Nacho2Dope

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Posts posted by Nacho2Dope

  1. This is a frustrating topic for me. If the Spirit testifies the truthfulness of something to me then I know it’s true and I will continue to testify that it is. I was listening to a podcast and they were talking about the culture of certainty in the Church and how we really don’t know that the Church is true. So I can’t be certain that I know but they can be certain I don’t know. This makes no sense to me at all. I believe that satan wants us to doubt those experiences and pass them off as something we have made up. I think that Satan knows how powerful a testimony is and wants us to not share them. This quote is from another podcast “The threat of justice doesn’t change people. If God threatens judgment, people still aren’t going to repent. What chapter 11 tells us is when the two witnesses stand up, when you actually get up and witness to what you believe, that’s what changes people. That’s what averts God’s judgment. And rather than 9/10 of the population being destroyed, which is what was going to happen, only 1/10 of the population is destroyed.“

  2. 1 hour ago, Fether said:

    Ever have a moment where you hear something that strikes such a strong chord in your heart that it sticks with you forever? There was a man in my ward of whom I respected more than most due to the charity he selflessly gave and the gospel principles I watched him live. I heard him make an off the cuff comment in a gospel doctrine when I was young. I don't remember the topic or what was being discussed, but he said "I think there will be a lot of people expecting to get into the celestial kingdom that will find they are wrong." I'm not saying this man's words are equal to the prophets, but the spirit his comment brought to me (which only I can really be sure of) was undeniable. I would consider the quote by Bruce R McConkie 

    “The elect of God comprise a very select group, an inner  of faithful members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. They are the portion of church members who are striving with all their hearts to keep the fulness of the gospel law in this life so that they can become inheritors of the fulness of gospel rewards in the life to come.”

    I am going to make some potentially harsh statement and accusations that may reveal the kind of saint I am (for better or for worst), Of which I am sure many of us are guilty of (and know I am guilty of a few).

    I do not believe that the elect of God:
    - Complain about giving talks, seriously or sarcastically (I absolutely hate the culture of "it's funny to complain about giving a talk/accepting a calling")
    - Reject callings
    - Joke about not wanting their current stewardship as a leader or teacher
    - Reject an assignment to teach
    - Are checking Social Media during church
    - Gossip EVER
    - watch ANY movie with immoral or ammoral content (PG-13 and some PG movies)
    - Attend the temple less than once a month (when within a reachable distance)
    - fail to read their scriptures and pray regularly
    - Swear
    - Break the sabbath
    - Fail to do FHE
    - Fail to take their spouse on a date (or treat as the spouse desires)
    - Fail to read their patriarchal blessing regularly and keep it close to them
    - Sleep in (meaning sleeping longer than 8 hours)
    - Never lie, steal, or pirate material

    I DO believe the elect of God:
    - Desire callings, assignments, and positions of glory
    - Aspire to Godhood
    - Retire to bed early and arise early to prepare spiritually for the day
    - Eat healthily
    - Exercise
    - LOVE the scriptures and LOVE prayer


    I can go on and on but I'll stop there. I think we will all be IMMENSELY happy and satisfied with where were end up. Because where we end up is where we will be the most happy... But where we end up may not be exaltation. And why is that? "Because their hearts are set so much upon the things of this world, and aspire to the honors of men" ... and frankly, we don't want it. We all say we do because it is what we are taught... but how many of us, based on how we live our lives, REALLY want to live a perfect exalted life?

    (Now there is a whole nother topic about grace and repentance that expands on this... but let's see how this goes first)

    Thank you! Really enjoyed your response. 

  3. 1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

    If you think so. I know of several LDS who follow all the rules, tithe, everything, and still are incredibly hard on themselves. It's sad. I want to give these people a hug. 

    My brother left the church because he felt he couldn't meet the expectations he put on himself. He was constantly stressed over not doing enough and he finally just left. He is not angry with the church, but I don't see him coming back anytime soon.

  4. 2 hours ago, MormonGator said:

    I think 95% of LDS are doing a great job living the rules and standards of the church and feel terrible guilt about the things they struggle with. The LAST thing they need is to be lectured to about how poorly they are doing. 

    I agree; however, I think that Jana Riess does not 

  5. 3 hours ago, Fether said:

    One observation:

    1) Someone always complains about people making “conference rumors” every 6 months when the topic comes up

    I mean that in the most light hearted way possible of course :)

    but an honest response to this. Correct me if I’m wrong... but God doesn’t really wait for the unfaithful to catch up (Matthew 25:1-13), he just goes forward with his plans and the faithful follow. Additionally, Pres Nelson did say a lot of changes are coming.

    I see nothing wrong with speculation of things to come, but I do see something wrong with people getting excited about future changes when they haven’t applied recent changes into their lives (I’m looking at you @Fether).

    On a different discussion board someone had questioned what President Nelson meant when he said the work was moving at an accelerated rate, and I think this helps answer that. God does not wait for us to catch up or even pay attention. His work is moving on with or without us!

