Hey Hey!

[Jason]

This PM poster seems creepy. First i'll let this nice girl know Im a good Mormon guy. Then I'll ask her for pictures...maybe one with a swimsuit. Then I'll suggest we meet sometime for lunch. Hey, wanna come back to my house and take some pictures...you're such a cute girl...and oh yeah, Im a pedophile.

[Princess3dward]

<div class='quotemain'>

I noticed that too. Yes their are! You are totally one of them!

You definitely have a precious spirit about you too.

THANK YOU!!!!

This PM poster seems creepy. First i'll let this nice girl know Im a good Mormon guy. Then I'll ask her for pictures...maybe one with a swimsuit. Then I'll suggest we meet sometime for lunch. Hey, wanna come back to my house and take some pictures...you're such a cute girl...and oh yeah, Im a pedophile.

[john doe]

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

[StrawberryFields]

This PM poster seems creepy. First i'll let this nice girl know Im a good Mormon guy. Then I'll ask her for pictures...maybe one with a swimsuit. Then I'll suggest we meet sometime for lunch. Hey, wanna come back to my house and take some pictures...you're such a cute girl...and oh yeah, Im a pedophile.

No, I think that guy was banned a few months ago.

[begood2]

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

I just don't open those topics and that is one of my reasons for not joining the open forum.

[babygirl]

<div class='quotemain'>

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

I just don't open those topics and that is one of my reasons for not joining the open forum.

that doesnt make sense???

[Princess3dward]

<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'>

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

I just don't open those topics and that is one of my reasons for not joining the open forum.

that doesnt make sense???

The open forum is were you can go if you are over 18.

It is not really all LDS views, so it is considered less safe for us because of our age

That doesn't matter though. If I wanted to find people who hate mormons, I can ride the city bus.

[Brother Dorsey]

Des....I'm glad you didn't leave...you know we love ya girlie!

[shanstress70]

I think I know who this poster is... she's been here for a while and I think a lot of her. Is it Mrs. S? (If I'm wrong, Mrs. S, I totally apologize!) I think she has Desire's best interest at heart, whether you guys agree with her or not. She makes some good points, but still it's no one's right to tell someone to leave the site.

[Princess3dward]

I think I know who this poster is... she's been here for a while and I think a lot of her. Is it Mrs. S? (If I'm wrong, Mrs. S, I totally apologize!) I think she has Desire's best interest at heart, whether you guys agree with her or not. She makes some good points, but still it's no one's right to tell someone to leave the site.

Why would you guess her?

[shanstress70]

<div class='quotemain'>

I think I know who this poster is... she's been here for a while and I think a lot of her. Is it Mrs. S? (If I'm wrong, Mrs. S, I totally apologize!) I think she has Desire's best interest at heart, whether you guys agree with her or not. She makes some good points, but still it's no one's right to tell someone to leave the site.

Why would you guess her?

Just bc of her writing style and the things she's said, especially the part about being inactive for a while. She's actually one of my favorite posters, and I've read her stuff for a long time. Even though her and I have completely different beliefs, she's one of the people here that I respect a lot bc of the way she comes across to people.

I don't expect you to tell me if I'm right though.

[EricM]

Nevermind. :)

[Princess3dward]

I don't think that is necessary.

Did you read it?

It isn't, "Leave or I am going to kill you" or "I hate you go away".

It is more along the lines of, "I don't think you can handle it here".

(I personally think I can. I got worse at school, but that was her opinion)

[Guest MrsS]

Hey people. It isn't really that bad.. I just didn't like it is all...

PC: I'm going to treat this PM like we treat many posts here--slice it up, and see how it cuts First, Desire's response was right on--it wasn't that bad, but doesn't leave a good taste either.

That is your opinion – it was said to Dez with a loving heart.

Dez, Honey - you need to make sure when you respond to the posts that you have scriptural/Ensign references to back you up. You are not always correct in your answers and these non-LDS posters do not take into account you are only 16 years old and only been a member for 1 year.

