Reserved Seats in Chapel for Sacrament Meeting?

[Suzie]

Can you possibly accept that a recent divorce, no stability in wards, and who knows what else leaves another person in a situation that you simply don't understand at this point? (and then drop it already? your point is well understood)

Who told you I do not understand? Oh brother, trust me you do not know me, my past and my present circumstances. You would be VERY surprised actually. :) However, again is a matter of choices each one of us make.

Drop it already? I didn't know you was my boss. :)

I would hate to see this thread closing because we cannot discuss this issue without getting emotionally involved or personal so I propose to focus on the TOPIC rather than the person.

[ryanh]

Who told you I do not understand?

You did by saying "I just cannot comprehend why", and by the way this is going forward without concern for the feelings for the OP. There are times to boldly tell someone to shape up. But, still, those actions ought to be done out of love, not a place of trying to prove we are right.

I will stick up for my brother/sister anytime when repeated postings of a point could be having negative consequences with what appears to me to be an unawareness because of a lack of understanding and or compassion.

“Maturity begins when we're content to feel we're right about something without feeling the necessity to prove someone else wrong.” Sydney J. Harris

[Suzie]

It's called figure of speech. It is sad though that you are assuming intention (just wanted to be "right"). Well, I suppose that's your opinion and that's alright. :)

[lumberjacksdaughter]

Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these My brethren, ye have done it unto Me.

No room in the inn. No room in the pew. I'm just curious, hypothetically, what if the next seat chosen was already "taken" and the next, and the next?

By the way, I don't have a shy bone in my body. I did come out of the womb saying "don't tell me what to do!". And my life has been as fun as a barrel full of monkeys, let me tell ya (crazed, rabid monkeys!). So, actually I'm not nursing hurt feelings. I just don't like being given commands by strangers, whatever the cirumstance. A character flaw that I need to work on, I admit. Now I feel disconnected from the world around me and alienated from the human race in general. I accept full responsibility for my perdicament.

I was born to be free.

I told the world

Don't tether me!

As finally I float away

Now, I wish

That I could stay.

(by me)

[lumberjacksdaughter]

I like, 'And nothing shall offend them'. It's a great talk about how we can't be offended.

That's why, when I was on vacation and someone told me in a chapel I was visiting that an empty pew was reserved, I cheerily continued plopping in and said 'Then the maitre'd lied to me. You should take it up with him.'

It's just a seat and Elder Bednar's talk was pretty specific, so I figured she probably wasn't offended.

FunkyTown,

When I grow up, I want to be just like you. I think your response under the circumstance was mature and creative. I think also that you used tact and humor. And boldness can often be necessary to get a point across. Beats being offended and leaving the chapel.

[Wingnut]

The point of church is to worship TOGETHER and if we find that we have unintentionally been rude, to be nicer next time.

(1) The family was trying to worship together.

(2) The "offender" still doesn't know that she'd been unintentionally rude, so that's an entirely moot point.

Maybe you are not a shy type. Personally, if I was all by myself, in a new ward, and someone said that to me, and I was shy, I would be embarrassed and feelings hurt and would leave. I am not shy, but if I saw this happen to someone, I would think the seat-saving people were jacka--es.

Maybe the person who said it is that. But to allow that person to dictate your actions and your worship habits and to leave because of one person? It's a little reactionary.

Like Crazypotato to turn someone away without at least some good apolgetic excuse would be plain rude.

Saving a seat for your family isn't a good apologetic excuse? Since when?

Being turned away wouldn't bother me,

No one was turned away or kicked out or any other similar metaphor. They were asked to move to another seat.

Actually find it disgusting that a strange face is not cared for and invited to sit somewhere.

Who's to say that the person saving seats wasn't visiting the ward, or new? We assume that she knew that the OP wasn't usually there.

If we as Latter Day Saints can't do Christ's duty and keep those first two commandments. To then blame the other person stinks. Sure they will be held accountable for their actions but surely the greater sin is with the one with the greatest understanding.

What's the old proverb? He who takes offense when none is meant is a fool. He who takes offense when it is intended is a greater fool. And in James, we read For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.

