Lost Soul

[KK03]

I have come to believe over the last year I have an addiction and I have started to look for help. I attended the 12 step program through the church but have since stopped going. This program (and all 12step programs) focuses a lot on God and turning your addiction over to him. At this point I don't believe in a God. I feel like I'm ready to fight this addiction, but I feel stuck since I don't believe in a God.

How can I make myself believe in a God, so I can start my recovery?

Is there other addiction recovery programs that you don't need to believe in a higher power?

Any advice or comments are greatly appreciated.

[annewandering]

You believe in something if not more than nature itself. 'Nature' gives you the power to stop your addiction. Perhaps you can 'give yourself over' to the power nature has given you to heal? You have that power inside you and it will help you to deal with your addiction.

[Finrock]

Good Morning KK03. I hope you are doing well. :)

I have come to believe over the last year I have an addiction and I have started to look for help. I attended the 12 step program through the church but have since stopped going. This program (and all 12step programs) focuses a lot on God and turning your addiction over to him. At this point I don't believe in a God. I feel like I'm ready to fight this addiction, but I feel stuck since I don't believe in a God.

How can I make myself believe in a God, so I can start my recovery?

Is there other addiction recovery programs that you don't need to believe in a higher power?

Any advice or comments are greatly appreciated.

What do you believe in?

Regards,

Finrock

[JesusParadox]

Read scripture and pray

[KK03]

Thanks annewandering and MasterOrator.

Finrock I don't believe in anything. I don't believe in a higher power, big bang, etc.

[pam]

Then perhaps the 12 step program isn't for you. Are there any other programs in your area that you could do? State funded programs?

[Misshalfway]

Have you tried working with a therapist? At the core, addiction is really just about avoidance. It might be good for you to look underneath your unwanted behaviors and discover what it is you are trying to medicate or escape.

I've talked to some who didn't groove with the 12 steps either. The idea of turning over the problem to God didn't work for them. Perhaps going the other way towards building your "self" and your self empowerment might be more fruitful for you.

[Finrock]

Thanks annewandering and MasterOrator.

Finrock I don't believe in anything. I don't believe in a higher power, big bang, etc.

Perhaps I'm taking this too literally, but I find the statement that you don't believe in anything hard to believe. Unless your posts are just a big joke you appear to at least believe that it is worth it to get rid of your addiction. Why do you think your addiction ought to be gotten rid of?

Regards,

Finrock

[HEthePrimate]

Perhaps I'm taking this too literally, but I find the statement that you don't believe in anything hard to believe. Unless your posts are just a big joke you appear to at least believe that it is worth it to get rid of your addiction. Why do you think your addiction ought to be gotten rid of?

Regards,

Finrock

By definition, an addiction is continuing a behavior despite adverse consequences. You could be addicted to virtually anything. You could be addicted to work, for example. Working is not normally harmful--in fact, it's normally quite good to work--but if you are addicted to work, you may spend so much time at work that your family's needs don't get met. You have the adverse consequences of family problems, but you continue working too much all the same, and so it's an addiction. So you don't need a "higher power" in order to recognize the need to overcome an addiction.

Now, you and I may believe that a higher power can be helpful for overcoming an addiction, but it's unwarranted to accuse our friend of not being sincere in his desire to overcome his addiction just because he doesn't believe in God.

[Misshalfway]

By definition, an addiction is continuing a behavior despite adverse consequences. You could be addicted to virtually anything. You could be addicted to work, for example. Working is not normally harmful--in fact, it's normally quite good to work--but if you are addicted to work, you may spend so much time at work that your family's needs don't get met. You have the adverse consequences of family problems, but you continue working too much all the same, and so it's an addiction. So you don't need a "higher power" in order to recognize the need to overcome an addiction.

Now, you and I may believe that a higher power can be helpful for overcoming an addiction, but it's unwarranted to accuse our friend of not being sincere in his desire to overcome his addiction just because he doesn't believe in God.

Maybe I misunderstood but I took Finrock's comments in a different spirit. Beliefs about God aside, if the OP believes that his behavior needs repair then he must believe in some code of conduct. I think what Finrock meant was to help the OP find and work from his values. At least that is more of the direction I saw in the statement.

