Any advice would be good..

[alecia]

I wasn't sure what section to post in, as I kinda need advice on both marriage and general.

Obviously it would take a long time to inform you of the full story, so short story is this. I met my husband 10 years ago (he was a member of the church already), I ended up joining the church, we got sealed in the Temple, then after probably only going there a couple of times... for some reason we fell away.

That was a long time ago. Have since had 2 kiddies who are now 5 and 6 and a reasonably happy marriage. I have always had a strong desire to go back to church but my husband is rather... errr.. (for lack of a better word)... rebellious and just feels like he doesn't "fit in" there. So... consequently we have never gone back. Perhaps I should have done so on my own...

Anyways, the past year has been pure hell for me. My husband "cheated" on me (ok, not physically, but texts/emails/visiting her.. hopping into bed with her fully clothed etc - you get the picture). It devastated me. She found out he was never leaving me (as he had told her) and she then said she wants nothing to do with him. A lot of drama went down. A lot of hurtful words that he said to me. A lot of pain. Physical and emotional. He then said he would never ever contact her again.... I gave him a second chance. I then found out he had texted her again saying he missed her. She ignored it. I tried to end it but he begged for one more chance. I gave it.

Finally, 3 weeks ago she then contacted me again saying that could I please delete her number from his phone as she doesn't want to hear from him and he has been texting her for weeks again (saying things like "I feel like the whole universe is telling me you and I should be together..." etc). That was the final straw for me.

I was again so disappointed/disgusted/angry/sad .... I had truly believed he had stopped. It has been lie after lie with him. He has never once told me the truth about all of this... I have had to either find out myself or rely on this woman to tell me. It's been terrible! If he had owned up to all this without me finding out on my own first... even that would have been slightly better. But he only owned up and admitted it when I had him backed into a corner cos I knew the truth already.

Now... he wants to fix this. He says he loves me and wants to be with me. He says he wants to want to go to church... and even says he will. I have no idea what to do. I have been saying my first prayers in a long time, and because I feel so far from Heavenly Father, I don't know what is right to do. I don't know whether to stay in this marriage and "fix it" or even if it CAN be "fixed". I hold a lot of hurt... a lot. He knows that and has said he's sorry. But things like that are easy to say.

I guess my question is... has anyone been through anything like this? I feel that I have given this marriage MORE than enough chances... I have been 150% loving, loyal and supportive. I never gave up on him.... ever. But now... I feel that it's time for ME. I am so lost here and have no idea what to do.

Sorry this is so long.

[Gwen]

i haven't been where you are. so i can't really say much. this book might give you something to think on. His Needs, Her Needs he talks a lot about affairs, how they happen, why they happen, the thinking/emotions behind them (how it's different for men and women), how to over come them, and how to prevent them from happening again.

[Roseslipper]

well my frist thought was maybe he did end it with her and maybe shes lying trying to break up your marriage cause she wants your husband. Oviously the best thing for the both of u is to talk,talk about this issue(s) with your spouce, find out what hes missing from the marriage, dont get your feelings hurt listen to his needs and wants and he needs to listen to you and what u want as well. this marriage can probably be saved if you both put the time and effect into doing the work, to rekindle your relationship and rebuild it. Also going back to church will be the best descion you and your spouce make. Even if u both desided to end the marriage. Good Luck. oh and dont forget to pray alone and as a couple.

[TheActualLiz]

I am glad you are praying and reaching out for Heavenly Father's advice. This is a good start. If you miss church, then I would encourage you to go.... if your husband cannot make it for whatever reason then I am sorry he missed out... hopefully next Sunday.

My husband and I have trouble making sacrament meeting as well and it is unfortunate, but that does not mean we have to let go of our attempts at spiritual development. There are always small things that can be done to make the home a more spiritual place.

One small and possibly silly but very effective thing I have done at home is to start keeping a Book of Mormon in the bathroom. I am quite serious about this as I never had time to read the scriptures before but now I read them every day! :)

Inviting the missionaries over for dinner is another wonderful thing to do when church activity has become difficult. I am sure they would have no problem with dinner and a spiritual discussion... and it is another thing that has helped my family.

I am not saying that either of these things are good replacements for church.... I am saying they can help bring you closer to feeling like you have a relationship with Heavenly Father and help prevent spiritual atrophy.

[Guest mirancs8]

I am so sorry to hear about what you have been going through. Yes, I have been through it and it's not fun at all. I can understand the pain and confusion you are feeling right now. Please feel free to IM me if you need to talk.

