Who believes in ghosts?

[sweetiepie]

I love shows like paranormal state, The Haunting. As long as they aren't too anticlimactic, and when they interview the people it happens to, and they didn't believe until it happens to them.

I started to wonder in an LDS perspective, are there "spirits" stuck here for a time? I know there are some evil spirits, but I don't think that is necessarily most of the "hauntings" we hear about. I wonder if the other world is parallel with ours at times, we just can't "see" them?

What do you believe?

[Backroads]

I do believe in ghosts. From an LDS doctrinal standpoint, I'm not really sure how it works. Heck, I'm not sure how it works at all, but I do believe in ghosts.

From my perspective only...

~I think the Spirit World is very close to this one.

~I think spirits can cross over to this world.

~I think there are spirits, good and bad, who for whatever reason can be part of our world.

~I think emotions can be imprinted onto places, as in how quartz crystal absorbs energies.

~When I die, I fully intend to ask permission to go haunt places.

[Backroads]

I do believe in ghosts. From an LDS doctrinal standpoint, I'm not really sure how it works. Heck, I'm not sure how it works at all, but I do believe in ghosts.

From my perspective only...

~I think the Spirit World is very close to this one.

~I think spirits can cross over to this world.

~I think there are spirits, good and bad, who for whatever reason can be part of our world.

~I think emotions can be imprinted onto places, as in how quartz crystal absorbs energies.

~When I die, I fully intend to ask permission to go haunt places.

[Guest GoodnessGracious]

I believe spirits or 'ghosts' exist. The thing is, at least I believe, that because we have truths that no other Christian denominations have, we have a reason to be more open minded about the paranormal. Case in point is Joseph Smith's history and the multitude of visitations he had of divine personages, from the angel Moroni, his First Vision, and the visitation of Peter, James and John for the restoration of the Melchizedek priesthood.

I had an experience where I believed something that I couldn't prove to anyone else but then I understood what it would be like to be someone who had an experience of someone who had been visited by a being not of this world - not necessarily an angel but a mortal being from another solar system or a.k.a an "alien" from another world.

My "unusual" experience related to church but what followed was a journey that lead me to think about why I believed in what I believed in(mormon belief system). I had heard and read about individuals who had had contact with aliens or extraterestrials and I had to ask the question: what is the God - Alien connection ?

My journey took me to exploring the alien-ufo phenomena and I found a man in his 50's who shared his experiences with this topic of phenomena online. I never met him in person but I have listened to all that has been posted of him on the net and what is neat is all he says supports what doctrine the church has in the Pearl of Great Price (... worlds without number have i created...) and other aspects of church doctrine. For example in one interview he did he talks about "The Veil" and about an experience he had about seeing his deceased son.

In conclusion, there is a lot we don't know while here on earth. As I went through some bad social experiences relating to church I got on a journey that didn't put my beliefs of the gospel and the doctrine to rest but instead solidified what I believed in - and what was neat is I learned these things from a non-LDS source.

Sincerely,

GoodnessGracious

[IAmTheWork]

@GoodnessGracious; My normal everyday life has always included tangibly real angels/aliens (call them what we will) as well as 'dead' people who got trapped here.

Though I can't prove anything, and have no reason to try, I can say that when someone becomes trapped or over-attached to this realm of being, they usually ignore bright ones who come to show them the way onward. It's all usually fear based issues. Those who can see and interact with trapped people can often help, as they're overjoyed to be acknowledged by someone in the 'real world' as they see it, but who is also aware of higher levels of being and can show them how to let go.

I think sometimes we can get a bit stuck in church doctrine, which has to remain simple for various reasons, and it's obvious that what the church and church members describe is only a tiny fraction of the magical universe Christ tried to show people.