[slamjet]

The reason why 12 step programs work is for the faith and hope that there is a loving God who cares for, wants the best for us and is waiting for us to humble ourselves and turn to Him so that he can give us strength and take the pain and addictions from us. That being said, in any 12-step, there is always this huge debate as to what it means and how does one turn their life and will over to God. I've found it's very simple... Obedience. Obedience to the commandments of God. Then little by little one's attitude and outlook is changed, the story of our life begins to change from darkness to light and courage and strength are given to be able to take our sobriety from an hour, to days, to years.

The foundational steps are that "I can't, He can, I'll let him." To try to do this just out of our own sheer will, in my experience, does not work.

[HEthePrimate]

Maybe I misunderstood but I took Finrock's comments in a different spirit. Beliefs about God aside, if the OP believes that his behavior needs repair then he must believe in some code of conduct. I think what Finrock meant was to help the OP find and work from his values. At least that is more of the direction I saw in the statement.

My point is that you DO NOT need a code of conduct in order to see the need to repair your behavior. If your behavior is causing you distress, or not yielding the desired results, you will want to change it regardless of whether or not you have a code of conduct.

For example, if I touch a hot stove and burn my hand, I don't need a code of conduct or a revelation from on high to tell me not to touch a hot stove again.

[Misshalfway]

My point is that you DO NOT need a code of conduct in order to see the need to repair your behavior. If your behavior is causing you distress, or not yielding the desired results, you will want to change it regardless of whether or not you have a code of conduct.

For example, if I touch a hot stove and burn my hand, I don't need a code of conduct or a revelation from on high to tell me not to touch a hot stove again.

So, your point is that maybe its not a "code" driving change but maybe he is just sick of his consequences? OK. Except that experiencing pain doesn't always help people stop addictive behavior. It usually takes a bigger gun. And my guess is that, while this person doesn't believe in God, he believes in something. Defining those beliefs or building on whatever belief is there could be a good foundation for change.

[HEthePrimate]

So, your point is that maybe its not a "code" driving change but maybe he is just sick of his consequences? OK. Except that experiencing pain doesn't always help people stop addictive behavior.

Exactly! The definition of an addiction is that you continue doing a behavior even though it's hurting you. The pain/distress is not enough to make you overcome the behavior, but it can alert you to the fact that you have a problem. You may want to change, but not feel able to.

It usually takes a bigger gun. And my guess is that, while this person doesn't believe in God, he believes in something. Defining those beliefs or building on whatever belief is there could be a good foundation for change.

Yes. Everybody believes in something, and I think you're right that defining one's own beliefs and/or building upon them can be helpful in overcoming self-defeating or addictive behaviors.

[KK03]

Perhaps I'm taking this too literally, but I find the statement that you don't believe in anything hard to believe. Unless your posts are just a big joke you appear to at least believe that it is worth it to get rid of your addiction. Why do you think your addiction ought to be gotten rid of?

I feel like I need to get rid of this addiction, because of what it is doing to me, my relationships with others, risk of losing my job (which I love), etc.

[KK03]

The reason why 12 step programs work is for the faith and hope that there is a loving God who cares for, wants the best for us and is waiting for us to humble ourselves and turn to Him so that he can give us strength and take the pain and addictions from us. That being said, in any 12-step, there is always this huge debate as to what it means and how does one turn their life and will over to God. I've found it's very simple... Obedience. Obedience to the commandments of God. Then little by little one's attitude and outlook is changed, the story of our life begins to change from darkness to light and courage and strength are given to be able to take our sobriety from an hour, to days, to years.

The foundational steps are that "I can't, He can, I'll let him." To try to do this just out of our own sheer will, in my experience, does not work.

Thanks for making it simple. I will try the obedience outlook.

[KK03]

Thanks everyone. It sounds like I need to figure out what my core beliefs, and values are so I have something to build on.

Misshalfway, I have considered a therapist, but I'm terrified. Thanks for reinforcing the idea.

