Question!

[LDSgirl]

Why is the average guy so clueless to what a girl is saying and feeling most of the time? Then looking at it the other way around.......Why do girls have so much trouble understanding guys and how they think?

PS: If you're married does it get easier as the years go by?

[HiJolly]

Why is the average guy so clueless to what a girl is saying and feeling most of the time? Then looking at it the other way around.......Why do girls have so much trouble understanding guys and how they think?

PS: If you're married does it get easier as the years go by?

Heh. Men are from Mars...

Men and Women are different by design. Due to biological and sometimes environmental variables, what I am about to say is not always true, but as a general description seems to be the case.

Women identify with feelings, emotions, interpersonal relationships and soforth better than men. It goes beyond just biology -- has something to do with spiritual gifts and sensitivities, IMO.

Men work better with absolutes. Reason, logic and facts are more intuitively worked with. However, these aspects of life are very harsh and unforgiving -- just like Judgement (and The judgement). So men are hard on themselves, and if not balanced emotionally, hard on everyone around them.

Women are also hard on themselves, but that harshness is emotional in nature and almost never aimed an anyone else (unless emotional health is disrupted or maladjusted).

See how this applies in the story of Adam and Eve.

And while this stays generally true throughout life, what marriage does is force the two parties to strive to adapt and cope with and understand the other pole. Ah. Poles.

Man <------> Woman

reason <------> emotion

logic <-------> feelings

truth <------> relationships

What I find fascinating about this is that the one thing that most helps bring both parties together, is the same exact thing that also mediates the following polarization:

justice <-----> mercy

...and that is: Jesus Christ.

HiJolly

p.s. please remember that this is offered as a generalization, and I am not bigoted nor sexist. Everyone fits into these a little differently.

[Honor]

Just finished reading a book by Dr. Gary Chapman. AMAZING STUFF!!! For once in my life I've felt some hope for the possibility of staying happy with one person for good. We'll always be different, but learning to speak each other's love language makes it possible to actually enjoy the ways that we're different.

[MarginOfError]

You also might take a look at You Just Don't Understand. I've advocated this book a few times before.

The main gist of this book is men and women generally view the world from differing paradigms. Women define their relationships through the lens of intimacy and connection--often measured by talk, rapport, and trading 'secrets'--while men define their relationships through status--usually measured by personal accomplishments, knowledge, and problem solving. Thus, one possible interpretation is that men and women don't have trouble understanding each other's words, but they do have trouble interpreting those words in the other gender's context.

This isn't the end-all of communication books, but it's a pretty good one.

[Elphaba]

This is what someone told me once.

When women make love, they are truly doing just that--making love. It is their way of expressing their most intimate and profound feelings for him, giving him the ultimate gift she can, including her soul. And afterwards, she just wants to sink into that love while he holds her, and she knows he is so happy to be near her, so happy he found her, and so happy he loves her.

When men make love, it's an event: Spent and show over.

Elphaba

PS: I worked really hard to keep that eligible for this forum! If it's too much, go ahead and delete it.

[HiJolly]

This is what someone told me once.

When women make love, they are truly doing just that--making love. It is their way of expressing their most intimate and profound feelings for him, giving him the ultimate gift she can, including her soul. And afterwards, she just wants to sink into that love while he holds her, and she knows he is so happy to be near her, so happy he found her, and so happy he loves her.

When men make love, it's an event: Spent and show over.

Elphaba

PS: I worked really hard to keep that eligible for this forum! If it's too much, go ahead and delete it.

ROFL.

I agree with you, Elphaba.

HiJolly

[Guest tomk]

Why is the average guy so clueless to what a girl is saying and feeling most of the time? Then looking at it the other way around.......Why do girls have so much trouble understanding guys and how they think?

PS: If you're married does it get easier as the years go by?

I've enjoyed what other's have posted...and they are correct, I think! :)

We are different creatures. While striving to understand the opposite gender is a life-long goal, and admirable, I think part of this is to also learn to play off of each other's natural strengths. Men tend to be more logical and dispassionate. Women tend to be more emotional and passionate. Men hold babies and don't know what to do. Women are natural nurturers and instinctively know what to do.

Those are broad strokes. Men and women are a mix of these things. Some women are more logical than their male counterparts. Some men are better nurturers than some women.

These are not deficits. The differences are by divine design, I think. That is the JOY the Father feels when man and woman become ONE. Not just sexually, but emotionally, logically, psychologically, spiritually, in every way imaginable. I can be quite frustrating. But those moments when I feel like I can connect with my wife like that are wonderful. I am happy to say I feel like those moments are happening with greater regularity as we grow older together. There is a certain joy in that.

It seems like the answer to your question if found in all TRUE GROWTH that happens in combination with God's Grace. It requires humility and willingness. I have learned to listen and respond to my wife's emotional response to some things that happen in our family...even if it seems to fly in the face of logic. She has learned to give way for my logical response at times, even though all her instincts tell her to go down another path. That is the real magic of marriage. The give and take. Becoming one. I suspect that logic and emotion are ONE substance in Heaven. That is my goal...and I am just at the beginning of it.