Edited December 30, 2010 by IAmTheWork
Re-worded

[pam]

This subject has already been discussed numerous times. You might want to check out some of these threads:

http://www.lds.net/forums/general-discussion/15676-do-you-believe-ghosts.html

http://www.lds.net/forums/lds-gospel-discussion/33318-ghost-hunting-seeking-paranormal-experiences.html

http://www.lds.net/forums/lds-gospel-discussion/33343-spirits-ghosts.html

http://www.lds.net/forums/christian-beliefs-board/23084-do-you-believe-ghosts.html

[Bini]

Yeh I guess I believe in "ghosts" so to speak. Coming from the Philippines it's hard not to with how superstitious people are over there. I remember my own yaya telling me ghost stories that spooked the pants off me! My bestfriend is Navajo and her culture has their own superstitious that revolve around "good and evil spirits". She refers to the bad ones as "skinnies" or more commonly known as "skinnywalkers". Her tribe says these are spirits that are angry, resentful or just plain evil, and prey on the innocent in forms of cruel/mischief jokes or with dangerous plots.

From an LDS perspective (my own, not from a doctrinal POV) I was taught that one can push away or cast out an unwanted negative presence by calling to God or praying. At least, this is what I do when I'm alone, feeling vulnerable and uneasy, I pray out loud for comfort.

[IAmTheWork]

... Her tribe says these are spirits that are angry, resentful or just plain evil, and prey on the innocent in forms of cruel/mischief jokes or with dangerous plots.

Yes, I'd say that whether in physical or spirit form people/beings can be nasty and resentful, or light and pleasant.

It's all a very interesting topic, but of course talk isn't experience, and listening to too much fear based talk means we live in fear, which isn't what we should do. Just as with incarnate people, those discarnate who are resentful and cruel can sometimes be helped, but more often than not have to be left to grow in their own way (or not, as they choose).

What's the scripture about us not being given any more than we can deal with? I think it applies well here. I also notice in another thread someone mentioned the first thing angels say is usually, "Fear not..." Someone made of power and light our human mind can't grasp can be terrifying on first meeting, but they don't emit rage, fear, jealousy, resentment, etc. Pretty easy to feel who you're with after a moment's quiet appraisal.

I have to say that I like the overall tone of not holding on to fears in these threads. Lots more reading to do though - may take me some days!

Edited December 30, 2010 by IAmTheWork

[MichaelCraig]

It may be because of the "watched pot" theory but as hard as I've tried since I was a teen I've never seen even a glimpse of ghost. All of the meetings and conversations I've had with others that have passed have been in dreams but those are many. Some of the dreams were more real than reality itself. I also believe there are small beings, mostly benevolent, that have the job of taking care of nature. Flowers, plants and the Earth in general. I've been in the deep woods and felt that "being watched" feeling way too many times to belief it's just the wild life alone. I also believe very VERY strongly in guardian angels.

[IAmTheWork]

@MichaelCraig; Yes, I think if you watch and watch, you can end up seeing only what your eyes can see, but as you say, being in the deep woods and feeling watched in turn makes us aware of other very helpful spiritual forces.

While my continual experience is of more human looking angels, I did have a very powerful experience of nature spirits some years ago, governed by (guess what?) a powerful father figure. Those who like the 'old ways' sometimes called pagan or wiccan etc., describe the god and goddess as being loving creators, yet they generally can't accept LDS views of the same beings just described in a slightly different way. And of course many church members are a little scared of 'old ways' as they see them as perhaps devilish. While anthropologists and others may say that mankind created a god and goddess in their own image out of primitive fear, my experience and that of countless others shows that to be a very weak perspective, though natural to the 'natural man' I suppose.

Guardian angels - oh yes, certainly. I'd say more one close friend who promised to stay by your side every moment of this lifetime. They may save your life, or may not, depending upon what you have to do. But that particular point bothers many only because we're usually scared of the process of passing on. In everything else they guide and help, offer loving light, and are conduits of sacred power when we don't feel up to any task at hand. I can say from experience that when someone gives a blessing where reality changing power is required, they do most of the work. What I think interesting is that Christ urged us to be likewise, in fact, like himself.