[crazypotato]

I was going to post and say, "Let's kill Suzie!" Just joking! Because I think too many people are jumping on her right now and it is not worth it. But then Wingnut posts her rebuttals to me and some other posters, so now Wingnut is apparently not going to let us kill Suzie. It's getting ridiculous, this thread. Why do so many threads on LDS go so retarded like this?

It's like no one can concede anything to each other on here.

[Hemidakota]

I do ever understand how you felt. I hate meetings like Stake Conference when the choir is there an hour or so early for a final practice and they spread their scriptures and notebooks out to “save” seats for later. Then, those seats stay vacant until ten minutes before the meeting starts and then the families come in and fill the spots. Others, who have come early, are back in the “cheap seats” (folding chairs). Our Stake Presidency has started holding meetings for new members and investigators 45 minutes before the conference and ONLY those who have been baptized in the past year or those with investigators are allowed in. The choir warms up in the RS room.

We, as members, need to be more sensitive to others.

Excellent point...now, I have seen where the night prior, setting up the chairs by specific wards, create advantage of saving several seating postions up front in a 8-ward building.

I need to talk to my friend who is a Stake President and use your stake concept with investigators and baptized members.

[Wingnut]

Why do so many threads on LDS go so retarded like this?

Because we all like to debate. Is there something wrong with that?

[Suzie]

I was going to post and say, "Let's kill Suzie!" Just joking! Because I think too many people are jumping on her right now and it is not worth it. But then Wingnut posts her rebuttals to me and some other posters, so now Wingnut is apparently not going to let us kill Suzie. It's getting ridiculous, this thread. Why do so many threads on LDS go so retarded like this?

It's like no one can concede anything to each other on here.

Hey too many people is just one or two.

Oh yes, I can concede that we should all be kind to each other. Can you concede that the REACTION you choose to have when someone offends you has nothing to do with the "offender" but is entirely your choice? (the "offended") :)

[Suzie]

What's the old proverb? He who takes offense when none is meant is a fool. He who takes offense when it is intended is a greater fool.

Love that quote, I will put it as my signature. Thanks! :)

[Suzie]

I was going to post and say, "Let's kill Suzie!" Just joking! Because I think too many people are jumping on her right now and it is not worth it. But then Wingnut posts her rebuttals to me and some other posters, so now Wingnut is apparently not going to let us kill Suzie. It's getting ridiculous, this thread. Why do so many threads on LDS go so retarded like this?

It's like no one can concede anything to each other on here.

For me, it's sad when a good thread gets locked just because people disagree and start getting emotional. I don't think this thread is getting ridiculous at all or "r" like you mentioned.

[crazypotato]

Because we all like to debate. Is there something wrong with that?

There's debating, and then there goes the personal jabs and attacks, judgements, and leaping to conclusions about each other. It is very retarded (no offense to retarded people).

[crazypotato]

Love that quote, I will put it as my signature. Thanks! :)

Fools mock, but they shall mourn!

Whoever calls his neighbor "Rabba" or "fool" is in danger of . . . However those scriptures go. You know what I mean!

I am laughing. . .

[crazypotato]

Hey too many people is just one or two.

Oh yes, I can concede that we should all be kind to each other. Can you concede that the REACTION you choose to have when someone offends you has nothing to do with the "offender" but is entirely your choice? (the "offended") :)

OH, now I am sooo offended at your connotations. You blankety blank!!!!

[Suzie]

Fools mock, but they shall mourn!

Whoever calls his neighbor "Rabba" or "fool" is in danger of . . . However those scriptures go. You know what I mean!

I am laughing. . .

Hey, Crazypotato you are free to say what you want to say without the humor camouflage eh. And hey, it's Raca. :)

[crazypotato]

Hey, Crazypotato you are free to say what you want to say without the humor camouflage eh. And hey, it's Raca. :)

Camoflage? How did you know I was in a military family? This is getting creepy. I feel compelled to use the emoticons:

Wow, I never noticed the more options thing here. I like the Satan ones. Those will come in really useful the next time I am judging someone to be Satanic on here. . .