You have identified one of the age-old "mysteries" of mankind. :)

[StrawberryFields]

Why is the average guy so clueless to what a girl is saying and feeling most of the time? Then looking at it the other way around.......Why do girls have so much trouble understanding guys and how they think?

PS: If you're married does it get easier as the years go by?

I agree with most of what has been said above. I think that the general need for a guy when it comes to women is to fix it, whatever the problem may be. If the can't fix it they basically malfunction and shut down, get angry, or "disappear". I think it is a smart woman who can recognize this and say I just need you to listen this time and not try to fix it.

I think after being married for years and years (more than 10) you learn so much from trial and error. I would never want to start all over with another man. It has taken years to get mine to fit just right.:)

[melissar]

I agree with most of what has been said above. I think that the general need for a guy when it comes to women is to fix it, whatever the problem may be. If the can't fix it they basically malfunction and shut down, get angry, or "disappear". I think it is a smart woman who can recognize this and say I just need you to listen this time and not try to fix it.

I think after being married for years and years (more than 10) you learn so much from trial and error. I would never want to start all over with another man. It has taken years to get mine to fit just right.:)

lol I totally agree with that.

[littlemisschatterbox]

My psychology teacher told us it's because of their brains..but you know what? It's really true. Girl brains develop faster..so technically they are like two years older than guys(at least in high school) Anyways, that's the technical part. I think it's just because guys are dumb jk I love them. I agree with everyone else, it's about how everyone deals with things. And some girls(or guys) have an easier time understanding the opposite sex. I think guys are easier to understand than some girls! But that is just my opinion

[Misshalfway]

This thread just conjures up so many memories!!! LOL

I think the ones who really overcome this problem are the ones who really invest in understanding the other side and then using that understanding to their advantage. You ever see those couples who are so individual but who just groove together? I think it is because they don't need each other to be anything other than what they are.

[Islander]

Well, yes, the brain. The final frontier.

Regardless of how much we strive in western society to blur the boundaries of gender roles, all we accomplish is to level the field in terms of certain behavior e.g occupations, access to resources, social relationships and the like. The realm of the emotions remains, by far, quite distinct and differentiated because of hardwired bio-mechanical processes that we are just now beginning to appreciate and sparsely understand.

Being young also does not help. Experience does much for insight, awareness and thus provide the ability to be mindful of these differences and how we should approach them. Experience also helps in molding and adapting expectations about relationships.

So, it is likely to remain boy meets girl and they are both on their own. By the way, there is absolutely nothing new in this arena. The context has changed over man's recorded history but the content of the exchange remains the same.

[LDSgirl]

I've really enjoyed reading everyones helpful insight! Thanks everyone!

[YoungMormonRoyalist]

Why is the average guy so clueless to what a girl is saying and feeling most of the time? Then looking at it the other way around.......Why do girls have so much trouble understanding guys and how they think?

PS: If you're married does it get easier as the years go by?

Because you guys can never be clear.

I'll tell you a story about a girl who liked a certain guy. She never told him, perhaps she made some non-verbal hints, perhaps some subtle verbal ones, but no "We should go out some time." The guy, who is currently saving up for a mission and college, is somewhat distracted by work/spiritual preperation, but is still open to dating.

It finally took a friend of the girls to say. "She's really interested in you." The guy, somewhat intrigued, asked her out on a couple of dates, and they had a blast.

And then my girlfriend moved...to Vegas!!!!

The moral: Be clear, as sexy as the non-verbal subtle hint stuff is, sometimes we need you gals to say "Hey, we should go out sometime." That's about as clear as we need to take the hint.

[MarginOfError]

Because you guys can never be clear.

I'll tell you a story about a girl who liked a certain guy. She never told him, perhaps she made some non-verbal hints, perhaps some subtle verbal ones, but no "We should go out some time." The guy, who is currently saving up for a mission and college, is somewhat distracted by work/spiritual preperation, but is still open to dating.

It finally took a friend of the girls to say. "She's really interested in you." The guy, somewhat intrigued, asked her out on a couple of dates, and they had a blast.

And then my girlfriend moved...to Vegas!!!!

The moral: Be clear, as sexy as the non-verbal subtle hint stuff is, sometimes we need you gals to say "Hey, we should go out sometime." That's about as clear as we need to take the hint.

Woah, danger my friend. Now you're telling women it's their fault for not communicating. The fact of the matter is they are communicating, and you're not understanding. And rule #1 of communication is any misunderstanding is the fault of the receiver.

The issue really isn't helped by saying that the other gender [style] has to be changed. Instead, you should be doing your best to learn to interpret the communicative behaviors of the other side.

[HiJolly]

Woah, danger my friend. Now you're telling women it's their fault for not communicating. The fact of the matter is they are communicating, and you're not understanding. And rule #1 of communication is any misunderstanding is the fault of the receiver.

The issue really isn't helped by saying that the other gender [style] has to be changed. Instead, you should be doing your best to learn to interpret the communicative behaviors of the other side.

