dazed-and-confused Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I was talking with a few people recently in another thread and the subject of released felons from prison came up. Most of the opinions expressed were, Not In My Back Yard, meaning that they were not welcome near those that stated that opinion. So I want to ask everyone, just what should be done with released felons? Should they be totally segregated somehow? Is that even legal or possible? Should they be kept close in order to observe them and be sure they are not re-offending? Clearly, we can't execute them, but nobody seems to want felons anywhere near them.So, what should be done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed-and-confused Posted August 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 not sure why this came up in cultures instead of gen. discussion....my bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jbs2763 Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 send them to france Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Correct me if I'm wrong, but as things stand now, a released felon (assuming no conditions of parole) is free to move about the country and live wherever they wish, right? And there usually isn't someone publishing their whereabouts, right? Exception - just about everybody nowadays has a sex offender registry database. Some communities actively notify residents when one moves in (or wants to). LM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FunkyTown Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Correct me if I'm wrong, but as things stand now, a released felon (assuming no conditions of parole) is free to move about the country and live wherever they wish, right? And there usually isn't someone publishing their whereabouts, right?Exception - just about everybody nowadays has a sex offender registry database. Some communities actively notify residents when one moves in (or wants to).LMThat's a tough call. I've heard sex offenders are some of the highest in terms of likelihood to reoffend, which is why they created that database. Truth is, I've never seen statistics.Then again, I worry that the database will find some 18 year old kid who wasn't thinking and had sex with their 17 year old girlfriend and ended up being unwelcome anywhere in the country afterwards. I don't know what the answer is. It's a shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dravin Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Then again, I worry that the database will find some 18 year old kid who wasn't thinking and had sex with their 17 year old girlfriend and ended up being unwelcome anywhere in the country afterwards. I don't know what the answer is. It's a shame.In your specific example the 18 year old is safe (in Utah), if I'm reading the stuff for Utah correctly, he'd need to be 10 or more years older than the girl to get himself on the list.People do get put on the list and are assumed pedophiles though such isn't necessarily the case. Kinda reminds me of an episode of Without A Trace, some guy's daughter went missing and some other guy in the neighborhood stood on the street outside his house announcing about the registered sex offender living down the street, Dad of course sees the sex offender walking his dog and attacks him demanding to know what he did with his daughter, Feds pull him off and inform him the guy is on the list for rape of an adult. Still not a nice man, but not a pedophile.Its actually kind interesting to look at what can get you on the list here in Utah: Utah Department of Corrections--SONAR - Sex Offender Notification and Registration, most of it applies to children but not all of it, interestingly enough Lewdness requires 4 convictions to get you listed, so no getting put on the list because you do a drive by mooning and some Dad/Mom with their kid catches your plates (at least not until you do it 3 more times). Being a peeping tom only takes one go though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed-and-confused Posted August 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 That's a tough call. I've heard sex offenders are some of the highest in terms of likelihood to reoffend, which is why they created that database. Truth is, I've never seen statistics.Then again, I worry that the database will find some 18 year old kid who wasn't thinking and had sex with their 17 year old girlfriend and ended up being unwelcome anywhere in the country afterwards. I don't know what the answer is. It's a shame.As i recall, FT, i DO remember hearing some such thing on the news, where a teenager was, in fact, listed as a SO (sex offender) for having a younger girl-friend, by perhaps a couple of years. Not in utah, i guess. The family of BOTH parties involved were going to appeal.As for pedophiles, of course, their whereabouts is important to know, as FT mentioned, SO's have the highest rate of re-offending. And this was something that struck me during my original conversation, do i want a pedophile totally removed from my area, or do i eant to know where he/she is in order to better watch out for dangers. Don't forget, when someone does get arrested, it most likely isn't the first time such an incident took place, they just hadn't been caught yet.however, i don't want this to be simply about SO's, but every type of felon.Thanks for your responses so far, good stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rameumptom Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Given that I get furloughed every weekend from the local prison I work at as a counselor, let me give my 2 cents.... 