The Apocrypha

[jayanna]

It would be more important for them to study the scriptures. As it is, most members have never read the Old Testament, and even few have read the Book of Mormon more than once or twice in their lifetimes.

Are you kidding? We are on like, our fourth time through with our kids, surely this is exaggerating? I hope

IMO reading the Apocrypha is not a priority, since it is not scripture, and I wouldn't want to inadverdently use it as scripture, or even as a reference being used to explain a gospel principle.

The worst things I've read that were written to convince people to leave the church had truth mixed with lies. Truth mixed with untruth about gospel principles can't be good. There are just too many interpolations by man, too hard to tell where the correctness stops and man's ideas begin.

The newspaper and magazines weren't written to mislead me about understanding the gospel.

The most important tool to make use of while studying the gospel is the Holy Ghost, no contest. If He is helping me, I understand so much more and find both deeper meaning to the scriptures as well as an explanation to how what I'm reading will apply to my life to help me improve on my weaknesses.

[stormwitch]

hmmmmm... Considering the Apocrypha of the Old Testament there is no proof that they are less true than any other book in the Old Testament. There has been no messing around due to doctrinal quarrels. It is only a matter of being a "greek" jew and accepting these books as canonical or being an "aramaic" jew and not accepting them; or as being a catholic and accepting them or being a lutheran and not accepting them.

Don't mix them up with the questionable Apocrypha of the New Testament.

No, it is not necessary that members read the Old Testament Apocrypha, but it might be a good idea to read them at least once in your life. We need not include them in our scripture study curriculum, but I think reading them ist not spending time for nothing.

[pam]

I've read through this thread a couple of times now. I would have preferred seeing a thread geared towards those that have an interest in reading the Apocrypha and have read it and what they found inspiring about it.

What I keep reading and getting out of this thread is a condemnation of those that don't find it of upmost importance to read it and study it. What I also get is an attitude at one upmanship.

Again as I have mentioned earlier, we are counseled to study the 4 Standard Works. For those that want to study something further, that's awesome and praise worthy. But those that don't should not feel condemned because they lack the interest in studying something that we are not commanded or counseled to do. Nor will they receive any less blessings for not doing so. Yet they will receive blessings for studying the scriptures that we have been counseled to read and study.

Edited March 9, 2011 by pam

[slamjet]

It's disturbing that a quote from Joseph Smith is being thrown around saying that the Apocrypha is mostly correct and that we are condemned for not reading it. I dug around and I found these two talks by Ezra Taft Benson when he spoke of the Book of Mormon. He makes it undeniable that we as an LDS church need to take the Book of Mormon much more seriously than we have. That is not "mostly correct" but that the Lord has "By His own mouth He has borne witness (1) that it is true (D&C 17:6), (2) that it contains the truth and His words (D&C 19:26), (3) that it was translated by power from on high (D&C 20:8), (4) that it contains the fulness of the gospel of Jesus Christ (D&C 20:9, D&C 42:12), (5) that it was given by inspiration and confirmed by the ministering of angels (D&C 20:10), (6) that it gives evidence that the holy scriptures are true (D&C 20:11), and (7) that those who receive it in faith shall receive eternal life (D&C 20:14)." (Book of Mormon - Keystone of our Religion, Oct. 1986 Gen. Conf.)

In his talk A New Witness for Christ in the Oct. 1984 Gen. Conf, he starts off with this:

My beloved brethren and sisters, for some years now I have been deeply concerned that we are not using the Book of Mormon as God intends.

As I participated in the Mexico City Temple dedication, I received the distinct impression that God is not pleased with our neglect of the Book of Mormon.

In the eighty-fourth section of the Doctrine and Covenants, the Lord decreed that the whole Church was under condemnation, even all the children of Zion, because of the way they treated the Book of Mormon. “And they shall remain under this condemnation until they repent,” said the Lord, “and remember the new covenant, even the Book of Mormon.” (D&C 84:57).

Zion cannot fully arise and put on her beautiful garments if she is under this condemnation. (See D&C 82:14.)

The links for these talks are here (A New Witness for Christ) and here (The Book of Mormon - Keystone of our Religion)

While it may be beneficial to read the Apocrypha to contrast and compare, it should not be seen as a most necessary thing for a Latter Day Saints to do nor nor should any condemnation be laid at the persons feet for not reading it. I, for one, do not remember anywhere where any prophet said that I would receive any type of Salvation for reading it.

[Guest]

I have to say... the apocrypha can be hard to get through. I would completely understand somebody choosing to read Twilight instead.

:)

[stormwitch]

I have to say... the apocrypha can be hard to get through. I would completely understand somebody choosing to read Twilight instead.

:)

I'd love to add a huge *laugh* to it:lol:

[stormwitch]

I've read through this thread a couple of times now. I would have preferred seeing a thread geared towards those that have an interest in reading the Apocrypha and have read it and what they found inspiring about it.

What I keep reading and getting out of this thread is a condemnation of those that don't find it of upmost importance to read it and study it. What I also get is an attitude at one upmanship.