Since you are the only one who can gauge how much effort you have put into saving your marriage you need to look and see if you can say, "YES I have never given up. I've done everything to save this marriage." It's the hardest decision to leave someone and for some (like me) it took years to actually do it. Constantly having that hope that in fact yes that person is genuine in the desire to change makes one step back and say, "I can't give up. He/she is willing to try and I have to give it that chance."

Really, have you done everything? As yourself that sincerely.

I would recommend considering getting active in the church again. You, not him. If he does great but you have to lead by example. You are no good to anyone if you are not good to yourself. He may be inspired by your determination and commitment that he too may follow your footsteps. This will put him at the doorstep of repentance and that would be the first step of healing your marriage. You can't make him go and you don't want to make church the threat. You do it for yourself and the children. Take your kids and go faithfully. Become worthy to go to the Temple and be strong.

With that said, no one can give you the advice you seek regarding if you've done everything and if you should or should not leave the marriage. This is something you need to sort out for yourself. Speak to your Bishop and tell him about the hardships you have had and if your husband is willing to join you that would be perfect. If he doesn't don't let it bring you down.

Never say never. There is always a chance to save your marriage. Be positive and supportive but also be strong. Take the first steps to being active in the church/community again and this may inspire him to lead a more worthy life and see your marriage in the eternal perspective it was meant to be seen it.

It will take time but be consistent, committed, and supportive. At least you will be able to say you did everything to save your marriage. Ultimately it will be him who needs accountability.

[alecia]

well my frist thought was maybe he did end it with her and maybe shes lying trying to break up your marriage cause she wants your husband.

I understand what you're saying, but no, she's definitely the honest one. She forwarded all emails and texts that he sent etc. It's all been confirmed that she's definitely not lying. The last time she texted (a few weeks ago) she had just had enough of him contacting her, as she has found someone else. But my husband has since admitted that yes he has done wrong.

Thank you for your thoughts, I know that communication is key, and I'm really trying. I have always been a big communicator - he usually shuts down. But i know he's trying. Just today he said to me that he is in love with me, but when all that happened, he was in a really bad space. He said he's willing to get help to fix this... whatever it takes. Which is good - and if he had been like this 6 months ago, we would be fine. But, for me, after 6 months of constant lies, one minute believing we are ok, the next finding out that he's obviously obsessed with her or something... well, it's taken it's toll on me and I don't even know how I feel about him anymore.

[alecia]

One small and possibly silly but very effective thing I have done at home is to start keeping a Book of Mormon in the bathroom. I am quite serious about this as I never had time to read the scriptures before but now I read them every day! :)

Inviting the missionaries over for dinner is another wonderful thing to do when church activity has become difficult. I am sure they would have no problem with dinner and a spiritual discussion... and it is another thing that has helped my family.

I am not saying that either of these things are good replacements for church.... I am saying they can help bring you closer to feeling like you have a relationship with Heavenly Father and help prevent spiritual atrophy.

Thank you for your suggestions.... they are really good... I might try these. I know I should go back to church, and I will do that I think. We are moving to another city in 2 weeks... closer to family, so that will be where we settle with the kids and I shall go. It feels like it's the right thing to do.

[alecia]

I am so sorry to hear about what you have been going through. Yes, I have been through it and it's not fun at all. I can understand the pain and confusion you are feeling right now. Please feel free to IM me if you need to talk.

Thank you so much for your kind words, and yes it's all pain and confusion. The confusing part is that one minute I'm like, yes, if he's finally willing to put in the effort, then I should too. Then the next minute, I feel like, hang on, after all the hurt, lies and pain, I should be ditching him and letting him suffer.

I guess that means that I haven't forgiven him.... sometimes I think I have. But maybe, I haven't. I don't know... if it still hurts, does that mean I haven't forgiven him?

Really, have you done everything? As yourself that sincerely.

Yes, I believe I have. HOWEVER, now there is hope of saving it - because he has said to me that he is in love with me and wants my help to fix this. He has even agreed to get some counseling to help. SO... if I really want to save it, this is my chance. But I have NO idea how to let go of this hurt I feel every time I look at him

I would recommend considering getting active in the church again. You, not him. If he does great but you have to lead by example. You are no good to anyone if you are not good to yourself. He may be inspired by your determination and commitment that he too may follow your footsteps. This will put him at the doorstep of repentance and that would be the first step of healing your marriage. You can't make him go and you don't want to make church the threat. You do it for yourself and the children. Take your kids and go faithfully. Become worthy to go to the Temple and be strong.