Oh yes, regarding dreams; In dream state we're in a different level of consciousness, obviously, and so perceive things not normally done when the conscious mind is very active. Many times we're shown and told things in dreams, as prophets have been in past days. I'm sure that sometimes when our conscious mind would be scared by something which seemed too much to see in the light of ordinary day, we're offered it in dreams. That way, we can accept things on very deep emotional levels, but have the option of saying "Oh, it wasn't real you know".

Edited December 30, 2010 by IAmTheWork
Added to.

[Guest mirancs8]

Yes I do believe and yes I have had experiences (posted a number of times about them here). Never experienced a demonic spirit.

[HEthePrimate]

ghosts = spirits, so yes, I do believe in ghosts. Don't know that they are "stuck here" haunting certain places, though I do believe they can at least visit. Could be wrong, but I seem to remember being taught at church that the spirit world is all around us, we just can't see it because of the Veil.

[IAmTheWork]

Yes I do believe and yes I have had experiences (posted a number of times about them here). Never experienced a demonic spirit.

I'd say you no doubt have, but not in the sense of a nasty dark soul jumping out of the spirit world and scaring the pants off you. We're influenced by spirit of all kinds all the time, and our choices determine what kind of spiritual forces we engage with, even though we're mostly unconscious of it. We tend to notice it when we see someone 'snap' and do something awful, or go the other way and 'glow' while doing something selfless and wonderful. One basic rule of free agency is that we always have the option to say it's just make-believe. By which I mean that spiritual forces, for good or otherwise, naturally leave the option open to our perception.

ghosts = spirits, so yes, I do believe in ghosts. Don't know that they are "stuck here" haunting certain places, though I do believe they can at least visit. Could be wrong, but I seem to remember being taught at church that the spirit world is all around us, we just can't see it because of the Veil.

Oh yes, certainly people do become 'stuck' here. More grasping and attached, I'd call it. Most people don't want to think about that, as it implies that they might become stuck too! Not a nice thought. It happens due to powerful emotional attachments, including love, loss, greed, and so on. Once someone is trapped, they see everything as a nightmare from which they can't seem to awaken, and ignore (or are scared of) bright beings who come to offer help to move on. Time passes without meaning in the waking nightmare, and new things in the 'real' world which should make no sense are ignored as unexplainable parts of the dream. It's not horrific, but more like an ongoing trance-like state, and while it may sound terrible, in the sense of eternity it's just a blip.

I've helped some souls in this state to move on, but not by doing anything like 'seance' or 'space clearing' rubbish. More showing them that I'm perfectly aware of them and conversing, telling them that I understand why they want to hold onto being here, and showing them where they should be heading. Anyone can do this, as Christ pointed out. If they do choose to leave and can face the light, they leave of their own accord, and the brightness of the ones who come to help them onward is so powerful it's truly astounding.

Of course another aspect to all this is that physical structures, as someone pointed out in another post, hold energies in a holographic way. Knowing the difference between a place memory and a trapped being comes either from strong intuition, or practice. I feel sure that the exhortations to eschew such things (isn't 'eschew' a neat word?!) in Old Testament times were given not so much in fear of evil, but to stop people becoming confused or misled. After all, if someone goes around expounding things others are fearful of, then they can control people, right..?

Oh, and the 'visiting' part... Of course people can re-visit sometimes, usually for good reason, but we shouldn't hold on to or try to contact them continually. It'd be a bit like calling someone back from their wonderful cruise trip, knowing they have to return to you on a small boat each time, then struggle back to the cruise liner afterwards. While they may be gracious, it's not very polite, it seems to me!

Edited December 31, 2010 by IAmTheWork
Added something.

[Kurt]

Here's my ghost story.

Not what you're probably expecting though...

I seem to have a few demons following me around. One demon in particular stands out among them, and I believe it is a female.

Don't laugh. I'm serious!

I can feel her presence sometimes. The whole room seems to dim a little when she is around, and she is usually only around when I am doing something wrong. I know it is a she because she has started appearing in many of my dreams. She is the most ugly evil disgusting thing I have ever seen. I would compare her to something from a horror show.

