The Plagiarism Excuse Doesn't Work and This is Why:

[LDSChristian]

Who here hasn't heard "Joseph Smith plagiarized from the Bible"? I think we all have heard that at least once. Quite honestly, it gets old. I didn't think about something until earlier last year. When I mention it to people that think Joseph Smith copied the Bible they're usually at a loss for words and with good reason.

We know Joseph Smith didn't copy the Bible, he translated the golden plates into the Book of Mormon. Let's just pretend for a moment that he did copy the Bible. If Joseph Smith copied from the Bible and the Bible is the word of God and is true, how could the Book of Mormon be false?

Like I said, we know Joseph Smith translated from the golden plates. The above statement is just something I like to bring up to people that try to say the Book of Mormon was copied from the Bible. Usually when I say it they try to go to another topic.

Anyway...

I'd like to take this opportunity to bear my testimony that I know the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true. It is Jesus Christ's church on the earth. I know the Bible and the Book of Mormon are the word of God. I know Joseph Smith did translate the golden plates into what is now the Book of Mormon. I know Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. I know Jesus Christ is the Son of God and I'm thankful for the sacrifice He made. I'm grateful for the restoration of the priesthood, which I hold as well (I'm 19), and it is a great honor to be a priesthood holder. I'm thankful for the temples we have on the earth and for my family as well. I say this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

[pam]

Thanks for sharing your testimony.

[MarginOfError]

Who here hasn't heard "Joseph Smith plagiarized from the Bible"? I think we all have heard that at least once. Quite honestly, it gets old. I didn't think about something until earlier last year. When I mention it to people that think Joseph Smith copied the Bible they're usually at a loss for words and with good reason.

We know Joseph Smith didn't copy the Bible, he translated the golden plates into the Book of Mormon. Let's just pretend for a moment that he did copy the Bible. If Joseph Smith copied from the Bible and the Bible is the word of God and is true, how could the Book of Mormon be false?

This doesn't account for the many pages that aren't easily found in the Bible. The parts that could be ascribed to plagiarism are the sections from Isaiah found in 2nd Nephi, and the Sermon on the Mount found in 3rd Nephi, and perhaps the discourse on faith, hope, and charity in Moroni. All the other parts clearly weren't plagiarized, and could be considered false portions.

This also doesn't account for the accusation that Smith plagiarized the Book of Mormon from four other sources, as detailed here

Origin of the Book of Mormon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

While I appreciate your testimony, I would rely on your testimony alone instead of the argument you've presented, as the argument does little to dress the complex claims of plagiarism against the Book of Mormon.

[Traveler]

Over the years I have learned and been taught to be skeptical of any data that cannot be independently verified by non biased research. I have also learned that bias always skews what a person think they are seeing. I have the heart and soul of a scientist; it is my profession and my life’s work. For example I realize that because the notion was popular that for many years dinosaurs were “known” to scientist be cold blooded reptilian creatures. But now we have evolved our understanding and we have more complete knowledge that dedicatees that dinosaurs are not coldblooded but warm-blooded and more related to birds than reptiles.

I have systematically and carefully studied the Book of Mormon. I have folders full of information that is evidence to the accuracy of the Book of Mormon. Here is an example: Nephi tells us that he is educated according to Egyptian methods of his day. He tells us that the Book of Mormon was written in a special language he calls “Reformed Egyptian”. This is both a dangerous and ridicules claim because shortly after the publication of the Book of Mormon Egyptian would be cracked and an entire era of discovery would ensue that would be impossible to fake at the time of Joseph Smith.

Let me offer just one example. Over 100 years after the Book of Mormon was published scholars would define what is now called Egyptian Colophons. These are writing definitions according to those educated in the Egyptian methods of writing. A Colophon is an opening or closing of an important literary document. The opening Colophon contained the following elements:

1. The date of time the document was created

2. The title or position of the author

3. The author’s parents and parental position or education.

4. A curse pronounced on anyone alter the text and a personal witness of it accuracy and truthfulness.

Nephi’s being born of goodly parents uses a form not used by any other author of any scripture provided by Joseph Smith.

Nephi’s closing follow the Egyptian norm of “Thus it is” or “so it is”. Yes Nephi was educated.

Can I say I “know”? Know is a complete word that is difficult for me because I am still learning. But from all that I have learned of the Book of Mormon both by spiritual and physical means - I am more sure that the Book of Mormon is a translation from ancient documents than I am sure that electrons exist and that electrical devices can be designed to use power from electrical sources based on our very best understanding of electrical and electron theory.

The Traveler

[LDSChristian]

Over the years I have learned and been taught to be skeptical of any data that cannot be independently verified by non biased research. I have also learned that bias always skews what a person think they are seeing. I have the heart and soul of a scientist; it is my profession and my life’s work. For example I realize that because the notion was popular that for many years dinosaurs were “known” to scientist be cold blooded reptilian creatures. But now we have evolved our understanding and we have more complete knowledge that dedicatees that dinosaurs are not coldblooded but warm-blooded and more related to birds than reptiles.