When I read what you wrote here.... I felt something. Not sure what, but I just KNOW without a doubt that you are soooo right!!!! Thank you.... I feel inspired!

I thank everyone for their input.... it's a very hard and confusing time. I know that no-one here can tell me what to do, I don't expect that of course.... I'm not sure, I guess I just thought this might help me clear my head.

I have the chance to save my marriage - but need to let go of the hurt and try and forgive. Not only that, but I'm also VERY wary that he could just be saying what I want to hear.... after all, people seem to want what they can't have - and I have told him that I have had it with him.. all his lies and deceit. Has he truly learned his lesson, or is this just simply a way to save himself from being lonely and losing his family?! Hmmm

[LDSVALLEY]

I am glad to say that I have not gone through your trial so can't offer any direct suggestion. However I did grow up with a Father hooked on booze. He was the same as your husband, denial then when caught confessing and promising to change. In part it was trying to avoid loosing his family and in part I believe a real desire to change.

The only time he was able to change, at least for a few years, ,was when our Mother laid out stiff ground rules. It was not enough for him to desire to change he had to prove it to her and himself. I am sure it was hard on them both but she stuck to her rules and he either had to comply or walk away. I was glad since it gave me a few good years as a youth before he hit the bottle again.

My suggestion would be after you move return to church with or without him. Talk to the Bishop or seek a church related marriage councilor. Explain the issue and ask for help devising a plan that makes him change or walk. If possible involve him in the process. It is a fine line between punishing him and creating a manner that allows him and you to make actual progress in rebuilding what was lost, or more aptly creating something new to replace what was lost.

The saying that insanity is using the same situation over and over expecting a different result is true. Holding him accountable for his choices, don't expect that you can wave a wand and change him or yourself, you will not wake up one day and say he is forgiven and you move on. You both have a long road to travel, bit by bit that forgiveness will grow as you both make the journey.

If you simply work off his desire to change you give him full control over what is happening in your family. You need to work together to allow you to have an equal measure of control. You need to have laid out clear expectations and consequences for future actions. That way you don't have to beat yourself up trying to figure out what you should do.

Instead if done up front he creates the end result based on his actions, you simply have to be strong enough to follow through with them. It puts the responsibility where it belongs. PLEASE remember that there has to be positive expectations and consequences as well.

Example if he is emailing or web surfing then install a tracking program on the computers as a condition. You both know it will be reviewed once a week and set the consequence for a good or bad review.

I would not suggest that at the first slip the consequence is automatic termination of the marriage, when we get into bad areas it can take time for the mind to get out of that mindset and replace it with something else. But there needs to be a time line on it and an increase in severity to the actions.

Last turn to the Lord and he will help you, he will help lighten the huge burden you are carrying now. Members can also be helpful but remember they are human and can take odd stances on issues. Take advise to the Lord to determine its validity in your situation along with common sense of course.

[Guest mormonmusic]

I went through a similar situation. My wife had an emotional affair with someone who lived near us. to this day I think there was other funny business with another persion she worked with, but no physical contact or transgression.

I think you have the advantage of a husband who now seems willing to work with you on the marriage.

I would suggest going back to Church both of you. Also, yes, read over the materials at Marriage Builders ® - Successful Marriage Advice and find out what his emotional needs are, as well as yours. The majority of emotional affairs (and physical ones too) are prompted by one partner not feeling their needs are met within their marriage. You need to know what his needs are so you can see how to meet them.

Hopefully that doesn't seem unfair, but I also was not meeting my wife's needs and had to learn how.

It stopped the emotional affair.

He also needs to know your needs as well and learn how to meet them better if there are gaps.

I would keep trying if you still love your husband and especially since he seems willing to work with you and do what's necessary to keep the marriage together.

One thing, my wife kept me "in the doghouse" for quite a while -- several months -- which in retrospect was kind of a good thing for me personally. Because I still wanted the marriage, it helped me see the depth of her withdrawal from the relationship. And it made me really sit up and figure out what I needed to do to make our marriage better again.

However, you need to judge what is right in your own situation; I have only my own situation to share.

[jennvan]

There is a lot of information out there on how to save your marriage, much of which I do not agree with. One of the things I dislike about many of them is that they generalize, like His Needs/Her Needs. It says all men need sex and all women need to talk and feel supported. YUCK. Not everyone needs that and that may not even be the problem in the marriage.