Again as I have mentioned earlier, we are counseled to study the 4 Standard Works. For those that want to study something further, that's awesome and praise worthy. But those that don't should not feel condemned because they lack the interest in studying something that we are not commanded or counseled to do. Nor will they receive any less blessings for not doing so. Yet they will receive blessings for studying the scriptures that we have been counseled to read and study.

Its not my intention to tell people that they HAVE to read the Apocrypha.. but just keep in mind: the German Bible which is approved by the Church contains the OT Apocrypha... so while Amerikans need not read them.. Germans ARE supposed to read them as they are part of their Bible:D --- no, I'm just kidding! (At least: the curriculum does not include them!!!!!)

And SLAMJET: yes, you are absolutely right. There is nothing more important than studying the Book of Mormon. And luckily there are no Apocrypha to it so far ;-)

Edited March 9, 2011 by stormwitch

[pam]

Not pointing out anyone in particular..just the general feel of the thread.

[Wingnut]

I just have a hard time trying to figure out why I should feel guilty for not reading the Apocrypha, which is "mostly correct," instead of the Book of Mormon (which I have a hard enough time getting through), which is "the most correct."

[SteveVH]

I just have a hard time trying to figure out why I should feel guilty for not reading the Apocrypha, which is "mostly correct," instead of the Book of Mormon (which I have a hard enough time getting through), which is "the most correct."

I would have to agree with you, assuming that it is only "mostly correct". If it is, in fact, the word of God, meaning it is all correct, as over a billion people believe, then I think it merits reading.

[JudoMinja]

I sure hope no one feels like they will be condemned if they don't read the Apocrypha. After all, I'd never even heard of it until reading the op for this thread! So that would mean I'd be condemned for not reading something I've never heard about. I'm sorry if my posts contributed to creating that feeling.

The Book of Mormon is the single most important book anyone could read. I read from the Book of Mormon everyday, and the Bible at least once a week (yes it's scripture and just as important as the Book of Mormon but not as easy to read :) ). The apocrypha clearly is not a necessary read, or the prophets would be counceling us to study it along with our other readings and we would probably have a course on it in Seminary/Institute. Since these classes do not even touch on it, it clearly is not "important" to read.

[Jenamarie]

On another message board I frequent, we recently had a discussion on the Apocrypha. After somebody posted this excerpt, I'm reeeeeeeeeeeally interested in reading it.

New Jerusalem Bible:

1 Maccabees 6:33-46, the death of Eleazar.

33 The king rose at daybreak and marched his army at top speed down the road to Beth-Zechariah, where his forces took up their battle formations and sounded the trumpets.

34 The elephants were given a syrup of grapes and mulberries to prepare them for the battle.

35 These animals were distributed among the phalanxes, to each elephant being allocated a thousand men dressed in coats of mail with bronze helmets on their heads; five hundred picked horsemen were also assigned to each beast.

36 The horsemen anticipated every move their elephant made; wherever it went they went with it, never quitting it.

37 On each elephant, to protect it, was a stout wooden tower, kept in position by girths, each with its three combatants, as well as its mahout.

38 The remainder of the cavalry was stationed on one or other of the two flanks of the army, to harass the enemy and cover the phalanxes.

39 When the sun glinted on the bronze and golden shields, the mountains caught the glint and gleamed like fiery torches.

40 One part of the royal army was deployed on the upper slopes of the mountain and the other in the valley below; they advanced in solid, well-disciplined formation.

41 Everyone trembled at the noise made by this vast multitude, the thunder of the troops on the march and the clanking of their armour, for it was an immense and mighty army.

42 Judas and his army advanced to give battle, and six hundred of the king's army were killed.

43 Eleazar, called Avaran, noticing that one of the elephants was royally caparisoned and was also taller than all the others, and supposing that the king was mounted on it,

44 sacrificed himself to save his people and win an imperishable name.

45 Boldly charging towards the creature through the thick of the phalanx, dealing death to right and left, so that the enemy scattered on either side at his onslaught,

46 he darted in under the elephant, thrust at it from underneath, and killed it. The beast collapsed on top of him, and he died on the spot.

[rex8499]

It's definitely on my "to read" list. I really enjoy reading other books and seeing chunks of truth within them as well. I recently finished reading the Nag Hammadi Library. There's some stuff in there that makes me go, "wow, at one point they had the whole truth but it got corrupted."

[ryanh]

Why do many members of the church not read the Apocrypha?

Many members of the church that are of the mind to read such are busy with mission, then straight into schooling, concurrent with marriage, kids, and then development of career or caring for young children. For most adult LDS, life is very busy, and making BoM study a priority is challenging enough let alone adding in one more source - esp a source that has to be carefully sorted through with discernment to identify falsehoods. It’s great when people have to time to study the apocrypha, but most are so anxiously engaged in living the Gospel daily that tangential study is rightly a low priority.

[Wingnut]

It’s great when people have to time to study the apocrypha, but most are so anxiously engaged in living the Gospel daily that tangential study is rightly a low priority.

Hopefully, anyway.

[LDSChristian]

I sure hope no one feels like they will be condemned if they don't read the Apocrypha. After all, I'd never even heard of it until reading the op for this thread! So that would mean I'd be condemned for not reading something I've never heard about. I'm sorry if my posts contributed to creating that feeling.

