, etc.  While you've laid out a reasonable scenario, it's still just your speculation.

And all of it is based on your idea that we had to know pretty much everything about mortality before coming here. I don't think that was necessary.

The person you once were made you into the person you are, so, I'm thinking the person you are was always inside the person you once were, but hadn't fully developed yet.

One problem I have is that I judge the world from my own experiences.  I cannot think of anything in my life that ought to be changed.  I can say that there are things I have learned that with that new insight that I would do things differently – but it kind of goes along with what you have indicated.  Everything has taught me something and given me experience.

The one thing I have difficulty with is social attachments and empathy for others.  My wife often reminds me that I have never had a broken heart.  This is problematic because the scriptures tells us that we must have a broken heart.  I do not think that I could have had a broken heart and not known it.  It is just that regardless of whatever has happened – I have always felt that there was so much to be thankful for and happy about.

I could make a very long list of problems I have caused for myself and others.  My wife has asked me not to talk about most of the stuff on the list.  She does not think that kind of information helps others very much.   But all those experiences gave me helpful insights and courage later in life that were critical.

Perhaps it is just me but I have everything to be thankful for – especially being able to repent and change things that are possible for me to change.  I cannot imagine that my experiences so far ought to be different that what they have been.  Each night in my prayers I thank G-d for everything in my life – and there is nothing I feel to criticize.  I am told all the time that there are a lot of miserable people – but I really do not know why.

 

The Traveler

[zil2]

50 minutes ago, Traveler said:

broken heart

We've talked about this before.  The common cultural use of this phrase deals with romantic disappointment. I don't think that has anything to do with what scriptures mean.

51 minutes ago, Traveler said:

I am told all the time that there are a lot of miserable people – but I really do not know why.

One more thing for you to be exceedingly grateful for.

51 minutes ago, Traveler said:

One problem I have is that I judge the world from my own experiences.

That's all any of us can do.

[zil2]

53 minutes ago, Traveler said:

The one thing I have difficulty with is social attachments and empathy for others.

I sometimes wonder if the thing we struggle with in mortality isn't the thing we mastered pre-mortally, and we're given the struggle in mortality so that later (after mortality), we can understand and have compassion on those who struggle with it.  Otherwise, if we never knew the struggle, we might not have compassion / understanding.  (A tiny little snippet of what the Savior experienced in full.)

[Carborendum]

7 hours ago, zil2 said:

We've talked about this before.  The common cultural use of this phrase deals with romantic disappointment. I don't think that has anything to do with what scriptures mean.

Alternatively, a rephrase in common culture: "You broke my heart."

• This commonly means: "I was so greatly saddened by your actions to the point that I fell on my face in grief."
• So, to have a broken heart is "to be grief-stricken, brought down low."

When we hear/read such imagery, we tend to go to the extreme end (as the imagery invokes).  But to simply feel sorrow for one's sins "sufficient to motivate us to repentance" is what the Lord is asking for.

Some people are temperate enough to avoid "serious" sins.  And when they sin, the "broken heart" behavior doesn't necessarily mean we have to literally fall on our face and cry and moan and carry on...  Sometimes a simple "oops" will do.  For the nature of the sin, that is showing a broken heart commensurate with the seriousness of the sin.

[zil2]

8 hours ago, zil2 said:

We've talked about this before.

And one comment down from that, is a link to another post that goes into greater detail, which I'll go ahead and link here: