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I am watching a Movie called the Work and the Glory has any one seen it? Is it factual presentation of Joseph Smith?

No, John says, "These things I have written unto you that you might know that you have eternal life. It is a gift you either have it or you don't. I have received the gift of eternal life. Those who don't know they have it, haven't received it. 1Jn. 5:13 These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. For example, if I send you a birthday gift and ask you did you get it, and you say, "I hope so or I am don't know yet," that means you haven't received it.

The Bible says that heavens are God's throne and the earth His foot stool. Why can't I put my foot on the earth as a stool and sit in the heavens for a throne?

I agree with that, but if someone asks a question, I feel oblidged to respond!:)

I cannot disagree with Pam. Why? By the way, you made a good point above.

Pam, WADR, that is what this thread is about : Does LDS doctrine clash with Scripture? There is no disrespect in pioneering this question. I believe it is dangerous to believe God is not Spirit. I agree with the Holy Bible, but you are telling me that you have another source that tells you something different. That sounds like a clash to me. Lets call a spade a spade!

How:confused:

NO God is flesh and bone in Christ Jesus the WORD made flesh. This is something we cannot understand even Paul said it is not even clear what we shall be, but we will be like Jesus when He appears, but God is a Spirit. This is a mystery. Foolish people, however, have tried to create a doctrine out of this mystery (like the JWS). God has not shown himself to any man. Moses spoke to God face to face in a burning bush and Jacob wrestled with God trhrough an angel, but humans cannot see a spirit.

God is Spirit

The Bible doesn't say that God is flesh and bones. It is an inference you're making that is inconsistent with the rest of Scripture from the Bible. That which has been created the earth and that is there in has been created from what does not appear. Heb. 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear. Flesh and bones is not something that doesn't appear!1Jn. 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us. IMHO, those are some dangerous inferences to be making.

Because it is written that "God is a Spirit." These things are tough to explain. They're spiritually discerned. It is like trying explain what a strawberry taste like to someone who has never seen or tasted one. Jesus was not like God in the sense of flesh and blood because God is Spirit; therefore, we can assertain that He is the exact representation of God in that He is deity (co-eternal) with the Father. This is a mystery. There is only one God.

God gives those who receive Him power to become the sons of God. For one to say they are a son of God and Jesus is there brother seems presumptious to say the least from where I am standing. First Christ must be received to be given power to become a son of God (Children of God), but in order to receive Him you must know who He is.

Quote the rest of that verses to understand it in context. Phil. 2:5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7but made himself nothing, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men. 8And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.If we exalt ourselves, God will humble us. Pride comes before a fall! We are supposed to have the mind of Christ. I have no problem believing that Jesus is Jehovah, but keep in mind Jesus didn't exist as flesh and bone during that time nor was He called Jesus. I have no problem with someone showing me they have more knowledge than me, but what good is knowledge if it never leads you to the truth. You have failed to show me how I have been disrespectful:D

Could you explain that another way? I don't follow:confused:

Jesus is the bursting forth of ALL God's glory. Heb. 1 That is what proves He is distinct in person as the Son. Now, He is also the exact representation, stamp of all that God is in nature, essence and being. Before He was the Son; He was always the WORD of God. Jesus Christ in essence always was God. "The Word was God" I believe traditional Christians would see your reasoning flawed as well as Mormons. Keep studying and learning, but do come to the knowledge of truth.

Obviously, Jesus wasn't referring to God His father in heaven as being flesh and bone because the Bible says that God is Spirit. Now, in a sense that Jesus was and is God you can make an arugument that God the Son is flesh and blood. I will not come against that. Moreover, the fact that man has a spirit doesn't make him one. I can have a hamburger, but that doesn't make me one. I believe one day we will be llke the angels when we get out of our hamburgers:popcorn: Notice I said be like the angels; not be angels.

God is not understood with logic. God is a Spirit and He seeks those to worship Him in spirit and truth. Being submissive to God begins with trusting the Scripture as God's word and not letting what clashes with it to usurp the authority over the Holy Bible and what the apostles said is truth!

I said they are of the same substance yet distinct. Please read carefully what I wrote. This is not an opinion of mine; this is the Scripture. I don't trust man's opinons or views. Let every one be a liar, but God's word is true. We are not told to figure out God's essences through human logic. It is neither right nor safe to do so. JW's do this a lot - they say you can reason out who God is. They insult the Spirit of grace and God Himself with such ignorant arrogance!

This is enough for me to seriously look at some red flags. There are many more verses. If you don't accept these already posted from the Bible, you won't accept the others either. Hence, we'll have to agree to disagree civily as we have both been.

EPHESIANS49-3:19 And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fullness of God. 50-PHILIPPIANS 50-4:7 And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. I believe that includes logic. Now, regarding your question about the trinity is a tough question to answer because people have different concepts of what embodies the trinity doctrine. If I say yes, I might be agreeing to someone's error concerning their view of the God head. Why can't you settle for I believe in God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as did the disciples and apostles. The three are one yet distinct and also of the same substance and nature as written in the Bible. It really defies all logic. What I can tell you is I do not believe that God is flesh and bones. That is unequivocally against Scripture in the Holy Bible that explicitly states “God is Spirit” and does indeed clash with the Bible big time. God being flesh and bones, as you believe, implies that Adam was and is God.

It is not true???Is 42:8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. God also say that there were no Gods before Him nor shall there be any after Him. As far as an inheritance is concerned, we have to meet God on His terms not ours to recieve it.

Isn't that what the serpent told Eve in the garden? "You shall not die, but you shall be as God knowing good from evil. Isn't that another way of saying you have a spark of divinity? I see it as messing with forbidden fruit!

What part of what I mentioned did you want me to prove from the Scripture? I said several things.

Hi Blue Jay: I can see where your coming from on this issue. I believe He is the Son of God as you state. I cannot and will not attempt to refute that. However, Jesus is more than that. It is written that He is the mighty God, the wonderfull counselor the alpha and the omega, the First and the Last, the great I am and the exact representation of all that God is (His essense and being). These are titles and positions that only the most high God can have and He doesn't share His glory with another. I can back up in Scripture what I say should you challenge any of my statements. Jesus is the Word of God. God exalts His word above His name. Jesus was God before He took the subordinate role of the Son of man. The Word who is Jesus in the flesh always existed, but not as the son of man or the Son of God. There was never, however, a time God was without His word (who is Jesus as of 2000 years ago). If anyone cannot see this, they have missed the mark according to Scripture; not according to my statements! There is no evidence that Jesus is our elder brother. I believe the Scripture that that is not honoring God as God SHOULD BE HONORED!

God cannot be understood with human logic. It is the Bible that states that God is Spirit and that He is Holy, and I believe the Scriptures when it states that the Holy Spirit is God. Your problem is not with my logic as much as it is with accepting and trusting the Bible for what it states. It is not my logic I promote; it is the Scriptures!