I have systematically and carefully studied the Book of Mormon. I have folders full of information that is evidence to the accuracy of the Book of Mormon. Here is an example: Nephi tells us that he is educated according to Egyptian methods of his day. He tells us that the Book of Mormon was written in a special language he calls “Reformed Egyptian”. This is both a dangerous and ridicules claim because shortly after the publication of the Book of Mormon Egyptian would be cracked and an entire era of discovery would ensue that would be impossible to fake at the time of Joseph Smith.

Let me offer just one example. Over 100 years after the Book of Mormon was published scholars would define what is now called Egyptian Colophons. These are writing definitions according to those educated in the Egyptian methods of writing. A Colophon is an opening or closing of an important literary document. The opening Colophon contained the following elements:

1. The date of time the document was created

2. The title or position of the author

3. The author’s parents and parental position or education.

4. A curse pronounced on anyone alter the text and a personal witness of it accuracy and truthfulness.

Nephi’s being born of goodly parents uses a form not used by any other author of any scripture provided by Joseph Smith.

Nephi’s closing follow the Egyptian norm of “Thus it is” or “so it is”. Yes Nephi was educated.

Can I say I “know”? Know is a complete word that is difficult for me because I am still learning. But from all that I have learned of the Book of Mormon both by spiritual and physical means - I am more sure that the Book of Mormon is a translation from ancient documents than I am sure that electrons exist and that electrical devices can be designed to use power from electrical sources based on our very best understanding of electrical and electron theory.

The Traveler

Dang. That's awesome.

[bert10]

I know but when I come across such false thoughts I am reminded....Plagiarism is man's term of ownership of things that do not belong to him. All thoughts words and actions are because of the power of the Lord and all things belong to GOD. The words of Isaiah are not Isaiah but of the Spirit and so no man can claim ownership of anything...specially things that comes from GOD and is GIVEN BY GOD TO MAN.

People are deceived and are using man's law and reasoning in order to justify rejecting the BOM.

The BOM was not only for J. Smith day...it was also a remembrance for the people while they walked the Earth.

And so it is normal to find the words of Isaiah and other teachings...and the GOD of the authors of the plate is the same GOD that spoke with Moses and Isaiah.

bert10

Who here hasn't heard "Joseph Smith plagiarized from the Bible"? I think we all have heard that at least once. Quite honestly, it gets old. I didn't think about something until earlier last year. When I mention it to people that think Joseph Smith copied the Bible they're usually at a loss for words and with good reason.

We know Joseph Smith didn't copy the Bible, he translated the golden plates into the Book of Mormon. Let's just pretend for a moment that he did copy the Bible. If Joseph Smith copied from the Bible and the Bible is the word of God and is true, how could the Book of Mormon be false?

Like I said, we know Joseph Smith translated from the golden plates. The above statement is just something I like to bring up to people that try to say the Book of Mormon was copied from the Bible. Usually when I say it they try to go to another topic.

Anyway...

I'd like to take this opportunity to bear my testimony that I know the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true. It is Jesus Christ's church on the earth. I know the Bible and the Book of Mormon are the word of God. I know Joseph Smith did translate the golden plates into what is now the Book of Mormon. I know Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. I know Jesus Christ is the Son of God and I'm thankful for the sacrifice He made. I'm grateful for the restoration of the priesthood, which I hold as well (I'm 19), and it is a great honor to be a priesthood holder. I'm thankful for the temples we have on the earth and for my family as well. I say this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

[LDSChristian]

I know but when I come across such false thoughts I am reminded....Plagiarism is man's term of ownership of things that do not belong to him. All thoughts words and actions are because of the power of the Lord and all things belong to GOD. The words of Isaiah are not Isaiah but of the Spirit and so no man can claim ownership of anything...specially things that comes from GOD and is GIVEN BY GOD TO MAN.

People are deceived and are using man's law and reasoning in order to justify rejecting the BOM.

The BOM was not only for J. Smith day...it was also a remembrance for the people while they walked the Earth.

And so it is normal to find the words of Isaiah and other teachings...and the GOD of the authors of the plate is the same GOD that spoke with Moses and Isaiah.

bert10

True. And Nephi and others plainly said they were reading from the plates of Isaiah so of course parts of Isaiah would be in there. I've looked up some stuff and turns out the Isaiah chapters in the Book of Mormon that are worded differently than the ones of the Bible are historically more correct than the Bible.

The Isaiah Problem in the Book of Mormon - Chap 11 - SHIELDS

[RipplecutBuddha]

The plagarism theory doesn't work because it's not true.