Sometimes I can even hear her say things. Once I was about to watch a gory movie, and I thought to myself "Nah, I'm not going to watch this." The moment I thought of not watching it, I heard a female demonic voice growl "YES, WATCH IT!". It was like she was right behind me. Other times I have heard her laughing when I am sinning. Other times I have heard her growl. Not a very fun experience, especially in a dark room.

One time while I was partially asleep she started to chant a demonic song in my ear. It was terrible. I was frozen, couldn't move a muscle, and felt like was going to throw up. It was like my body was reacting violently to the presence of this thing. I was shaking in my bed. I instantly started to pray as hard as I could, and a few moments after I started, the chanting stopped and the dark presence was lifted from the room. The demonic chanting wasn't in any language I knew, so out of curiosity I typed in two or three of the words she said on google.

The chant was in an ancient Hebrew dialect. How would I possibly know ancient Hebrew? This confirmed to me that this was, in fact, a demon playing with me. I will NEVER reveal what it said because it is pretty sick and twisted stuff.

I think Satan tasked an agent of his to follow me around to try and wreck me going on a mission. I was given a blessing from my Bishop and I have stopped many of my bad habits. It tends to leave me alone now. Thank goodness.

~Kurt

[IAmTheWork]

@Kurt; Thanks for being strong enough to share something so personal. I don't disbelieve you for one moment, as many people have similar experiences. However, as I said in another post, we're only faced in life with what we can cope with, as scriptures say. And our heavenly parents never leave us to cope on our own.

The main thing beings who have nasty agendas want to do is to induce fear. As the old science fiction story Dune says; fear is the mind killer. When we fear, we give away our life energies to those who hold us in thrall. This is easily seen in the world, and works in spiritual realms too. It also means that if we fight 'dark forces', we can end up getting into a battle which ends in us collapsing in an even worse state of fear, thus giving our energies to those who want to suck us dry, for want of a better description.

People tend to think that 'demonic' forces have more power than people in this world, but I always point out that in fact it's the same principle at work. When bullies try to dominate you, the best way to be out of their control is not to fight - they love that - but to just not be part of their world view. If you're Mr. or Ms. Prissy, for example, they soon become tired of you. Likewise, with bullying spirits, if you kind of think, "Yah, yah, scary, scary - going to bed now" they eventually tire of you.

Of course the best way, if they persist, is to call upon the holy spirit and the lord to help you and remove the offending pest. If this doesn't work, there's no need to feel that you've been abandoned. You may grow from the challenge to your own fears, or you may be more 'up to the task' than you realise, so your heavenly parents watch with a smile to see you take another step.

As you point out Kurt, often these things happen at a stage where we're going to grow spiritually. This means that it's not always a church mission, but an 'ordinary world' job interview, starting a new family, contemplating life in silence for a time - whatever.

Having very real demonic experiences are, of course, dependent upon our own perceptions. Five people see a car crash and the police get five quite different reports. So, in the case of spirits, don't be too concerned that what you perceive is exactly what's out there. Our own minds play a large part in what we see, and those who like to mess with us use that to their advantage, whether incarnate or discarnate.

For anyone reading this who feels worried by the topic, focus on the good in the universe; in Christ's light, kittens and puppies - I'm not joking! Be light-hearted and show love, and bullies of any nature will find you ever so boring to be around.

Edited December 31, 2010 by IAmTheWork

[HEthePrimate]

Oh yes, certainly people do become 'stuck' here. More grasping and attached, I'd call it. Most people don't want to think about that, as it implies that they might become stuck too! Not a nice thought. It happens due to powerful emotional attachments, including love, loss, greed, and so on.

For myself, I'm not worried about becoming stuck here. The most powerful emotional attachments I have are to certain people who have already passed beyond the Veil (such as one of my sisters and my late wife). If anything, I'll be glad to be in their company again!