97% of all inmates will end up released. Most of them are not sex offenders, and so can easily move in next door to us. Get used to that idea. If we do not want prisons around our homes, we need to pay to have them elsewhere or find other forms of legalized punishment. Sex offender lists all depend upon the state. Some states, like Indiana, are so strict right now that a 19 year old can go to jail for sex with his 16 year old girlfriend, and be labeled a sex offender for life. Someone who exposes himself in public is also labeled a sex offender for life. Such is extremely harsh, and I hope Indiana will soon get some common sense rules in place - hopefully to reduce the number of years most people stay on the registry. The statistics show that rapists and child molesters tend to reoffend. But we're finding that many others are now finding themselves on the registry, because of public backlash to molestation. The best thing we can do is to embrace these incarcerated men and women (and youth), and help them to reintegrate back into the community. You want to keep them from reoffending? Good, then help give them a worthwhile life and reason to be a good citizen. Pay for substance abuse classes with your taxes (in Indiana the recidivism for drug users drops by half for those who attend classes in prison). Teach them a skill. Offer them a job, so they don't have to go back to stealing. Volunteer at the local prison to mentor, teach literacy, or teach them how to relate with others. Our prisons are overloaded because parents for the past 50 years have neglected teaching their kids. Now in the third generation of delinquents, we need to step up and take them in, or slowly watch the prison population grow out of control, and our taxes and safety grow with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Sorry, icky jail people make me uncomfortable. LM (Actually, in total agreement with Ram, and will be heading to Utah for a parole hearing next year to see if there's anything we can do.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jbs2763 Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 as far as i know the baby rapers are the only ones that have to let you know when they move next door, and like ram said, here in indiana the "misconduct with a minor" as it is called, is a 10 yr registry, but they are too lax on some folk even... someone i know personaly who had a 10 yr "relationship" with his son...got out of prison 10 yrs early, and only had to register for 10... IMHO the baby rapers....child molesters, rapists, etc.....why bother...string them up in front of the courthouse..let them dangle for a few weeks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alana Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Of course I don't want a sex offender in my neighborhood. But if they are there, it's because they did their time. I want to protect my kids from those who've been caught and punished and those who I don't know have evil intentions. Right now my kids are little so they are always in my sight, so it's probably easier to keep them safe than when they are older and will be allowed out in the neighborhood more. When I went on Megan's law website (sexual offenders in California) I found two people I knew. It didn't change my interactions with them (which were casual) because I didn't fear for my children from them, they were never allowed alone with them even before I knew. Of course, the interactions were casual anyways, they weren't over to our house. I like the precautions that there are now. Websites and not letting them live near schools or interact with children, etc. I don't think herding them away from society once they've done their time is a good idea. But, if there was a bill to increase jail time for pedophiles, I'd probably vote in favor of it. On an other note, I'm grateful that I didn't never to have a concerted concern about my own safety in regards to those men we knew, either. The 'rule' of our marriage that we don't hang out with friends of the opposite sex alone serves in a few different ways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alana Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Also, would like to say, that our computer guy who was registered as a sex offender (with acts with children under 14 years old) moved to Costa Rica. He's listed as 'in violation' on Megan's law website right now. So, his neighbors probably won't know who he is or what he has done. Hopefully they are just as careful as if they did know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Something to keep in mind: You've got good odds of having a child sex offender living in your neighborhood, whether he's registered or not. They come from all income levels, family backgrounds, races, education levels, and religious affiliations. About the only skewed demographic, is that 90% are male and 10% female. Over the years, I've watched news stories go past about predators in our church. The missionary arrested for molesting children in nursery. The 87 yr old Seventy showing gay porn to teen boys. The Bishop who felt up the Beehive in the library. The Stake President of Butte Montana stake, arrested in Idaho with a box of red lingire after setting up a date with a 14 yr old girl who turned out to be a cop. Just last year, excommunicated former First Quorum of the Seventy member George P. Lee, was arrested on suspicion of failing to register as a sex offender. It had been three years since keepers of the state's sex offender registry knew Lee's whereabouts. No, not everyone is a child molester. In fact, hardly anyone is one. But "hardly anyone" is the same thing as "they are in our midst". And yes, anyone could be. LM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed-and-confused Posted August 4, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I get the very strong impression that most people don't care about a "normal" felon, just sex offenders/predators. I was aware that this would happen. I think it's good to talk about such things so as to keep current on both societal obligations, as well as, religious ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I was talking with a few people recently in another thread and the subject of released felons from prison came up. Most of the opinions expressed were, Not In My Back Yard, meaning that they were not welcome near those that stated that opinion. So I want to ask everyone, just what should be done with released felons? Should they be totally segregated somehow? Is that even legal or possible? Should