[crazypotato]

Hey, Crazypotato you are free to say what you want to say without the humor camouflage eh. And hey, it's Raca. :)

Oh Raca not Rabba! Ha! I knew I had something wrong there. It sounded too much like Rabbi.

Why can't I use the emoticons when I have been laughing my butt off all day? Wait, is there one of those?

[Melissa569]

In our ward, we have LOTS of people. So we always have to open the divider to the gym, and set up about 6 more rows of folding chairs.

It seems that the pews up front are usually taken up by the "regular" families. As in the ones that are the most involved, and come every Sunday, almost without fail. And I've noticed they always sit in the same exact places.

Everyone else-- investigators, people with patchy attendence, inactives who've returned-- even the missionaries! -- all sit in the chairs in the back. I don't really think its a demand, or anything. Its just the way it always turns out.

But yeah, it was kinda rude for them to make you feel like the seats were claimed. The family probably could have squeezed in next to you, and it would have been a good chance for you to get to know some members. Despite the regular seating patterns in my ward, if you walk in all alone, or just stand off to the side not knowing where to sit, somebody will usually make eye contact with you and gesture to an empty seat next to them, inviting you to sit there. Or a missionary or regular member will come up to you and lead you to a seat near a family, and introduce you to them.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Melissa569

[Boris_natasha]

Hey! What is this thing about wanting to sit on the same pew every Sunday, anyway? It's not a couch, where your butt print is beginning to provide that "sweet spot".

[Elgama]

How was she treated badly? I fail to see this. She sees a purse in the middle row and she sits there (I would have personally ask anyone around if that seat is taken seeing that there is a purse in there but that's just me). So it's obvious to me that someone (or more) were sitting in that bench before she arrived, what is exactly the problem? Maybe the person in question just went to use the restroom with her small child and just want to return to her seat? How is it that informing someone the seat is reserved equal being "treated badly"?

She was treated badly because she wasn't welcomed. From what i can gather the person didn't even say hello my name is, shake her hand and ask her name. A nice conversation and help to find her a seat would have made all the difference. As I said in a previous post it doesn't take much to rearrange or help the other person find a seat. Instead of this is for our family/clique etc The message sent is I don't give a monkey's about you.

When you live in a small unit you see how deeply feeling pushed out and unwelcomed affects people. The same happens in a larger unit but instead of being recognised the person just gets lost. Even if they don't walk out they continue to get lost. When we revisited my husband's old family ward, whilst everyone knew his parents., only one or two people knew who he was.

This is part of being a member missionary. Heck even my Speakers Club recognises that in order to retain people, you make them feel welcomed. Number 1 way to do that is to introduce yourself to them and making sure they know where to sit. Which is why when every other club in the country is dying ours is growing.

When I showed up a lonely YSA in my college ward, I was greeted, invited to sit next to the Bishop's wife (she rearranged her family specially). After sacrament she found me another YSA sister to help me. When I arrived at the RS everybody introduced themselves. I felt loved and I felt welcomed. Would I have left church if they hadn't NO, but I know several YSA who have been unwelcomed in the their college ward that have walked away when for the first time they are sitting on their own and are not part of the family.

I did however felt loved and welcomed and had no need to feel I wasn't wanted or a vital part of the church. I am not saying walking away was the right decision but she can always go back again next week. But if as a church we think its OK to not welcome people I am not sure how we expect people to feel the spirit of Christ the moment they walk through the door.

Edited August 2, 2010 by Elgama

[Wingnut]

There's debating, and then there goes the personal jabs and attacks, judgements, and leaping to conclusions about each other. It is very retarded (no offense to retarded people).

You mean like saying "let's kill Suzie!"?

[crazypotato]

You mean like saying "let's kill Suzie!"?

Uh, that was a joke.

[Wingnut]

Uh, that was a joke.

I figured as much. I've been the butt of such a joke in an online forum before (not this one). Even when intended as a joke, it can still be hurtful.

[Elgama]

I figured as much. I've been the butt of such a joke in an online forum before (not this one). Even when intended as a joke, it can still be hurtful.

kinda like even when you innocently turn someone away from a seat in the chapel? even when intended innocently it can be hurtful.

What happened to when no harm was intended?