I would encourage you to look to the Lord and strengthen that relationship first. As you gain confidence in that relationship, your husband will see that and want to be part of whatever it is that gives you your confidence. The Lord is also the way, the truth, and the life. He is the one we need to turn toward for the answers to our problems. He knows what we might need, whether that is a specific book with information we need, a friend who has a different perspective or a good marriage friendly therapist (please find a marriage friendly therapist at aamft.org if you choose that route).

To your advantage, even though you haven't been to the temple in a while, you have been sealed in the temple. There is tremendous power in that when we are living a life worthy of it. Work toward attending the temple and I would bet you will see amazing changes in your marriage.

[TheActualLiz]

I would like to add one small thing. Forgiveness is really really cool!

Anger is like a cancer that grows without regard to what's around it and eventually destroys it's host. Forgiveness is the cure for that cancer. Once the cancer is gone then there is more room inside for positive emotions like love, compassion, and happiness.

[Gwen]

There is a lot of information out there on how to save your marriage, much of which I do not agree with. One of the things I dislike about many of them is that they generalize, like His Needs/Her Needs. It says all men need sex and all women need to talk and feel supported. YUCK. Not everyone needs that and that may not even be the problem in the marriage.

I would encourage you to look to the Lord and strengthen that relationship first. As you gain confidence in that relationship, your husband will see that and want to be part of whatever it is that gives you your confidence. The Lord is also the way, the truth, and the life. He is the one we need to turn toward for the answers to our problems. He knows what we might need, whether that is a specific book with information we need, a friend who has a different perspective or a good marriage friendly therapist (please find a marriage friendly therapist at aamft.org if you choose that route).

To your advantage, even though you haven't been to the temple in a while, you have been sealed in the temple. There is tremendous power in that when we are living a life worthy of it. Work toward attending the temple and I would bet you will see amazing changes in your marriage.

yes there are a lot of books and yes they generalize. all the books know that, if you want specific to you then you need to see a counselor that can get to know you and give more personal advise. i've never read a book that didn't say out the gate, this is based off averages in research, your situation may be a little different. the goal is to give information for you to pick apart and alter to fit who you are so you can have an impact on your situation.

even the church deals with general situations, what's most common not the exception. it's up to you to seek personal revelation when you proceed past the basic principle. the same is true for information in a self help book. you get the knowledge and then ask god to help you sort it out so it fits you, make the changes you need to.

i think the cold reality is we are all more "average" than we like to think. we all want to be the exception, but you aren't. even if you don't fit the "average" perfectly i would bet troubled marriages would be significantly better if they would follow any number of marriage help books to the letter. it might be slightly off base but it's closer to base than where they were. something is better than nothing.

personal experience, i was seeking an answer for something and had been told more than once by several different ppl to pray about it. god has all the answers, he will tell you what you need to know, go to the temple, pray. and i did, i prayed for yrs. very miserable yrs. the answers were not coming. i finally gave up on waiting for god to solve my problem and i went to a book store to find a "professional" with the answer i needed. when i got to the right section there was so much info that after an hour of feeling lost on where to start i gave up and went to find a book more for escape and distraction. in this other section of the store i picked up a book, behind it was a book that had been misplaced. it was on the subject i needed. i piked it up, thumbed through it and knew it was what i was looking for. i bought it. after reading it the answers i had been seeking started to come. i started to learn how that information applied to me and what i needed to do. yes god will help us but he won't do for us what we can do for ourselves. it's after all we can do he will save us. sitting around asking him to reinvent the wheel for you instead of gathering info he's already revealed won't work. i'm a firm believer we should find something we think will work and then ask the lord to help figure out how to make it work or lead us to something better. i've never been worse off by seeking information to improve myself. sometimes it didn't really fit me and so i didn't do much with it but i was better off for the knowledge. we are commanded to seek out all good things, no matter where they are.

but that's just my take on it.

[Guest mirancs8]

There is a lot of information out there on how to save your marriage, much of which I do not agree with. One of the things I dislike about many of them is that they generalize, like His Needs/Her Needs. It says all men need sex and all women need to talk and feel supported. YUCK. Not everyone needs that and that may not even be the problem in the marriage.

YUCK?? Sex is an important part of marriage not sure what is so "yuck" about that.

[beefche]

I do believe that jenn meant that the generalizaton that ALL men need is sex (excluding other needs) and that ALL women need is to feel supported (excluding other needs) is yuck. Not that sex is yuck nor that talking and getting support is yuck. But the overgeneralization is yuck.