The Book of Mormon is the single most important book anyone could read. I read from the Book of Mormon everyday, and the Bible at least once a week (yes it's scripture and just as important as the Book of Mormon but not as easy to read :) ). The apocrypha clearly is not a necessary read, or the prophets would be counceling us to study it along with our other readings and we would probably have a course on it in Seminary/Institute. Since these classes do not even touch on it, it clearly is not "important" to read.

The point I'm making isn't that members that don't read it are bad people. I'm just curious as to why people see it as such a small thing to read.

[LDSChristian]

Many members of the church that are of the mind to read such are busy with mission, then straight into schooling, concurrent with marriage, kids, and then development of career or caring for young children. For most adult LDS, life is very busy, and making BoM study a priority is challenging enough let alone adding in one more source - esp a source that has to be carefully sorted through with discernment to identify falsehoods. It’s great when people have to time to study the apocrypha, but most are so anxiously engaged in living the Gospel daily that tangential study is rightly a low priority.

The Book of Mormon doesn't take as long as people think it does to read. You can do it in 1 month tops. I read about 1/4 of it in less than a week including the testimonies and introduction page.

[LDSChristian]

On another message board I frequent, we recently had a discussion on the Apocrypha. After somebody posted this excerpt, I'm reeeeeeeeeeeally interested in reading it.

Wow. Syrup. That part got my attention lol.

[Jenamarie]

The Book of Mormon doesn't take as long as people think it does to read. You can do it in 1 month tops. I read about 1/4 of it in less than a week including the testimonies and introduction page.

You can read most anything quickly. It's comprehending, pondering, studying, and applying what we read that takes extra time and effort.

[ryanh]

The Book of Mormon doesn't take as long as people think it does to read. You can do it in 1 month tops. I read about 1/4 of it in less than a week including the testimonies and introduction page.

Great!!! Next time, try the 90 day challenge. Then the next time, study it by topic, then the next time . . . . One is never done studying the BoM, New Testament, or modern day revelations (which are going to be far more applicable than the apocryphia).

I just heard a comment from Elder Oaks recently that on his 20th or so reading of the D&C, a verse jumped out at him that, if he didn't know better, he would have guessed it had been inserted since his last reading! Point is, if someone thinks that one, two, or 20 readings of a book of scripture is sufficient, they are missing a lot of what is available.

[Dravin]

The Book of Mormon doesn't take as long as people think it does to read. You can do it in 1 month tops. I read about 1/4 of it in less than a week including the testimonies and introduction page.

And then you start it over again. I have, and I know I'm not alone, finished Moroni one day and restarted Nephi the next*. Of course if one topically studies the Book of Mormon instead of just going through cover to cover then you don't really 'finish' it. It's not a physical impossibly to go through other works quickly enough that you aren't neglecting the Book of Mormon for months on end, and one can always study concurrently but if I am going to either put down the Book of Mormon for something else (even if just briefly) or study concurrently it's going to be a standard work.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Dravin

[ryanh]

Hopefully, anyway.

Amen. I know lots aren't, but I am being presumptious that they wouldn't have any interest in reading the apocrypha anyway.

[LDSChristian]

You can read most anything quickly. It's comprehending, pondering, studying, and applying what we read that takes extra time and effort.

I'm including that. If I read something I don't understand I keep reading it over and over as well as before and after.

[Jenamarie]

Great!!! Next time, try the 90 day challenge. Then the next time, study it by topic, then the next time . . . . One is never done studying the BoM, New Testament, or modern day revelations (which are going to be far more applicable than the apocryphia).

I just heard a comment from Elder Oaks recently that on his 20th or so reading of the D&C, a verse jumped out at him that, if he didn't know better, he would have guessed it had been inserted since his last reading! Point is, if someone thinks that one, two, or 20 readings of a book of scripture is sufficient, they are missing a lot of what is available.

The term "Feasting upon the words of God" is a phrase that often pops into my head when I think of Scripture study, because it is such a great illustration of how we should do it.

Do you wolf down a feast as fast as you can? No. You look it over, generally giving it a good once-over look from beginning to end, then you start digging into what most appeals to you. You savor each bite, allowing some time for it to be digested and absorbed, then go back and pick something else, perhaps something new, and savor that. You may try something next that's a slight variation on what you tried before, or you may go back to an "old favorite" and notice something about the flavor that you hadn't noticed the first time. Perhaps combining an old favorite with something new produces something even more grand and offers a different insight into what the chef has prepared for you. Maybe a particular flavor is one you favor when you've had a rough day, to lift your spirits. Perhaps another isn't your favorite right off the bat, and takes a few tries for you to aquire the taste for it, and realize that it wasn't so bad for you after all. Some are a bit hard to chew. But all of it is delicious, and good for the soul.

[slamjet]

The point I'm making isn't that members that don't read it are bad people. I'm just curious as to why people see it as such a small thing to read.

I do believe Post #29 would explain why most church members would feel this way.

It's a matter of priority that the Prophets have asked of us. Apocryphal books would be kind-of low.