funkymonkey

Yeah, I got two of these in my garage.

Hi Mike. Sorry if my post sounded defensive...I actually had only seen Raemptom's post and then found that article and posted it up! Totally didn't even see your question so it wasn't meant to be directed at you in any way...I was totally just throwing the article up there for people to read! :)

Hi Mike. The article I just read also said this... (not sure if this helps answer any questions)... "There is some historical evidence that Joseph Smith knew as early as 1831 that plural marriage would be restored, so it is perfectly legitimate to argue that Joseph's relationship with Fanny Alger was such a case."

I Just read this article... "Probably the wife about whom we know the least is Fanny Alger, Joseph's first plural wife, whom he came to know in early 1833 when she stayed at the Smith home as a house-assistant of sorts to Emma (such work was common for young women at the time). There are no first-hand accounts of their relationship (from Joseph or Fanny), nor are there second-hand accounts (from Emma or Fanny's family). All that we do have is third hand accounts, most of them recorded many years after the events. Unfortunately, this lack of reliable and extensive historical detail leaves much room for critics to claim that Joseph Smith had an affair with Fanny and then later invented plural marriage as way to justify his actions. The problem is we don't know the details of the relationship or exactly of what it consisted, and so are left to assume that Joseph acted honorably (as believers) or dishonorably (as critics)." Just thinking in writing here... Even though this specific story is interesting...it's still got a TON of holes and unknowns in it. To make a personal conclusion from this particular very vague story would be like going to a scene of a car accident after the cars are towed away and all that is left is the broken glass on the street...and making a conclusion as to who's fault it was by looking at where the glass is currently lying.

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Very cool, Mike. :) Thanks for the update! One night down...13 more to go.

Yeah, it's less "distracting"

Please review my edited post. While I don't think that I should need to explain why I don't feel comfortable with something that isn't relayed to be my a general authority... (to separate doctrine from tradition or "lore") I understand that polygamy will exist in heaven but I don't think everyone will be required to live it. Just like through the history of the world, many people believed in the practice, few people actually lived it. It doesn't seem "logical" to me because of the "abolishment of polygamy". I am uncomfortable with a man getting sealed to another woman after their wife is deceased because the first wife can't exactly give consent to spending their eternity in polygamy. I have no problem with people remarrying civilly...which I think is way more common. I'm not really comfortable with this discussion because this is getting into way tiny particulars and to me it is speculative and not doctrine; and there are a lot of people that read these threads that could take this as doctrine or truth. There is probably a reason that written information isn't found, and I have a feeling that the truth is individual and can't really be found by talking to someone on a public forum about it...probably is one of those things to contemplate privately, or at the temple.

I am not doubting that plural marriage happened...and have no problem with it in the cases that it was carried out correctly. If JS had multiple wives doesn't bother me...that was his specific commandment. I am just curious to find some information regarding the current practices of sealings, to help separate Mormon lore from Mormon doctrine. Eh, it doesn't matter anyway. I'm not OK with it and I don't think I'm required to be OK with it right now. Personal truth will come in time. Since I can't find any real documentation on it, then the particulars probably really aren't appropriate for this forum/audience anyway.

I was looking for articles to verify these plural marriage / sealings information but haven't found anything yet. Until then sorry but I'm taking this "hearsay" with a grain of salt. But I did find this little excerpt in a talk given by Dallin H Oaks, regarding timing and how important it is for the Lord... "People who do not accept continuing revelation sometimes get into trouble by doing things too soon or too late or too long. The practice of plural marriage is an example." Thought there was quite a bit of wisdom in that quote.

Just stumbled on this article... thought it was pretty good. "TIMING" Dallin H Oaks "The first principle of the gospel is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ. Faith means trust—trust in God’s will, trust in His way of doing things, and trust in His timetable. We should not try to impose our timetable on His. As Elder Neal A. Maxwell of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles has said: “The issue for us is trusting God enough to trust also His timing. If we can truly believe He has our welfare at heart, may we not let His plans unfold as He thinks best? The same is true with the second coming and with all those matters wherein our faith needs to include faith in the Lord’s timing for us personally, not just in His overall plans and purposes.” Indeed, we cannot have true faith in the Lord without also having complete trust in the Lord’s will and in the Lord’s timing."

Thanks Mike. :) That wasn't me, that was the spirit. God seriously wants a relationship with you.

I thought they stopped doing "multiple sealings" about 10 years ago. Am I wrong? I'd still like some articles or something if anyone has em.