PC: PM is wrong. Dez has often explained that she is young, and not an expert. We non-LDS posters are not lack(ing) in discernment. Some of you maybe, some for sure NOT. There was some accusation early on that a poster or two were trying to confuse Dez, but I rather think it was just the normal difficulty in communicating in a forum where there is no nonverbal communication, nor tone (90% of how we communicate 'live'). Please note that there is no response, good or bad, regarding using scripturual, Ensign references to back up what you say. We ALL should be doing this ALL of the time. There would be better understanding and less confusion.

You are so new in the Church, you really shouldn't be on this forum. There are too many anti's and non-LDS and they are not near wholesome enough for you to discuss Gospel Doctrine and Gospel Principles with. I have been in the Church since 1967 - yes I was inactive, but I wasn't "dead" to the Gospel and my family was VERY active - and this forum isn't wholesome enough for ME

PC: PM is a bit arrogant, depends on which side you are sitting. Pretend for a minute PC that Desire’ is new to your church, only been there but a year – do you still feel the way you do? I would still jump to the defense no matter what religion she was and I was on a forum of a different faith. but, of course, it's always good to study your faith's basic doctrines. don't be so patronizing On the other hand, even the new convert has plenty to teach the old-timers, because we all have unique experiences.

Here is a forum that is only for LDS members - they do not allow non-LDS thus the anti's are not allowed either. The name of the forum is Nauvoo. I have been "lurking" there now for about a month and I am going to join shortly.

PC: I'm a little put off by how this PM keeps lumping non-LDS and antis together as one group.

So sorry PC that you took this as an insult directly to you. But I did my best to generalize and quite frankly there are three types of posters – LDS, Non-LDS and Anti’s. Which would you prefer to be called???

I am also leaving this forum. There is too much dissension, anger, adversity, arguing and the First Presidency has counseled that we, as LDS members do not need to defend our faith. It stands on it's own, God, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost do not require us to defend them. I feel as though I am dancing with the devil every time I visit here - I honestly feel the Holy Ghost leaving me - and that is NOT something I want, and it is something I can prevent.

PC: I guess the LDS have this same phenomenon we Pentecostal/Charismatics have. When we're going to make an unpopular, perhaps unScriptural decision, or when we have an argument that is weak, we proclaim that the Spirit has impressed me to go in this way, and we speak of the negative spiritual atmosphere of doing otherwise. Get real PC, when the Spirit is put off and the things we watch, read, listen to, etc chases away the Holy Spirit, then we are to stop doing those things.

Moroni 7: 12 Wherefore, all things which are good cometh of God; and that which is evil cometh of the devil; for the devil is an enemy unto God, and fighteth against him continually, and inviteth and enticeth to sin, and to do that which is evil continually.

13 But behold, that which is of God inviteth and enticeth to do good continually; wherefore, every thing which inviteth and enticeth to do good, and to love God, and to serve him, is inspired of God.

14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the devil.

15 For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.

16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.

17 But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him.

18 And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged.

19 Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ.

There are good LDS people on this board - but they have forgotten the basic simple council of our living prophets.

PC: Are there any good non-LDS people here? PC, why would I state non-LDS people have forgotten the basic simple council of OUR living prophets?? Non-LDS do not believe in Living Prophets. The Apostle Paul says we're to be ready with an answer for our faith. God’s Living Latter-day Prophet says we do not need to get into arguments and needless debates in defense of our faith. I go with God’s Living Latter-day Prophet. In my near to a year here, I've sensed that most LDS posters strike that balance--they'll explain and occasionally offer up an initial defense. Most will not get into a contentious back and forth. If they do, they eventually realize what's happened, and pull themselves out. Yes, those LDS posters who have been members of the Church for numerous years. NOT those who have only been in the Church for a year or less.

You came to this board to learn more about your faith, I did too. Nauvoo is better geared to give that to you. Here is the link to their site: http://www.nauvoo.com/ubb/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi - go there, lurk for a couple of weeks. See if you don't see and FEEL the difference there.