  6. 3 hours ago, Vort said:

    Two observations:

    1. Why do such rumors always involve e.g. SHORTER mission/meeting times instead of LONGER? Where are the three-year-mission rumors? Where are the hopes that the Word of Wisdom will become much more restrictive and tell us other things we shouldn't eat or drink, like maybe soda pop?

    2. Why should we expect or even anticipate further changes when we as a Church are doing so poorly in living according to what we already have? It's like people who have never studied scriptures pining for the sealed portion of the gold plates.

    [/ice_water]

    I complete agree with this. Thanks for the response.

  7. 1 hour ago, Anddenex said:

    Alma the Younger. Now, to be fair, as we don't know Alma the Younger's full history, we can say he was taught the gospel by his Father, which then leads to the thought that Alma the Younger would have had to have abandoned his faith as taught by his father. We can see from his life he came back stronger and more committed to the gospel.

    Oliver Cowdery also comes to mind. He abandoned his faith, did not move with the saints. He was excommunicated and later came back. His commitment to the Church could be argued as we may not know if he was stronger or more committed, but we do know he returned and was faithful to the end.

    Thanks. I appreciate the insight and examples!!

  8. 14 hours ago, The Folk Prophet said:

    On a side note: Testimonies are very rarely actually lost. Faith is lost. Or, rather, faith is abandoned. If testimonies were actually lost (like somehow we had amnesia) then we'd hardly be accountable for that (unless the actions that caused amnesia was intentional (as is sometimes the case)).

    Also, maybe someone can correct me, but I don't believe there is any commandment to have a testimony anywhere. There is a commandment to believe. There is a commandment to have faith. And there are promises related to those choices. But losing a testimony (assuming one could) wouldn't damn us if we choose to continue  exercising faith and belief.

    The primary spiritual experience I had whereby I can testify of the Savior, for example, is an actual experience that I had. It's not something I can actually forget. I can ignore it...put it aside, etc., and pretend like I don't remember it. But when I stand before my Savior at judgment day I will not be able to deny that experience any more than those who have had similar experiences will be able to deny theirs. And for ignoring it, I would be accountable.

    And...on top of that...it's interesting to consider your statement in terms of faith (assuming it read "Sin is the only reason why faith is lost"). That is truth like saying car crashes are the only reasons car accidents happen. Because not having faith is a sin. ;)

    I would definitely agree with you that faith is abandoned. I have known a few who have had issues with their faith,  including some family members. Within the small group of people I know and stories I have heard, I have never heard of someone having a faith crisis or abandoning their faith and come back stronger and more committed to the gospel. Does anyone have an example of this? If not it would seem that once down that road there is only one outcome. 

  9. 3 minutes ago, dprh said:

    The last couple times I taught the Teacher's Quorum chastity lesson, I used a modified version of the gum analogy.  I asked each boy if they wanted a piece of gum.  They all took one, I put one in my mouth and chewed and went into the intro to the lesson.  After a few minutes, I asked if anyone wanted another piece.  Most boys did.  I pulled the one in my mouth out.  No one wanted it. I went into the normal analogy as I was taught.  Then I said, You are NOT a piece of gum, chewed or unchewed.  You are Sons of God.  No matter what you've done or do in the future, you have divine potential.  The Atonement of Jesus Christ is real and you can be cleansed of sins, transgressions, mistakes, and pains.  There can be lasting consequences of our actions, and chastity issues have some more serious consequences than other sins.  But there is always hope.  I tried hard to make sure each boy understood both the seriousness of the law of chastity and the power of Christ's healing.

    Thanks for sharing that. I guess it just depends on how the information is being presented and what you want them to take away from the lesson. I am hopeful that no one who has used this in their lesson did so with the intent to cause harm to those they were teaching. They may have tried to present it in a way you did; however, its hard to know what people will focus on during a lesson. My wife and I will discuss the Come Follow Me lessons during the week and its interesting we can have the same information but interpret it so differently. I really had no idea it was still being used. Those that you have talked to, have their experiences been recent like yours?  

  10. 17 minutes ago, dprh said:

    I don't understand how more people can be harmed than hurt.  Isn't that the same thing?  Maybe you meant 'helped' in place of hurt.  Why are statistics needed?  I've heard enough people's stories to know that there are better ways.

    Have you heard that these analogy's are being used currently? I have heard of people that have taken issue with them but it was 10+ years ago. I have not personally heard of them being currently taught. I have also been serving with the youth for the past 5 years in 2 different states and I have never heard anyone use any of these analogy's. I may have just missed it, but I am curious to know where and who is using this in their lessons?

    Thanks! 

  11. 9 minutes ago, unixknight said:

    Those aren't examples of doctrinal change, but rather changes in policy and/or procedure.  Those things have changed for thousands of  years, but the doctrine remains the same.

    That's what I thought, Thanks!!

  12. I have seen several post on social media that the Doctrine of God changes, and the only evidence I see posted is the change in the priesthood ban and stopping the practice of polygamy. I have been trying to study these and I cannot see how doctrine was changed. What am I missing?