I like what wanderer said. :) By the tone of some of the messages, it sometimes feels more like an arguement board...or a debate board...may the most articulately argumentative person win!

This thread is so interesting. There is so much honesty in here, so many people just pouring their hearts out. Thank you all for being so honest. I have really learned a lot from this thread. Finding peace is so important...constant struggling and doubt in God and in ourselves is really not going to result in peace. I think deep deep down, know that God exists, which is why you are struggling but still searching for answers right now...in the past, the idea of God has given you peace in your life. You've been bombarded by so much information that your faith has turned into a need to appeal to the intellect...leaving you confused and kinda cheated. (been there! Everything you've said...I've had the same thoughts and ideas!) But please remember...God communicates through the heart, not the mind. Mike, can I challenge you to something for the next two weeks...? Put aside any association with any religion and all the intellectual mumbo jumbo, and history of churches, and offensive people, etc). Wipe your mental slate clean... focus only on your own individual relationship with Jesus Christ....no religion, no literature, no confusion... just you and Christ. Don't read anything...just you and Christ. For 10 minutes in the morning and evening, go somewhere where you can be completely alone, completely quiet, away from all distractions... Close your eyes and take a couple deep breaths to relax and clear your mind, in your mind think that you are in a vast peaceful space standing or walking with Jesus Christ. Then pray, and ask to remember Him, don't ask Him to "prove" that he is there, but rather ask him to help you remember. ...for two weeks. I really still think that a priesthood blessing could be of benefit too, what's the harm right?

Sorry to but in here but... I don't think he's "innapropriately forcing" anything. He is voicing his concerns in a very honest way...concerns that a lot of people have. Vort, I judge the actions of historical figures "by modern mores" all the time... Hitler, Stalin, King Henry the 8th, etc.

Does someone have the reference to this? I apparently missed this part of Sunday school...was probably sleeping through it.

I often times find myself not feeling worthy to use Christ's atonement, and try to "pay" for them myself... but I guess it doesn't really work that way!

This is just a "sue-happy" country!...pretty embarassing actually.

Health savings accounts are pretax as well. So $100 in your savings account, is the same as $80 on your paycheck. However, the recent laws with health savings accounts makes it a little more high maintenance. You have to keep all our receipts and they won't pay on prescriptions from drug stores initally...only after you mail in the receipt. But if you're willing to pay the extra attention to it, it's worth the money.

I could care less about the topic. It is how this information is being delivered that I am trying to oppose here. I can see you're very passionate about what you have read... However, you are not ordained of God to have any authority over anyone other than yourself, and don't have any authority to be making statements of "truth" or threats like this to people. You have been given the divine role of finding truth for yourself, not over anyone else. If this was pertinent information for the church's population or even the world, it would be delivered through the general presidency. Until then, this information should be delivered as speculation instead of fact or truth.

First off, it's Mrs Funkymonkey to you... and proud of it. Not curious at all. Doesn't apply to my salvation in the least.

Yeah, those kids are seriously MONSTERS.

Truth, All he said is that there is evidence of giants...he didn't say anything about them being the offspring of space people.

Totally hear ya. My friends are all in their 40s/50s. I love my friends... I'm a friend to them, but they will tend to be parents to me instead of my friends. Keep looking for a good doctor that will be willing to be thorough and will take the time to look for answers. Your own intuition is very important. Good doctors are getting more and more difficult to find. General medicine teaches them to look for 80% of the possible problems...that the remaining 20% is really unlikely to happen, so they don't even think about those issues. But that 20% still involves a LOT of people...which is why so many people go undiagnosed. I was sick with West Nile for three weeks (I was blind and having seizures) before my doctor finally said "Hmmm, maybe it's not the flu!" I went in every week for really scary problems that were popping up (like my heart stops beating..now I know that it was the virus attacking my brain) and they would just look at me and would say "hmmm, that's wierd" and would send me home. Come to find out later that I should have been hospitalized in the first week. I have spent thousands of dollars in my own money looking for solutions, answers, etc...I've gone to 12 different doctors, and was fortunate enough to find ONE was willing to be thorough and really help me. Finding that right doctor is hard to find (and one doctor alone might not have all the answers) but it is really worth it when you find him/her. Trust your own intellect and instincts before a doctor's. I trusted what the doctor said, while I knew myself that something was really not right, I ignored every horrible symptom that came my way and now I'm paying for it with long term problems. I'm sorry Rachelle. Marriage is friggin hard. You're not alone...going through "pits" is something that I think we all deal with! ...Doesn't it feel good to vent?! Hang in there.