PC: If all you want to do is learn about your faith, read the Standard Works, be faithful in ward attendance, and move to Utah. If you want to strengthen your faith--stretch it out some--then don't be afraid to dialogue with open-hearted 'unbelievers.' PC, that statement is really not becoming to you. It is rather un-Christian. I am not afraid to dialogue with open-hearted non-LDS. It is the closed-hearted, stiffnecked non-LDS and Anti’s that I do not want to hear, read or dialogue with. To strengthen MY faith, I read the words of the Lords Latter-day Prophets, His Latter-day Apostles. I read the Ensign, The New Era and as many wholesome and uplifting books that I can get my hands on. There is also no need to move to Utah. God lives in many mansions. Not just those that are in Utah!

Do you get the Ensign and New Era? If not, go on-line and read them! They also are words from Heavenly Father. I love The Friend too - same messages only way easier to understand! (and I am 54 years old)

Before I leave here, I want everyone to know why I am leaving. Most probably won't give a hoot - but I still want ALL to know how I feel and the reason I am leaving. I am still composing it - so it may be a while yet. Please keep my leaving between us for now.

PC: By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer. PC Why do you say that? It is very nasty and un-Christian. If I recall right, nearly every LDS member here has stated that they joined this site because it claimed to be a “Community where every one is like-minded, of the same faith. Do you encourage your parishioners to frequent other religions? To find a religious community where there is no one who thinks, feels, or worships the way they do? I don’t think so.

This PM poster seems creepy. First i'll let this nice girl know Im a good Mormon guy. Then I'll ask her for pictures...maybe one with a swimsuit. Then I'll suggest we meet sometime for lunch. Hey, wanna come back to my house and take some pictures...you're such a cute girl...and oh yeah, Im a pedophile

Jason, I really didn’t expect much better from you. You are too full of contention, hatred and evil. In My Opinion, that is.

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

John Doe, I am really surprised by your response. I have never questioned my faith. Where in the world did any of you get THAT one from? Would you please explain exactly what you mean by Weak Minded? Where in the personal PM to Dez does it state Weak Minded? I am far from weak minded. So is Dez, far from being weak minded. She is young, and in the very infant stages of the LDS religion. Those discussions here on this board that are offensive are on the restricted boards – no one has been posting there, because all of the action is on Gospel Discussion Board – even though some topics really should be moved to General and to the restricted. In MY Opinion.

We know that contention is not of the Lord and as much fun as I have arguing, it is more the natural man and not the spiritual man that chooses to argue

I wonder if that is what the person who sent the Pm to Des meant.

Yes it is.

[quote name='ALmom' date='Oct 6 2006, 08:14 AM' post='112372]

well, it also goes to show us to be careful, what we think may be helpful could very well not be. there is a saying i used to hear growing up that seems appropriate.

the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

seriously though, we are advised by the general authorites to be aware of who we are and our strengths and weakness. we were also told to help those in need without putting ourselves in the way of temptation. one may be able to do something that another can not. i have enjoyed being here, yes sometimes i laugh and ignore certain threads, seems like a waste of time for me, but not for someone else, have fun. if this person feels the spirit has left because of feelings and words here, i'm proud of them for having the personal insite to be aware of their weakness and act on that knowledge. if they feel they must tell us first, freedom of speach, go for it. what i think, this may have even been done out of concern for des and it didn't go well. so if it were me i think i would come out here publicly apoligize for the unintentional hurt, say my peice and never return. that simple. we must all do what is best for us, being on here may be good for you or not, make a decision and do, don't try to convince everyone else to follow, that is their agency.

just my two cents. ALmom

ps by all means share other wonderful sites you have found. personaly i don't think i could keep up with more than one but that's me

I sent the PM her with an apology.