[Saturnfulcrum]

Sure I believe in ghosts. I've been followed by a few myself. I'd say "haunted", but that seems too strong of a word. Usually all they do is follow me until I acknowledge them. I ask them what they want (and if anyone happenes to be around they all think I'm crazy:P), and they usually leave me alone after that. I must be a boring target. Oh well.

I don't normally "see" ghosts, or spirits, or whatever you want to call them, but I have seen them two or three times. One of the times I'm still not quite sure. The other two were both terrifying. I usually feel them, so seeing them (for me) means something major is going down soon.

I feel them once or twice a year, and usually when I'm making a decision dealing with my salvation, so I'm definitely not a ghost whisperer (as cool as that would be).

I've always figured that most of the hauntings shown on tv are either fake, or is one of Satan's followers just having some fun. Maybe it's old friends playing pranks. Who knows.

But hey, if I die before my friends, they all gave me permission to haunt them. I'd do it too if I could because that would be awesome. :)

[John11111]

Its pretty crazy but my Father had a similar experience to Kurt when he was on his mission. I wont go into details because its not my story to tell but seeing that others have had such similar experiences only makes my testimony stronger.

[lizzy16]

I do, but the whole ghost shows and stuff...not so much.

I don't like the term ghost.

But, would you say Joseph Smith praying in the grove and feeling that dark evil feeling was maybe..a ghost?

[IAmTheWork]

I don't like the term ghost.

Me neither. It implies something impersonal, not a living being. A 'ghost' in terms of a place memory is fine, but as a trapped person, or an annoying presence, I don't care for the term. And I particularly dislike the continuation of Victorian table rapping and 'calling out' for them to perform tasks to prove their presence. Sad.

But, would you say Joseph Smith praying in the grove and feeling that dark evil feeling was maybe..a ghost?

Well, if his experience was anything like those I've had, then no, not a simple 'ghost'. The thing is, when we talk of such things we have a feeling that we might be affected, that by speaking of such things we might become visible to demonic forces (as if we weren't already). There's too much fear of such things in all walks of life, including the church.

I may share experiences of mine some time, but not right now as I need to go to sleep.

[Guest mirancs8]

I'd say you no doubt have, but not in the sense of a nasty dark soul jumping out of the spirit world and scaring the pants off you. We're influenced by spirit of all kinds all the time, and our choices determine what kind of spiritual forces we engage with, even though we're mostly unconscious of it. We tend to notice it when we see someone 'snap' and do something awful, or go the other way and 'glow' while doing something selfless and wonderful. One basic rule of free agency is that we always have the option to say it's just make-believe. By which I mean that spiritual forces, for good or otherwise, naturally leave the option open to our perception.

The closest I got to something unusual and somewhat playfully bad was this experience. Other than that my ex-father-in-law and some random strange spirits have been in my presence. I've had this happening to me from a very young age. I was about 13 or 14 when I got to better understanding it.

What many don't understand is when you have a spirit who seems at first to be playfully annoying you need to nip it in the rear before it get's out of hand. You can caste a spirit. That power is in your hands but most people have no clue. You should never let it get to a point that it get's so nasty it scars the pants off of you. It's a game of control and you need to regain that control. Every spirit experience I've had I've controlled. How? Because I don't fear the experience. I treat that spirit like if a human was to bother me the same way. I tell them who's boss and to get the "bleep" out of my house/life. Not just say it but you have to believe it. Make your point. If you don't it can get very scary if the spirit isn't a very nice one or demonic.

The recent young child story you'll read via that link I provided was playfully naughty. But after a few crossing the line actions I made my point clear and caste that spirit out of my home/life.

[lizzy16]

I've heard that people can cast them out by bringing in the spirit. Saying things like "In the name of Jesus Christ, be gone."

Personally, whenever I feel alone, scared, tempted I say the YW theme.

[lizzy16]

Also, have you thought about what it says somewhere in D&C about asking a spirit to revel itself and shake your hand?