How Do You Read The Bom?

[prisonchaplain]

We often hear people say, "The Bible is the literal, infallible Word of God." Others insist it is inspired, but not the dictation of God, and that some of the miracles etc. may have been more parable than historical.

So, what of the BoM, PoGP and D&C? Do you assume that every miracle happened just as it's written, or are there times when other interpretations might be considered.

As an example, in the gospels, Jesus performs a miracle of feeding 5000. Conservatives argue that Jesus literally took two loaves of bread (think big biscuits) and five small fish and fed everyone. Others have suggested that Jesus was providing an example of generosity by upholding the boy's willingness to share his food, and that everyone was inspired to share and share alike. In the end, then, there was plenty left over. "Wasn't it a greater miracle that Jesus softened their hearts, than that he performed some magic show?" such an interpretation asks?

[Alaskagain]

As for me, I read it with a literal interpretation in mind; and I read the Bible the same way. i.e, I believe Jesus made five fish become a supply of hundreds or thousands of fish.

[Guest Yediyd]

I'm just an ignorant, superstitious old fool, but I take ALL my scriptures literally, unless it is specified that it is a parrible or in the case of the vally of dry bones in Ezekiel or Lehi's vison of the rod of iron, it is specified that it was a vision.

I believe that the G-d of this universe is capable of a few miricals.

[Palerider]

We often hear people say, "The Bible is the literal, infallible Word of God." Others insist it is inspired, but not the dictation of God, and that some of the miracles etc. may have been more parable than historical.

So, what of the BoM, PoGP and D&C? Do you assume that every miracle happened just as it's written, or are there times when other interpretations might be considered.

As an example, in the gospels, Jesus performs a miracle of feeding 5000. Conservatives argue that Jesus literally took two loaves of bread (think big biscuits) and five small fish and fed everyone. Others have suggested that Jesus was providing an example of generosity by upholding the boy's willingness to share his food, and that everyone was inspired to share and share alike. In the end, then, there was plenty left over. "Wasn't it a greater miracle that Jesus softened their hearts, than that he performed some magic show?" such an interpretation asks?

I believe that if he walked on water...he also fed 5000 with 5 fish and 2 loaves of bread.

[prisonchaplain]

You're all a bunch fundies . . . you know that don't you? :-) . . . ME 2.

[Guest Yediyd]

That's a good thing, right? My father was an independant, fundamentalist, southern Baptist!!!!! I was a fundamentalist Baptist for 40 years!!!! I've been LDS for just three years.

[the Ogre]

You're all a bunch fundies . . . you know that don't you? :-) . . . ME 2.

Yup,

Do you know the Article of Faith that this replies to?

8) We believe the aBible to be the bword of God as far as it is translated ccorrectly; we also believe the dBook of Mormon to be the word of God.

This is the position stated in scriture regarding your question.

My personal opinion? I believe for the most part, the Bible is pretty close, but that some parts have been fiddled with. I believe the Book of Mormon to historical, where moral can be derived from the contents of the scripture. It is very nice to read. It is not like the Bible were there are literary sections dealing with philosophy, proverbs, and psalms. Nibley pointed out where there is some, but it isn't subdivided like the Old Testament. For the most part it is history and recorded sermons.

One of the interesting things about the Book of Mormon is the differences in voice and method of the different writers Mormon and Moroni abridge. It is interesting to see their humanness next to their piety.

Aaron the Ogre

[prisonchaplain]

So, Yed, this joke is just between you and me, then. :-)

Central Bible College (CBC = Pentecostal) and Bible Baptist College (BBC = Bible Baptist Fellowship, a near twin to independent baptists) were in the heat of their great annual rivalry basket ball game. The CBC cheer leaders began their taunt:

We've got Spirit, yes we do, we've got Spirit, how 'bout you?!!!"

The poor BBC cheerleaders were dumbfounded and deeply perplexed. Finally, the came up with a response:

Well, uh...we've got the Bible.

[Guest Yediyd]

So, Yed, this joke is just between you and me, then. :-)

Central Bible College (CBC = Pentecostal) and Bible Baptist College (BBC = Bible Baptist Fellowship, a near twin to independent baptists) were in the heat of their great annual rivalry basket ball game. The CBC cheer leaders began their taunt:

We've got Spirit, yes we do, we've got Spirit, how 'bout you?!!!"

The poor BBC cheerleaders were dumbfounded and deeply perplexed. Finally, the came up with a response:

Well, uh...we've got the Bible.

LOL!!!!!!

Think we should explain that to our non-baptist friends?

I've actually been in BOTH churches while I was searching for the "truth". The pentecostals drove me nuts!!!!

[the_jason]

God is not a God of confusion. When Jesus speaks in a parable, he tells us so. Otherwise, His words are to be taken literally.

[pushka]

We often hear people say, "The Bible is the literal, infallible Word of God." Others insist it is inspired, but not the dictation of God, and that some of the miracles etc. may have been more parable than historical.

So, what of the BoM, PoGP and D&C? Do you assume that every miracle happened just as it's written, or are there times when other interpretations might be considered.