I would like for the LDS members, and them alone, to really take a good hard look at the caliber of the posts here, would you want your New-To-The-LDS-Church-Of-Only-1-Year-Teen-age children, nieces, nephews, cousins, siblings to be here on this forum – to read the arguing, LDS bashing that goes on? How many of these posts could you take, and turn into a FHE lesson? Let the teens read the entire post, and then do the FHE? How many of you take your children to R and higher rated movies, then use what they have seen as an opportunity for a spiritual FHE lesson?

It is one thing when the non-LDS ask questions, then ask more questions looking for a clearer picture. That is not contentious, or argumentative. A pet peeve I have is that when the official LDS sites are posted and referenced it appears that no one goes, reads, then respond.

PC, John Doe, and ALmom all have used that word Weakness – again I ask - - - - Where did you all get that from?

It is a weakness in your eyes when someone recognizes an action, book, words, music, etc., etc. that causes the Holy Ghost to depart from you? Is that where you are getting that from?

These men of the Church do not see it as a weakness.

From: Robert S. Wood, “The Tongue of Angels,” Ensign, Nov. 1999, 83

In latter days, the Lord has emphasized again how, in the words of the Book of Mormon, our “outward performances” (Alma 25:15), are defiling or edifying. What we say and how we act will create an atmosphere welcoming or hostile to the Holy Ghost. In the 88th section of the Doctrine and Covenants, the Lord counseled us to avoid “light speeches” and an “excess of laughter.” He associated such expressions with defects of the heart—“lustful desires,” “pride,” and “light-mindedness”—that finally proceed to “wicked doings” (D&C 88:69, 121). I take “light speeches” to refer to irreverent and demeaning language and “light-mindedness” to what the Lord has called trifling with sacred things (see D&C 6:12).

From: Henry B. Eyring, “That We May Be One,” Ensign, May 1998, 66

A choice to be unclean will repel the Holy Ghost. The Spirit only dwells with those who choose the Lord over the world. “Be ye clean” (3 Ne. 20:41; D&C 38:42) and love God with all your “heart, … might, mind, and strength” (D&C 59:5) are not suggestions but commandments. And they are necessary to the companionship of the Spirit, without which we cannot be one.</span>

After reading Des's copy of the pm to her, I'm pleased to see that it wasn't written in a bullying way, just as an advisory and what the poster felt was a helpful way.

I'm sorry to hear that the person who sent the PM is considering leaving the site also...I think it's great hearing all the different opinions on here, and think that the LDS who are secure with their faith shouldn't have too much to worry about sticking up for their beliefs.

I also think that it is valuable to see that the person who PM'd Des was trying to be helpful.Her heart was in the right place. :)

Pushka, you mentioned that if someone is secure in their faith they should be able to stick up for their beliefs. I am not so sure that it is only about faith. I think much depends on where we are emotionally. Also having been here for more than three years I have become more used to the arguments that non-believers bring up. Living in Utah for the majority of my life, I had not heard much of what the arguments are. Three years ago when I came here I was very vulnerable, I had just lost my mom to cancer and was having a difficult time dealing with the loss of her. I come from a less active family and my mom was suffering, it was suggested by hospice that she might benefit from a blessing to release her. My father turned to my husband to give my mom this blessing and within a matter of just a couple of hours she was gone. My heart was broken and my spirit was fragile. I must have appeared wounded because I had some who were non-members here really distort my beliefs. Since that time I have had good times and difficult times both on and off this board.

All in all, I consider myself one of the lucky ones who has gone through many storms and came out a little stronger and hopefully a little wiser.

I think it is important to remember that everyone joins LDS Talk for a different reason. Some are seeking an escape, friendship, knowledge, and support. Some might join just to discredit our church and to make the members here question the foundation of what they believe.

Personally, I am okay with the expressing of opinion but not okay when discrediting the church in which this site carries the name.

Pushka, Strawberry ~ you are right on there. I came here for companionship & knowledge.

I think I know who this poster is... she's been here for a while and I think a lot of her. Is it Mrs. S? (If I'm wrong, Mrs. S, I totally apologize!) I think she has Desire's best interest at heart, whether you guys agree with her or not. She makes some good points, but still it's no one's right to tell someone to leave the site.

