Healthy Competition

[Maxel]

Hey all-

So, I was wondering if there's really such a thing as a 'healthy competition'. In asking the question, I define the following terms thusly:

Healthy- conducive to overall (physical and spiritual) well-being without noticeable negative side effects

Competition- the practice of pitting one's talents or other character traits against another

I have participated in sporting and other 'competitive' events that were benign and most definitely healthy. However, I noticed that a requirement was the lack of keeping score- the secret was to set each other up as non-malicious obstacles to the goal (winning the event). I noticed that when importance was placed on the outcome, even if that just meant that score was kept, the camaraderie between teams quickly evaporated.

Anyone else have any insights on this?

[Connie]

I know that word, competition, is mentioned a lot in this talk: LDS.org - Ensign Article - Beware of Pride

Such as here: "The proud make every man their adversary by pitting their intellects, opinions, works, wealth, talents, or any other worldly measuring device against others. In the words of C. S. Lewis: “Pride gets no pleasure out of having something, only out of having more of it than the next man. … It is the comparison that makes you proud: the pleasure of being above the rest. Once the element of competition has gone, pride has gone.” (Mere Christianity, New York: Macmillan, 1952, pp. 109–10.)"

I know one of my brothers who was on the swim team in high school was encouraged to only "compete with himself" as it were.

Not sure how helpful that is.

[Maxel]

I know one of my brothers who was on the swim team in high school was encouraged to only "compete with himself" as it were.

Not sure how helpful that is.

Actually, I hadn't thought of that in this context before. I guess the pitting of oneself versus oneself at first seems a conundrum, but it makes perfect sense if we use a language shift towards Gospel understanding.

I guess the competition between the spiritual and natural man is exactly that: a competition. In the instance of your brother, the only 'healthy' competition is one in which his spiritual man is fed and encouraged- that is to say, the only healthy competition he could have is if he pitted the principles of the spiritual man (discipline, honor, hard work) against the principles of the carnal man (laziness, deception), at the same feeding strengthening his spiritual man while starving his carnal man.

If that's the case, I guess a healthy competition can exist as long as it is the spiritual man that is being fed- like President Benson commented, the competition must satisfy and exercise the principles of the spiritual men in both parties, or the competition becomes unhealthy.

[Connie]

Actually, I hadn't thought of that in this context before. I guess the pitting of oneself versus oneself at first seems a conundrum, but it makes perfect sense if we use a language shift towards Gospel understanding.

I guess the competition between the spiritual and natural man is exactly that: a competition. In the instance of your brother, the only 'healthy' competition is one in which his spiritual man is fed and encouraged- that is to say, the only healthy competition he could have is if he pitted the principles of the spiritual man (discipline, honor, hard work) against the principles of the carnal man (laziness, deception), at the same feeding strengthening his spiritual man while starving his carnal man.

If that's the case, I guess a healthy competition can exist as long as it is the spiritual man that is being fed- like President Benson commented, the competition must satisfy and exercise the principles of the spiritual men in both parties, or the competition becomes unhealthy.

Oooooo. I like it!! You rock, Maxel! I'm in total awe!

[Madriglace]

Healthy competion is possible even with scores etc. I show dogs in conformation competitions. Dog people are basically nuts and can be very nasty. For some it's all about the win and winning no matter what they have to do. Years ago I decided that that just wasn't me. I have tried to make an effort to compete in a way that would please my Savior. I offer to help groom the competition, help with handling, congratulate others when they win and keep the whole shooting match in perspective ... this isn't life it's just a dog show. Mostly for me it's about pushing myself to be the best I can be and still remember what's important. I even have my Catholic partner (our agnostic friend doesn't ride with us anymore because we pray) praying before we leave for shows and the one thing that is always asked is that we have help remembering who we are and competing in manner that is please to Him.

[NeuroTypical]

Healthy- conducive to overall (physical and spiritual) well-being without noticeable negative side effects

From where I'm standing, that bold part doesn't belong.

Without shame, there is no honor. Without defeat, there is no victory. Satan's plan involved a total lack of keeping score, where 'everybody wins'. We're here to learn and grow and be tested and tried. Sometimes you learn by being ground into the dust by an uncharitable victor. Sometimes you grow by learning humility in victory. A lack of stuff like this dampens our progression.

LM

[whaddaya mean I can't charitably use the term 'weenie' anywhere in this post!!?!]

[Vort]

I agree with the idea that the essence of pride is competition. In a philosophical sense, I cannot justify competition. I cannot imagine the mortal Savior striving to defeat another person just so he could thump his chest and say, "YEEEAAAAHHHH!!!", even silently in his own mind.

But our society encourages competition at every turn, and even our Church leaders seem to accept and occasionally promote it, so I'm trying to find a way to include it in my life and the lives of my family members without the negativity. So far, I've had only limited and mixed success.

[RavinMaven]

My brother and I played the same instrument in highschool and constently competed for first chair. Without this "healthy competition" neither of us would have expanded our talents to the level that we did, so I think that in the right context competition can be both healthy and help us to improve ourselves.

Competition also teaches us humility when we are defeated.

[Maxel]

From where I'm standing, that bold part doesn't belong.

Without shame, there is no honor. Without defeat, there is no victory. Satan's plan involved a total lack of keeping score, where 'everybody wins'. We're here to learn and grow and be tested and tried. Sometimes you learn by being ground into the dust by an uncharitable victor. Sometimes you grow by learning humility in victory. A lack of stuff like this dampens our progression.

I appreciate your insight, but that sounds more like relativism to me. Personally, I am well acquainted with defeat and victory by virtue of living my day-to-day life: I am constantly winning and losing battles with my own carnal self. Even when I triumph, there's the temptation to "gloat"- that is, the temptation to be haughty and think "I did this" instead of "Christ helped me do this".

[whaddaya mean I can't charitably use the term 'weenie' anywhere in this post!!?!]

I agree with the idea that the essence of pride is competition. In a philosophical sense, I cannot justify competition. I cannot imagine the mortal Savior striving to defeat another person just so he could thump his chest and say, "YEEEAAAAHHHH!!!", even silently in his own mind.

But our society encourages competition at every turn, and even our Church leaders seem to accept and occasionally promote it, so I'm trying to find a way to include it in my life and the lives of my family members without the negativity. So far, I've had only limited and mixed success.

That's sort of my problem. I think there will still be 'competitive' sports in a Zion society, but the fundamental goals and philosophies surrounding them will be different than we see at Church basketball games. I don't know how, but maybe the presence of the Holy Ghost alone drives out all thoughts and passions of unhealthy competition.

[Elgama]

I am going to agree with Connie she said what I was going to say the healthiest competition is with yourself

One of my favourite book is Racing Alone by Nader Khalili (he's an architect) - there is a story about his son, they had gone to the park when he was 4 and some older children were having races Dastan wanted to join in but after awhile got fed up of losing and came back and asked his Dad to count so he could race alone. So he went round the same route as everyone else but got back having picked up a leaf, flower etc and was really excited, happy and fulfilled.

I have Dyspraxia (used to be called clumsy child syndrome) as a result pitting myself against other people would be stupid, 9 times out of 10 I am going to lose, but the sweet joy at 26 of finally being able to tie my shoelaces properly was just amazing.

-Charley