Truth does not change. Either he did plagarize, or he did not. Time will not change the truth of it. The Book of Mormon is perhaps one of the most severely scrutinized books in all of the history of human writing. It's not even 200 years past Joseph's translation, and despite all the effort to reveal the fraud of the book, no fraud has been discovered.

This is significant because we know more about the process of the translation (writing, for the non-believers) of the Book of Mormon than any other religious text in human history. The people involved are almost all known and named. The time it took...how those involved claimed it took place....and on and on.

Yet with all this information, and all this time to examine it in detail, there is no other plausible theory as to how Joseph Smith could have created such a text in one draft over such a short period of time without the assistance of divine power and guidance.

There are things in the Book of Mormon that nobody knew prior to Joseph's death...how did they get in there? Lucky guesses? There are writing styles not belonging to anyone around Joseph in the Book of Mormon. Strong argument for plagarism at first, but every time a proposed source text is provided, the writing style in the source text fails to find a match in the Book of Mormon...no go there either.

None of this is proof of divine inspiration, but eventually the honest seeker of truth will gather enough unanswerd questions that will lead him/her to bring the case before God, which is where the Book of Mormon states the case ought to be tried in the first place.

[Gramajane]

I understand that plagiarism is when someone COPIES from some other work and claims it is their original work with giving NO CREDIT to the real source?

That being so, then that accusations totally falls on its face--

Joseph Smith NEVER claimed to author the BofM

He TRANSLATED IT,

and as was earlier said- the scriptures in book itself, says the words are Isaiah!

plus the headings tell exactly which Isaiah references to compare with!

This is called more like quoting- of if one wants to be picky as the wording is often slightly different, then possibly paraphrasing,

but surely not plagiarism --- as the source is given.

What is ironic to me- is like the modern parable of the man who discovered a diamond buried in his back yard,

and people attacked him on such non important things;

a. historically no diamonds could be found there--

b. why was he being a money digger

c. he was trying to fool others

d. he cared for money more than his family etc

but they couldn't seem to just investigate the diamond itself!

(read the book for truth!?)

My Aunt (on fathers side) was SURE the BofM was false, as no more scripture allowed etc etc

-- but then she shared with me the achasic (sp?) record she accepted of another testament

which had NO plates, and was supposed to come from some astral realm etc

but when I read it-- it ?left out? all the divinity of Jesus Christ! sheeish!

Oh, well, I believe she is now, if she hasn't already, listening to my father teach her in heaven and yes we got her temple work done, for whenever she is ready to accept it. :)

I love the restored gospel of Jesus Christ! What a blessing to the world, and the only sure way to end the fighting, corruption, greed etc! May we all be willing to accept truth when we find it and continue to seek after these things... Gramajane

[Blackmarch]

Who here hasn't heard "Joseph Smith plagiarized from the Bible"? I think we all have heard that at least once. Quite honestly, it gets old. I didn't think about something until earlier last year. When I mention it to people that think Joseph Smith copied the Bible they're usually at a loss for words and with good reason.

We know Joseph Smith didn't copy the Bible, he translated the golden plates into the Book of Mormon. Let's just pretend for a moment that he did copy the Bible. If Joseph Smith copied from the Bible and the Bible is the word of God and is true, how could the Book of Mormon be false?

Like I said, we know Joseph Smith translated from the golden plates. The above statement is just something I like to bring up to people that try to say the Book of Mormon was copied from the Bible. Usually when I say it they try to go to another topic.

Anyway...

I'd like to take this opportunity to bear my testimony that I know the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true. It is Jesus Christ's church on the earth. I know the Bible and the Book of Mormon are the word of God. I know Joseph Smith did translate the golden plates into what is now the Book of Mormon. I know Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. I know Jesus Christ is the Son of God and I'm thankful for the sacrifice He made. I'm grateful for the restoration of the priesthood, which I hold as well (I'm 19), and it is a great honor to be a priesthood holder. I'm thankful for the temples we have on the earth and for my family as well. I say this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

also the plagiarism excuse does not work because in each case the individuals who are quoted from the bible are mentioned by name and attributed to saying such.

thats not plagiarism, thats quoting.

and theres really only 3 parts in the Book of mormon where that happens- nephi quoting Isaiah, abanidi quoting the Law, and Jesus Christ repeating himself.

Now there are other parts you may say are inspired by the bible, but they are different enough to make the plagiarism accusation really shaky.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Blackmarch

[LDSChristian]

also the plagiarism excuse does not work because in each case the individuals who are quoted from the bible are mentioned by name and attributed to saying such.

thats not plagiarism, thats quoting.

and theres really only 3 parts in the Book of mormon where that happens- nephi quoting Isaiah, abanidi quoting the Law, and Jesus Christ repeating himself.

Now there are other parts you may say are inspired by the bible, but they are different enough to make the plagiarism accusation really shaky.