Ok, where did I state: Dez, Leave this board, forum? I said that this forum wasn’t really right for her. That she needed a more wholesome forum.

Not knowing Dez very well, not knowing about 16 year olds very well, not knowing about teenagers with the disability that Dez says she has ( I can not find the post where she told of her disability, but I think it is short attention span (very simplistically put) I could have put it differently to her. Yet she never pm’d me back with questions as to why I said what I said.

I think I know who this poster is... she's been here for a while and I think a lot of her. Is it Mrs. S? (If I'm wrong, Mrs. S, I totally apologize!) I think she has Desire's best interest at heart, whether you guys agree with her or not. She makes some good points, but still it's no one's right to tell someone to leave the site.

Why would you guess her?

Just bc of her writing style and the things she's said, especially the part about being inactive for a while. She's actually one of my favorite posters, and I've read her stuff for a long time. Even though her and I have completely different beliefs, she's one of the people here that I respect a lot bc of the way she comes across to people.

I don't expect you to tell me if I'm right though.

<span style="color:#660000">Shan, I do disagree with some of your posts. On the flip side of that coin, I will readily admit that you are most fair in all of your posts. And I do enjoy reading what you have to say. I have worked very hard at not getting snippy and nasty in my responses to anyone’s posts, including yours. Well, except Dr T and he really ticked me off. He still does. I am not at all surprised that he is a psychologist. Considering he seldom posts anything but questions. He really hasn’t posted any of his inner most thoughts, feelings – beliefs. I feel as though this forum is his play ground and that we are all subjects in one of his experiments. Oh and Joshua, he too really ticked me off. I guess not sleeping more than four hours a night tends to deteriorate the manners, after several months.

I have been visiting other LDS forums, one of which does not have any anti’s on it, and from what I have read no non-LDS.

Sorry PC, but I am around non-LDS 5 days a week, 8 hours a day. When I come to a forum that says it is LDS, I expect it to be. FYI, I have always enjoyed your posts, your fairness. I refrained from questioning you about your last posts regarding the lessons you were giving at your own parish. Not so now: Why do you teach about the LDS faith when you should be teaching the Word of God from the AoG point of view? Are we LDS here on this forum subject matter for you to teach your flock that they are better than?? I really hate for my thoughts, feelings, beliefs, trials and tribulations to be fodder for someone’s college dissertations, sermon, talk. Especially when I am not asked and given the opportunity to agree/refuse to it.

Have you all had your fun be jury and judge? Certainly hope so - MrsS

[john doe]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE

<div class='quotemain'>By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith, you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you.

John Doe, I am really surprised by your response. I have never questioned my faith. Where in the world did any of you get THAT one from? Would you please explain exactly what you mean by Weak Minded? Where in the personal PM to Dez does it state Weak Minded? I am far from weak minded. So is Dez, far from being weak minded. She is young, and in the very infant stages of the LDS religion. Those discussions here on this board that are offensive are on the restricted boards – no one has been posting there, because all of the action is on Gospel Discussion Board – even though some topics really should be moved to General and to the restricted. In MY Opinion.

Whoa! Where did that come from? I think you're taking offense where none is intended, Mrs. S. I was commenting on a comment made by PC. Clearly, I added the 'weak-minded' caveat. I never said you or anyone else who may or may not have sent the PM accused anyone of being weak-minded. If you read that into it, you misread my intentions. In fact, if you reread my post, you will see where I sort of agree with your assessment, that this site may not be the best place for some people. But that would be a personal decision, not one that I, or you, should be making for others who come here. I challenge you to reread my post more calmly without taking it as being pointed directly at you, or Desire', or anyone else here. It was a generalization, not a pointed finger.

As for my position, I will restate it. If you come here and go away feeling less close to God than when you came on a continuing basis, perhaps you should find a different site that better suits your needs, or at the very least consider not opening threads that you KNOW before clicking on them will lower your level of spirituality.