they be kept close in order to observe them and be sure they are not re-offending? Clearly, we can't execute them, but nobody seems to want felons anywhere near them.So, what should be done? The irony is that some of my best, most effective religious volunteers who come IN to the jail are ex-felons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazed-and-confused Posted August 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Thanks, PC. Fact is, I know some myself. They are pretty common in kitchens, and more so coming to the shelter I work at. The ones that are reformed are great people who have gotten their lives together, in some ways, better than "normal" people. Ones that haven't are , well, sorry people, if I mat be so blunt. I sometimes go between being angry with them and feeling sorry for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 I heard of a cluster of apartments in the University district (UW) that the landlord chose to rent out to released sex-offenders. The tenents were all in accountability programs, held jobs, gained understanding and strength from each other. The landlord found them reliable and far easier on her property than university students. A well-connected university person caught wind of this and called in a couple chits with the governor, and wouldn't you know, the tenants had to leave. Nothing kills success like politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Loudmouth, I could be wrong, but at least your church does not have an "Anti" ministry, soley dedicated to exposing an alleged culture that coddles and protects predators. There is another group that does. Supposedly, this group takes literally the Old Testament requirement for two witnesses to a crime, and sense molestation almost never has that, victims are ordered to be silent or face religious discipline. I don't want to name the group, because I don't know enough first or second-hand to be willing to publically lend credence to the charges. But, this group is organized, shows up at the religion's conventions, and has a presence on youtube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Believer_1829 Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Sex Offender databases do not achieve their objective and perhaps contribute to possible future offenses... 99.9% of sex offenses against children are perpetrated by family members or close family friends, not strangers. Sex Offenders, in general, are not drooling perverts waiting for any opportunity to snatch your kid. In many instances sex offenses have a lot to do with wrong thinking and social awkwardness. Making it impossible for sex offenders to find gainful employment or a place to live only serves to feed the feelings that fueled their offense in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alana Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 There was an old mansion a little bit outside of town that had been converted to studio apartments. They rented to mostly sex offenders. Well, once a neighbor found out about it from Megan's law they made a huge deal about it. So they held a neighborhood rally and got local officials involved in it and within a few months, no more renters with a history there. I like the idea of them being able to find a stable place to live where there are no kids in the complex. Now, I would not be surprised if some of them are transients and have no listed address, or in neighborhoods with kids instead of this place off by its self. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alana Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 99.9% of statistics are made up on the spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Believer_1829 Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Matthew 25 Ministries A MINISTRY TO SEX OFFENDERS"According to a report by the U.S. Department of Justice 90% of the rapes of children less than 12 years old were committed by a person the child knew not by a stranger Office of Justice Programs "**OK, 90%, not 99%** Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Alana Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 ok, I confess, I made up that statistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeuroTypical Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Louis Midgely tells a story about working with sex offenders that has stuck with me over the years. It took a few google searches, but I finally found it:I loved visiting the sex offenders unit of an Auckland prison one afternoon a week for two years. I realize that this will be hard to believe, but there I was with people that I loved and could express my affection to. And those people accepted me despite my being a pale face and whatever goes with professor.When my wife and I arrived I greeted the Maori and some others by placing my left arm on the back of the other one and taking the placing my right hand in there right and and then touching the nose and forhead. If you saw the Whale Rider, you saw this greeting taking place between Maori gents in the scene filmed in an Auckland hospital. And you saw it at the end when the little girl revived the whale by touching he nose and forhead to the head of the whale. This is a ritual greeting in which the breath of life is exchanged.Every time I greeted those fellows in that prison I could look right into their eyes only an inch away and I often saw tears. This happened both with my wife and I arrived and when we departed.In that situation I know myself as quite a different person. And I like myself better there among my Maori friends than I do here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vort Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 36.211% of statistics are improperly precise. About 50% of statistics are approximations. 103% of statistics don't make sense. 10% of statistics have religious overtones. 99.98%of statistics are very inclusive, while 0.02% are highly exclusionary. 80% of statistics use round numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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