[FunkyTown]

I do believe that jenn meant that the generalizaton that ALL men need is sex (excluding other needs) and that ALL women need is to feel supported (excluding other needs) is yuck. Not that sex is yuck nor that talking and getting support is yuck. But the overgeneralization is yuck.

I think that overgeneralization is spot-on! As a 2 dimensional character, I can say that all I need -is- sex. Not food. Not love and understanding. Just sex.

And a club.

And fire.

But mostly sex. Uh oh... Wait... That's three things. Three things are important. I may end up losing my 2 dimensionalness.

[Gwen]

I do believe that jenn meant that the generalizaton that ALL men need is sex (excluding other needs) and that ALL women need is to feel supported (excluding other needs) is yuck. Not that sex is yuck nor that talking and getting support is yuck. But the overgeneralization is yuck.

if you've read the book you would know that's not what he says. he says on average these are the top 5 needs of men and top 5 of women. (those two are the top need) he also says it's an average, that everyone is different and it may not be the case for you. included in the book are quizzes and such to help you figure out what your top 5 needs are, no matter what list he may have posted them on. i think that makes it a rather personal book not packed with over generalizations. there is also a lot of good info that i think is relevant to the op about the emotions of an affair, how they are different for men and women, how to over come them and prevent them from happening again.

so yes i agree over generalizing is yuck, and more than self help books can be guilty of it.

[beefche]

Gwen, what book are you talking about? jennvan didn't mention any particular book in her reply, nor did I.

[Gwen]

Gwen, what book are you talking about? jennvan didn't mention any particular book in her reply, nor did I.

One of the things I dislike about many of them is that they generalize, like His Needs/Her Needs. It says all men need sex and all women need to talk and feel supported. YUCK. Not everyone needs that and that may not even be the problem in the marriage.

which gives a generalized false characterization of the book. happens to be the book i suggested, and i think someone else suggested the site for it. that's what i was replying to.

[beefche]

I didn't realize that was an actual book. I thought she was generalizing. LOL!

[rameumptom]

I suggest a trial separation. Let him prove for the next 6 months that he can attend Church, confess to the bishop, and get himself back on the right track, before you will return. As long as you keep letting him back in, he'll keep making promises you want to hear, but not fulfill them. If he does not make any progress in 6 months time, then you will have to decide whether to make it a permanent separation.

[jennvan]

Gwen,

I believe we are saying the same thing. Turn to the Lord and he will direct you to things that will help you. He gives you the answers but many times it comes through ways other than Him directly saying "Ok now do this, now say this".

I don't think we will agree on the general premise of self-help books. I used to LOVE LOVE LOVE self-help books, I used to read tons of them. Then I went through graduate school and had the opportunity to learn what I feel is real truth about relationships, how they work and how God would want us to have them. Now I really struggle with many self help books, not all of them, but some of them. I wish I could write a list of books I like and what parts I would add to or take away from them. :) Probably the best book I've ever read is Wendy Watson Nelson's Purity and Passion. But so many people find it boring or not helpful for them because they think its too "Churchy". Yet there are SOOO many truths in that book, its just amazing.

beefche: thanks for the backup, I was definitely talking about YUCK about the generalizations, not sex. Sex is not YUCK, its definitely good in appropriate relationships.

[beefche]

Personally, I think self-help books are like anything else. Parts of the book will apply to you and other parts won't. I feel that way about diet books, or financial books, or just about any kind of self-help book.

Truly, the best thing to help anything is the Spirit. As we do our part and seek out books, therapists, bishops, whatever/whomever, it is ultimately up to us to research and work and then be guided by the Spirit on what will help us in our own unique situation.

[CREO]

I'm so sorry for your circumstance, but your desires to be closer to Heavenly Father will help you figure things out. Make small changes to adjust your life to one that brings you closer to the Spirit. Don't think long term but think daily, its less overwhelming. I'm a convert and whenever people ask me how I made so many changes to join the Church I just say I took it day by day. We always fall, but we know can get back up. The Church is such a good resource for anything in life and when you feel more comfortable I know Bishops, counseling services and people ready to help even in the smallest ways would be more than happy to assist. Maybe for now, you just need a good friend who does go to Church too but isn't going to put too much pressure on you. It seems like a lot of people get a little concerned about making an over zealous return to be fully active but the right people can always keep you coming along without scaring you away. I hope you can find a friend like this. Just remember that you can be pilot of your own plane to Happiness. Its just your actions and desires-like Praying that will get you there. Small adjustments, a good friend and journaling all your thoughts and feelings to help you process your true thoughts and get rid of some of the noise is some thoughts that come to mind. Just don't be too hard on yourself and Heavenly Father is not as far as you make think he is. Oh, if you can get a priesthood holder to give you a blessing, I'm sure you will receive comfort and guidance to get you on the right path again! Even when I've felt the farthest from Heavenly Father in past, those blessings have been so pivotal to me. I often go and try to write key points down or things I should focus on so I don't forget.