Personally, I probably don't even bother reading at least half of the threads because they either don't interest me or I can tell after the first couple posts that I don't care enough about the topic to read the rest. As for the Open Forum, I don't even care to ask to be granted acess to it, because I don't think it would be worth my limited available time online. I come here to associate with like-minded people who lift my spirits, not to be dragged down to the depths of others' darkness. If I don't get it here, I'll look elsewhere. Right now, though, the place suits me fine. It may not suit you, though, and that's okay as well. For me, from what little I know about Nauvoo. com, I don't think I would be comfortable there. Others probably would be and are. It's just not in my comfort range right now. Maybe another time, just not right now.

[Guest MrsS]

Shantress, Pushka, Maureen took no offence because they knew that my generalizations did not include them. They did not include you either SoulSearcher - if you took offense then that is your problem. You need to deal with it and get over it.

[prisonchaplain]

That is your opinion – it was said to Dez with a loving heart.

And I'm dumbfounded. Like many here, I sensed that the PM came from a lurker, or someone fairly new here, who had not taken time to get to know folk here. I had not imagined the PM was from someone as established, and frankly nice as yourself.

So, I take you at your word that your advice was offered with good intentions.

Please note that there is no response, good or bad, regarding using scripturual, Ensign references to back up what you say. We ALL should be doing this ALL of the time. There would be better understanding and less confusion.

I have no qualms with LDS using LDS resources to discuss their faith--especially when explaining it to the unitiated.

PC: PM is a bit arrogant. PD, it depends on which side you are sitting. Pretend for a minute PC that Desire’ is new to your church, only been there but a year – do you still feel the way you do?

Again, not knowing who had sent it, the PM seemed condenscending--particularly coming from a stranger.

So sorry PC that you took this as an insult directly to you. But I did my best to generalize and quite frankly there are three types of posters – LDS, Non-LDS and Anti’s. Which would you prefer to be called???

I didn't quite take it personal. But it seemed targeted at "my people." Frankly, in this particular PM, you probably could have left the "non-LDS" out--unless you really think LDS young people shouldn't be talking to those who are not.

Get real PC, when the Spirit is put off and the things we watch, read, listen to, etc chases away the Holy Spirit, then we are to stop doing those things.

Maybe it's because I'm not LDS, but I don't think this forum is that bad. It might be uncomfortable for some, but when it starts to get out of hand, calm is restored by our moderators. I like the mix here.

On the other hand, if you really do feel it's more negative than positive, then you must obey the Spirit. I'd just suggest that what the Spirit is communicating to you may only be for you. I would disagree with the notion that ldstalk has been abandoned by the Spirit of God (and yes, that does feel odd for me, a non-LDS to say).

PC, why would I state non-LDS people have forgotten the basic simple council of OUR living prophets?? Non-LDS do not believe in Living Prophets.

Fair enough. I wasn't the only one to misinterpret, though.

God’s Living Latter-day Prophet says we do not need to get into arguments and needless debates in defense of our faith. I go with God’s Living Latter-day Prophet.

I was trying to find the balance where Paul and Joseph Smith agree--because you would not want to suggest they do not agree, me thinks.

Yes, those LDS posters who have been members of the Church for numerous years. NOT those who have only been in the Church for a year or less.

We can simply agree to disagree on this one. Dez seems pretty resilient to me.

PC, that statement is really not becoming to you. It is rather un-Christian. I am not afraid to dialogue with open-hearted non-LDS. It is the closed-hearted, stiffnecked non-LDS and Anti’s that I do not want to hear, read or dialogue with.

Then we agree. Just ignore the posts that seem contentious, and the posters you quickly know are. I could think like LDS and come up with three or four names I might treat with caution, right off the bat.

There is also no need to move to Utah. God lives in many mansions. Not just those that are in Utah!

I spent four years living in the headquarter's city of my fellowship. It's not all narrow-mindedness and church politics. There were some great conferences, easy access to leadership and wonderful teaching, and yes, the general environment was faith-affirming, rather than hostile. Many believers choose to locate to such places, if not for themselves, then for their children.