[Sicily510]

Yes, core beliefs and values is good. It all comes down to yourself and nobody else, we all may have the remedy, idea's of the solution, but it's whether you want to utilize these offerings. I feel that because you've shared this with us, you have "Faith". You have faith that you can conquer this addiction, and by the reel of your faith will you succeed. Try surrounding yourself with uplifting people, be involved in your community, their is so much that public offers us. Even Pam said to research what programs they have where you can talk with others who may have common grounds.

I did this caregiving job for a muscle distrophy friend and she wanted to go to the AA meetings. I thought, why would she go, she doesn't even drink. I've seen how happy she was to be involved socially with people and being that she is bed ridden and I had to transfer her to an electronic wheelchair it was pretty exhausting. However, when I could see her happiness in being around people who had an addiction and encouraging them to not drink, I realized she was helping others.

Sometimes when we are involved in something that's helping others, we are not focused on ourselves and take on task that helps us to progress with others.

[Misshalfway]

Thanks everyone. It sounds like I need to figure out what my core beliefs, and values are so I have something to build on.

Misshalfway, I have considered a therapist, but I'm terrified. Thanks for reinforcing the idea.

Terrified of what?

[Misshalfway]

Thanks everyone. It sounds like I need to figure out what my core beliefs, and values are so I have something to build on.

Misshalfway, I have considered a therapist, but I'm terrified. Thanks for reinforcing the idea.

Addictions tend to flourish in isolation. At least that has been my experience. And I don't think you are alone in feeling terrified to talk to a therapist. The only reason I suggest it is because therapy is a safe zone where people can tell the truth about what's going on. But I understand if that isn't a place you'd want to go. Would you mind sharing...what exactly are you afraid of?

[KK03]

Would you mind sharing...what exactly are you afraid of?

I'm afraid that my family will some how find out. I also don't like showing that I'm weak and that I need help.

[Misshalfway]

I'm afraid that my family will some how find out. I also don't like showing that I'm weak and that I need help.

Yeah, having family find out is a real concern. I can sympathize with that one. But let's say they did find out you were seeing a therapist. Would they have to know the reason why? Lots of people are seeing therapist's. It's really no big deal. And they see them for a whole host of reasons. And most therapist's offices are unmarked. It's really quite easy to maintain confidentiality.

And about the feeling weak and needing help thing. What exactly is so "weak" about getting help? I don't know. I think it takes strength to say you are weak at something. It shows humility and self love. Not to mention that all of us are weak and need help at one time or another. It just means we are humans. So, I guess you'll just have to settle for being like the rest of us. :)

[KK03]

And about the feeling weak and needing help thing. What exactly is so "weak" about getting help? I don't know. I think it takes strength to say you are weak at something. It shows humility and self love. Not to mention that all of us are weak and need help at one time or another. It just means we are humans. So, I guess you'll just have to settle for being like the rest of us. :)

Thanks you made me laugh!

[slamjet]

... I also don't like showing that I'm weak and that I need help.

Uhm, excuse me but this, in my experience, is quite untrue. The true cowards are those who have problems, but refuse to confront them. How many times I've spoken with people who have done all kinds of bad acts, but refuse to see that they need to change. Instead, they take the easy, cowardly way out and blame everyone and everything else. To get to the point of crying out for help and accepting it takes strength. The more you accept help and better yourself, then stronger and stronger you will get until that week thing becomes a strength.

How do you view someone who has overcome all kinds of struggles in their life? They started somewhere. And that somewhere is admitting that they are powerless to their issue and are ready to struggle and grow. It sound like that's where you are at right now.

I can go on for hours but I will end with this: If someone tells you to don't be a weakling and that you don't need any help from anyone either hasn't a clue or has their head stuck in the sand. Either way, they are dead wrong.

[Misshalfway]

Thanks you made me laugh!

Well, whatever you decide. Think about therapy. Whether your problem is about sex or substance or shopping, therapists understand. The stuff that feels shameful to you, is everyday normal to them. And they know how to help people change behaviors that are pesky. It's like having the best sort of friend. They won't judge you, but they'll still tell you the truth about stuff. Whatever you do. ... don't let the fear stop you from taking your life back.

BTW....how do you know you are truly addicted? We tend to throw that word around...