Edited October 19, 2010 by CREO

[alecia]

Thank you all for your input... it's been so helpful. It's taken me a little while to reply because things have been like a roller coaster here. Just on Sunday he was saying how he says that this girl is beautiful and I am beautiful but he's in love with me, not her.

(but then again, he was saying that to HER... and in my mind, he's only saying it to me now because she gave him that boot after she found out that he was lying to her about being separated! And now she has found herself a boyfriend by the looks, so he knows he has no 'opportunity' there, if you know what I mean. Basically I believe, and he hasn't denied this - that if she was interested in him, he would still be in touch with her)

Anyways, then on Monday, he wrote on my Facebook status something rather inappropriate - I mean, he was trying to be funny I guess, but it was degrading to me, especially as he is my husband and after what has so recently happened. It just wasn't funny. My friend even sent me a PM and asked what the hell is wrong, has he gone completely mad and am I ok. So I got pretty annoyed at him and just said to him "look, just yesterday you're wanting to fix this, and now today you're writing degrading things on my status, it's like you don't care or don't want to fix it"... he just muttered "who'd want to". I think he felt quite embarrassed about what he had written - because no-one was particularly impressed and he deleted it. To put it in a nutshell - he's the kind of guy that will act first, think later, speak first, then think (or regret) later. He's even said to me that he will say things, nasty things, just to upset me, that he KNOWS is nasty and will hurt me - and even at the time he will think to himself 'why the heck am I doing this'... he said that he doesn't know how to stop that - even though he is saying things that are not true. Just an example, after I found out about this girl and it all came out in the open and she had forwarded all his emails etc, he got REALLY angry. He said to me: "I will never forgive you for this, she's a really nice girl and you completely ruined it for me". That stunned me to my core and is when I wondered where I had gone wrong.... I was so shocked. HE WAS MARRIED!! Anyway, he did say to me not too long ago that when he said that, he was just in a bad space, knew it would hurt me.... but couldn't stop himself.

My thoughts? I think he meant it. I think he was truly mad with me cos he really wanted her

Anyways, I have said my sincere prayers about this every day. I need Heavenly Father's strength right now, I am feeling stronger too. I'm not weak or pathetically desperate anymore - when this all first happened, I was. But I'm pretty independent now, I have my own business and funnily enough it has just started booming - I honestly believe that is a blessing to help me with the big move coming up :) I'm so grateful for it. I can't wait to be closer to family too, and to get back to church.

Thank you all so much for your support - I have tried PMing a couple of people, but it keeps going back to the login page whenever I try! Grrr... so that's why no-one's received a PM. But trust me when I say this, it's really helped... knowing that there are strangers that don't even know me, but are willing to take the time to write down some advice or nice thoughts.... that truly means a lot to me. Thank you so much.

@CREO - your words are amazing, you know that is exactly what I need - day by day, and then to hopefully make a good friend in the church. Thank you so much for your nice words and thoughts - I think the idea of a blessing would benefit me greatly! And to write things down.... perfect! I love writing, and haven't done so for so long. It definitely helps clear the 'noise'. Thank you xox

@rameumptom - I think you are totally correct. I think that a trial separation is a great idea - because so far all he has done is lie and make false promises. There is zero trust. I didn't want to go down this track, I really wanted everything to be "ok"... but in reality it can't be. If I say "sure hun, I'll forget about it like you want me to", then that's just brushing it under the carpet. I personally think that he has a LOT of issues to sort out himself. So maybe that would be a good time for him to do it. He has always had a problem with going to church and sticking with it. In relation to the "knock and the door will be answered" quote... well he says he gets to the "door", knocks, but then turns round and runs. So he does have a lot of issues with the church... he did do a mission though (didn't complete it). I would love to see him stick with it.... that is my hope for him. But yes, I think it's time I let him deal with it on his own instead of being there 24/7. (I have been told that I have done far too much for him... that he's like a spoiled child and always gets his own way. I'm not sure about that.. but yes I have always been 110% loyal, loving and supportive - because I believe that's what marriage is about).

Thank you again xo