PC: By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer. PC Why do you say that? It is very nasty and un-Christian. If I recall right, nearly every LDS member here has stated that they joined this site because it claimed to be a “Community where every one is like-minded, of the same faith. Do you encourage your parishioners to frequent other religions? To find a religious community where there is no one who thinks, feels, or worships the way they do? I don’t think so.

Same point as above. Some people are very satisfied to saturate themselves in the community of faith. Others wish to engage the world a bit, thinking that might bring that godly perspective. Some here may see a non-LDS poster and think, "Oh no...not another one." Others hope to perhaps at least help the individual better understand the church. In fact, MrsS, you did that for me on a few occasions.

Christ hit the proper balance: We're in the world, but not of it.

I refrained from questioning you about your last posts regarding the lessons you were giving at your own parish. Not so now: Why do you teach about the LDS faith when you should be teaching the Word of God from the AoG point of view? Are we LDS here on this forum subject matter for you to teach your flock that they are better than?? I really hate for my thoughts, feelings, beliefs, trials and tribulations to be fodder for someone’s college dissertations, sermon, talk. Especially when I am not asked and given the opportunity to agree/refuse to it.

MrsS., I'll briefly respond to this, because most here know how I came to this particular lesson. I'm teaching a Sunday School course on AOG beliefs as compared to other traditions. We started with three weeks on our own doctrines, and will spend about two-weeks each on others, starting with LDS. I did not come here a year ago with this intention, but the thought developed, really over the summer.

Our purpose is not to teach students (adults, btw) how to battle other faiths. Rather, by looking at others, we can see ourselves better. For the LDS course, I actually vetted the lesson here, and took comments before presenting it.

The main source for the lessons was not ldstalk, but rather lds.org. I did get some good editing tips here, though. :-)

[Dr T]

Hello MrsS,

In response to your opinions found in the following,

I have worked very hard at not getting snippy and nasty in my responses to anyone’s posts, including yours. Well, except Dr T and he really ticked me off. He still does. I am not at all surprised that he is a psychologist. Considering he seldom posts anything but questions. He really hasn’t posted any of his inner most thoughts, feelings – beliefs. I feel as though this forum is his play ground and that we are all subjects in one of his experiments.

From what I have observed from you, you must have been ticked you off pretty early in our interactions. You are often curt and annoyed in response to my posts and became more so when I called you "snappy." Why did I call you snappy, MrsS? Do you really think I said that unprovoked? I admit, I could have handled that differently but I was just as ticked, as you put it, with your tone and question directed at me. I am not a child and I'm not accustomed to being addressed in that way. So I let you know-"I am not your child." If you want respectful dialogue, start with respect yourself. As far as the playground analogy is concerned I do enjoy my time here (usually). My beliefs are being developed and I am looking into what LDS believe. What do you want from me? Do you want me to turn off my brain and always say, "Oh, you are right" and leave the discussion at that? That is not how I work. I admit that I am not perfect and have made some mistakes, as people commonly do, but I have also been respectful and courteous too. I am learning what LDS believe from this site and that includes from you. What do you think I've learned from you so far?

I hope you find what you are looking for, MrsS.

Dr. T

[begood2]

Mrs.S,

I think that this whole thing has been blown out of proportion.

After reading the PM to Desire, most people will agree that it was not meant as a rude post to run a teenager off of this site. But instead it was written with concern for her well being.

Also as PM implies....it was a personal message.....it was written for the sole purpose of communicating with one particular person and it could have stayed that way if inquiring minds hadn't been dying to know all the details....maybe in the future questionable messages should go to the moderators. We don't all need to be judge and jury.

As a side note...would we feel comfortable if every PM that we have sent out were posted on here for all the members to read and act as judge and jury on ? I think not!

Mrs. S please stay. I've enjoyed reading a great number of your post.