Oh, dear. M o E, did you miss the minor detail that YoungMormonRoyalist is female? Oops.

HiJolly

[Islander]

Oh, dear. M o E, did you miss the minor detail that YoungMormonRoyalist is female? Oops.

HiJolly

LOL....Very loud. That was just precious.

By the way, the blaming game is very old. Again, the task at hand is for BOTH genders to develop better insight into the communication styles of the other. It also helps if we are assertive and avoid ambiguity when we speak and relate.

It is easier if our first intention is to become friends and get to know the other person. After all, if youi want to go for ice cream with your friends you don't say things like: "Cheeez, some cold ice cream sometime would be nice..."

I think fear (of rejection, inadequacy, whatever), lack of assertiveness and ambiguity really are the culprit here. If you want to go out with somebody ask the person: "Would you like to go for ice cream on Wednesday?" or whatever. If he/she says no because of being busy but counters with another specific day you know there is interest. If you get a vague response you should move on.

[MarginOfError]

Oh, dear. M o E, did you miss the minor detail that YoungMormonRoyalist is female? Oops.

Dangit...I hate making a fool of myself!

My apologies...let's flip all the gender references there. It works both ways.

[NeuroTypical]

And rule #1 of communication is any misunderstanding is the fault of the receiver.

I very much disagree. That sure ain't what they taught me in my college level communications class.

Communication:

Person A (we'll call him "Sender") has an idea to communicate.

Sender puts idea into a sendable form, attaching emotional baggage, past experiences, beliefs, understandings, and assumptions to the idea in the process. Sometimes sender is aware he's adding all this stuff, sometime's he's not. But we all do it.

Sender sends out the package through some media, be it audible, written, visual, or what have you.

The package sails through whatever media it is sent through, encountering background noise, echoes, reverberation, loss of signal strength, etc.

The package reaches Person B (the "Reciever")

Assuming Receiver knows this package was heading her way, Receiver pulls the idea package through her own emotional baggage, past experiences, beliefs, understandings, and assumptions. Again, sometime's she's aware this is what is going on, sometimes she isn't.

Anything left is what Receiver decodes as the idea.

What I learn from this process, is the notion that someone is always primarily to blame for a miscommuication is misguided and false. We're all at different levels in our ability to understand ourselves and others. Effective communication comes from understanding both. It requires effort on the part of both sender and receiver.

LM

Edited September 2, 2008 by Loudmouth_Mormon

[MarginOfError]

I very much disagree. That sure ain't what they taught me in my college level communications class.

Funny, that's exactly what we were taught in college (Interpersonal was my minor). I probably should include rules #2 and 3 (which are my own creation), so we'd have rules

1) Any misunderstanding is the fault of the receiver.

2) Being understood is the responsibility of the sender.

3) The only meaning that matters is the one that is received.

The logic behind misunderstanding being the fault of the receiver is that the sender knows what message her or she intended to send. Thus, no matter what the words or the medium, the sender knows the actual meaning of the message, and cannot misunderstand it. Thus, fault for misunderstanding can belong to none other than the receiver.

You're welcome to disagree with me, I don't. Just thought I'd clarify your logic. In general, I think people should be working their hardest to be understood clearly, and to ascertain how well their communicative partners understand them. In the context of gender, this means trying to understand how the other gender interprets communicative encounters. But when there is a misunderstanding, it usually results from the receiver interpreting the communication from his or her own gender's paradigm.

[Misshalfway]

See... this is the point where I say to my husband "shut up and kiss me!"

[Bookmeister]

Me guy. Me fix things. Me lift heavy things. Me hunt (or work) for food and things. Girl say, "this is my problem," me think, "How to fix". Girl no want "fix", want guy to listen. Girl want guy to be supportive. Me, like other guys, go into man cave to fix problems. Me not know girl no want fix.

Me go lift a heavy thing now.

[YoungMormonRoyalist]

Oh, dear. M o E, did you miss the minor detail that YoungMormonRoyalist is female? Oops.

HiJolly

..............

................................

..............................................

........................................................

I'm a guy.

Woah, danger my friend. Now you're telling women it's their fault for not communicating. The fact of the matter is they are communicating, and you're not understanding. And rule #1 of communication is any misunderstanding is the fault of the receiver.

The issue really isn't helped by saying that the other gender [style] has to be changed. Instead, you should be doing your best to learn to interpret the communicative behaviors of the other side.

What we've got here....is a failure to communicate.

For the most part, I understand when the other gender is trying to communicate interest. I just like verbal communication......

Edited September 4, 2008 by YoungMormonRoyalist

[LDSgirl]

Me guy. Me fix things. Me lift heavy things. Me hunt (or work) for food and things. Girl say, "this is my problem," me think, "How to fix". Girl no want "fix", want guy to listen. Girl want guy to be supportive. Me, like other guys, go into man cave to fix problems. Me not know girl no want fix.

Me go lift a heavy thing now.

Lol.....that was pretty funny! Now put the tools down and come out of the cave and listen to me!

[HiJolly]

So, then... The oops is on me. Or are you androgenous?

HiJolly