True. I mean if people want to use it simply because they say similar things then one can ask about Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John since they teach the same things. Some verses being word for word. We know those are the way they are because each of them were with Christ so of course they'll say the overall same thing which is like how Nephi and others read out of Isaiah so of course there would be chapters in the Book of Mormon that are from Isaiah, the original. Check this out. It's interesting:The Isaiah Problem in the Book of Mormon - Chap 11 - SHIELDS

[SeattleTruthSeeker]

Who here hasn't heard "Joseph Smith plagiarized from the Bible"? I think we all have heard that at least once. Quite honestly, it gets old. I didn't think about something until earlier last year. When I mention it to people that think Joseph Smith copied the Bible they're usually at a loss for words and with good reason.

We know Joseph Smith didn't copy the Bible, he translated the golden plates into the Book of Mormon. Let's just pretend for a moment that he did copy the Bible. If Joseph Smith copied from the Bible and the Bible is the word of God and is true, how could the Book of Mormon be false?

Like I said, we know Joseph Smith translated from the golden plates. The above statement is just something I like to bring up to people that try to say the Book of Mormon was copied from the Bible. Usually when I say it they try to go to another topic.

Anyway...

I'd like to take this opportunity to bear my testimony that I know the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is true. It is Jesus Christ's church on the earth. I know the Bible and the Book of Mormon are the word of God. I know Joseph Smith did translate the golden plates into what is now the Book of Mormon. I know Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. I know Jesus Christ is the Son of God and I'm thankful for the sacrifice He made. I'm grateful for the restoration of the priesthood, which I hold as well (I'm 19), and it is a great honor to be a priesthood holder. I'm thankful for the temples we have on the earth and for my family as well. I say this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

Joseph Smith plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Apostle Paul plagarized from the Old Testament.

Joseph Smith plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Synoptic Gospels (Specifically Matthew) plagarized from the Old Testament.

Joseph Smith Plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Epistle of Jude plagarized from the Book of Enoch.

Joseph Smith Plagarized from the Bible in the same manner that the account of Noah's Flood plagarized from the Sumarian Flood Story known as the Epic of Gilgamesh (which predates the Biblical Account).

Joseph Smith Plagarized from the Bible in the same manner that the many of the copy evidence for the New Testament plagarized from the Autographs.

Conclusion - If Joseph Smith plagarized from the Bible and Joseph Smith is a false Prophet, and the Book of Mormon is a False record and scripture then so also is the Bible and Paul is a false Apostle, the Gospel of Matthew is a false record, Jude is a False record, the account of Noah's flood is a false account.

When the critic's logic is employed to them on their grounds and on their terms, then they have to accept that much of the Bible is plagarized in and of itself and therefore if plagarism is the standard to accept or reject scripture, they must reject the Bible entirely.

The problem is, plagarism is falsely ascribed to how Joseph Smith translated the record because Plagarism is defined as a person who takes a writing of someone else and then ascribes themselves as being the original author of such document. Joseph Smith never made the claim to have originally authored the Book of Mormon, but was its translator and may have used the Bible as a source in his translation process because of his familiarity with the Bible, this does not mean that the Book of Mormon is not inspired and authentic.

For further information on this see the following article: Did Joseph Smith Plagiarize from the King James Bible?

[LDSChristian]

Joseph Smith plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Apostle Paul plagarized from the Old Testament.

Joseph Smith plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Synoptic Gospels (Specifically Matthew) plagarized from the Old Testament.

Joseph Smith Plagarized the Bible in the same manner that the Epistle of Jude plagarized from the Book of Enoch.

Joseph Smith Plagarized from the Bible in the same manner that the account of Noah's Flood plagarized from the Sumarian Flood Story known as the Epic of Gilgamesh (which predates the Biblical Account).

Joseph Smith Plagarized from the Bible in the same manner that the many of the copy evidence for the New Testament plagarized from the Autographs.

Conclusion - If Joseph Smith plagarized from the Bible and Joseph Smith is a false Prophet, and the Book of Mormon is a False record and scripture then so also is the Bible and Paul is a false Apostle, the Gospel of Matthew is a false record, Jude is a False record, the account of Noah's flood is a false account.

When the critic's logic is employed to them on their grounds and on their terms, then they have to accept that much of the Bible is plagarized in and of itself and therefore if plagarism is the standard to accept or reject scripture, they must reject the Bible entirely.

The problem is, plagarism is falsely ascribed to how Joseph Smith translated the record because Plagarism is defined as a person who takes a writing of someone else and then ascribes themselves as being the original author of such document. Joseph Smith never made the claim to have originally authored the Book of Mormon, but was its translator and may have used the Bible as a source in his translation process because of his familiarity with the Bible, this does not mean that the Book of Mormon is not inspired and authentic.

For further information on this see the following article: Did Joseph Smith Plagiarize from the King James Bible?

Makes sense.