[babygirl]

dispite what eveyone belives Utah is not completlie mormon...though there are alot more there than anywhere else it isnt the best place. i lived in utah for the first 19 yrs of my life just recintly moved to ohio.

they are so much stronger hear. in utah you have so many jack mormons it makes me sad. they are mormon only on sundays or in seminary class but at school they cuss up a storm and dress so inapropriet. utah mormons are probably the least best example to look at which is sad, cuz we have the same values but for some reason they dont keep them or abbided by them it makes me so sad

[pushka]

Dancergirl, maybe some of those 'jack mormons' are rebelling when away from Sunday services and Seminary because of the higher expectations placed on them for being in Utah..the so-called Head State of the LDS Church. (Higher expectations probably from non LDS more than from LDS people).

[babygirl]

Dancergirl, maybe some of those 'jack mormons' are rebelling when away from Sunday services and Seminary because of the higher expectations placed on them for being in Utah..the so-called Head State of the LDS Church. (Higher expectations probably from non LDS more than from LDS people).

yeah, im sure that has alot to do with it, but it still makes me sad

[Princess3dward]

I think that in most cases, if you have problems with anti-mormons, and if they hurt you to the point where you can't feel the spirit, than you should go. Even I know that there will always be an anti here....

But more than half of my immediate family is anti too, so this is not the most threatening of places.

I have an account at mormonteen.com, but that site, I find is a place where a whole bunch of teens go to comlpain about dates, or lack there of... and some of the standards in the strength of youth booklet.

I am personally tired of saying the same "The prophet and God thinks it is important, so it is" over and over.

That is why I still post here.

[Maureen]

Shantress, Pushka, Maureen took no offence because they knew that my generalizations did not include them. They did not include you either SoulSearcher - if you took offense then that is your problem. You need to deal with it and get over it.

That's because I hadn't read this thread until now. I actually read the Defending The Faith...brother D's Rant!, Questions.... thread first and noticed MrsS that you commented about the non-LDS in the same fashion as here. You didn't say some non-LDS, you just said non-LDS, so yes I took offense to that and commented about your post in that thread.

M.

[Guest MrsS]

Mrs.S,

I think that this whole thing has been blown out of proportion.

After reading the PM to Desire, most people will agree that it was not meant as a rude post to run a teenager off of this site. But instead it was written with concern for her well being.

Also as PM implies....it was a personal message.....it was written for the sole purpose of communicating with one particular person and it could have stayed that way if inquiring minds hadn't been dying to know all the details....maybe in the future questionable messages should go to the moderators. We don't all need to be judge and jury.

As a side note...would we feel comfortable if every PM that we have sent out were posted on here for all the members to read and act as judge and jury on ? I think not!

Mrs. S please stay. I've enjoyed reading a great number of your post.

I don't know if I will or not - stay that is. It has been blown out of proportion. I have apologized to Dez, privately.

You are right PM's are just that Personal/ Private messages.

PC, you judged the 'Poster' very harshly - why should knowing who they were change what you said??? Would Christ have done that?

John Doe - you said that I took you post out of context -

you quoted PC's remark:

QUOTE

By all means, if you feel you are weak in the faith, bury yourself in your own faith tradition, and move to a ocmmunity where nearly everyone is like-minded. Sometimes small worlds do feel safer.

I happen to agree with this statement. OK you are agreeing with PC's statement where he is saying that I am weak in the faith. Some of the discussions here are not for the weak-minded or weak of faith. Did I ever once say that I was weak-minded or weak of my faith? If you feel yourself going away feeling less close to God, or questioning your faith,did I say I questioned God? No I have NEVER questioned God you may want to consider frequenting another site that fits your level of comfort better. Or, just avoid opening those topics that tend to bother you. Check out the topic titles, they do not describe the bulk of the subject matter - Lately I have been skipping most of the posts in most of the topics. I have also been leery of even starting a topic for fear that it is going to be taken over by the anti's.

In rereading your post, I see that it really can be taken several ways. I am leaving my added remarks where they are so you can see how I took them. I also want you to know, John Doe, that I believe you did not mean this in an accusatory way.