As an example, in the gospels, Jesus performs a miracle of feeding 5000. Conservatives argue that Jesus literally took two loaves of bread (think big biscuits) and five small fish and fed everyone. Others have suggested that Jesus was providing an example of generosity by upholding the boy's willingness to share his food, and that everyone was inspired to share and share alike. In the end, then, there was plenty left over. "Wasn't it a greater miracle that Jesus softened their hearts, than that he performed some magic show?" such an interpretation asks?

Im not sure what I believe any more, but I do like the sound of that interpretation of the Feeding of the 5,000, that Jesus could have been illustrating the concept of sharing..sounds nice. :)

[Dr T]

"God is not a God of confusion." I've heard that a lot. Can you give me the reference for that idea again please? Thank you

[prisonchaplain]

Think we should explain that to our non-baptist friends?

I've actually been in BOTH churches while I was searching for the "truth". The penticastals drove me nuts!!!!

Sure, why not? Independent/Bible, and even most Southern Baptists are opposed to Pentecostalism. The most hardcore believe that modern ecstatic "gifts of the Spirit" are actually demonic. Others are willing to chalk it up to misguided emotionalism, based on false teaching.

So...they are loathe to worship in any way that appears overly demonstrative.

Thus, when the cheerleaders are excitedly chanting about having spirit, the reaction is to clutch their Bibles and say, "No no...not us!"

[Dale]

My own study of evidences for or against it's historicity hasn't led me to believe it's historical. I am open to it being historical if conclusive evidence was ever brought forth in it's behalf. What I have seen seem's to be not beyond question.

[Guest Yediyd]

<div class='quotemain'>

Think we should explain that to our non-baptist friends?

I've actually been in BOTH churches while I was searching for the "truth". The Pentecostals drove me nuts!!!!

Sure, why not? Independent/Bible, and even most Southern Baptists are opposed to Pentecostalism. The most hardcore believe that modern ecstatic "gifts of the Spirit" are actually demonic. Others are willing to chalk it up to misguided emotionalism, based on false teaching.

So...they are loathe to worship in any way that appears overly demonstrative.

Thus, when the cheerleaders are excitedly chanting about having spirit, the reaction is to clutch their Bibles and say, "No no...not us!" That about sums it up! My dad used to say: Listen to music that will move your soul, not your body!!! I did try to go to a Pentecostal church...They scared me!!!! And it felt phony to me. Like it was all a big show!! I don't mean to put your faith down...just my experience...The fundamentalist Baptist, on the other hand...were too into guilt trips and the turn or burn mentality...I am happy at LDS, I feel like I have come home at long last!!!!!

[Traveler]

My whole life I have been interested, fascinated and curious about scripture. Perhaps mine is a different view. I have found that scripture have given me comfort in times of war, joy when overwhelmed with sorrow, stability during times of disruption and change, strength when I was weak and could not go on and reflection and quiet in times of great reward and joy.

When I was 13 I started verse by verse in the Bible writing down what I thought the verse meant and why G-d bothered to give us that particular piece of scripture. It took me over 10 years to complete the Bible, Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price and Doctrine and Covenants. My scripture journal is one of my most precious treasures. I often refer to that work still as one of the most inspired references to explain any scripture. Yet most of that study was done without the help of the education I now have.

I have found my training in science is help greatly by scripture – I also find that my understanding of scripture is helped greatly by science.

My biggest disappointment associated with scripture is when I hear someone say the meaning of such and such a scripture is => what ever specific thing they think. I do not think that the scriptures have any single meaning or understanding. I believe the scriptures are like an onion that has many layers of meaning. As we peel back one layer only to discover another.

Let me give an example: Consider the story or epoch of Israel coming out of Egypt to the Promised Land. I find much is such scripture that plays in politics and government, I find much to be learned about what the L-rd has done and the great miracles in times past. I also find it as an outline of my own life and struggle to leave the world behind and find my way to a Promised Land. I find the story makes sense as me thinking of myself as the children of Israel or in addressing others as Moses. I find the same scriptures insightful in understanding covenants and the logic of ordinances and temples. I find the scriptures as an infinite resource but at the same time I do not believe the Scriptures as the silver bullet that solves every problem. Nor do I believe that any expert has any more insight to the scriptures than I have right to or anyone else. I believe the prophets and servants of G-d will teach principles by which we can understand scripture but I believe I should be able to draw from scripture what G-d intends for me.

Those that live scripture will know what is of G-d and what is of man. I have exception respect for the Book of Mormon. No doubt in my mind the miracles of scripture are true at many levels – I have seen with my own eyes and know as well as anything can be known that miracles can and do occur. And what I know of miracles I find no compelling reason to convince others of anything – I am quite humbled to keep such things in my heart to share on very rare occasion and without fanfare.

The Traveler

[prisonchaplain]

My favorite pastor of all time was a Bible Baptist College graduate (adult convert), who, after serving a mission in Indonesia, came back stymied. The Baptists were engaging in 'spiritual warfare"--rebuking demons and the like. They said, either do this, or be useless.

So, on his furlough, he drives into a pentecostal church, and goes to ask the pastor, "What all this is about." At the first mention of "experience," he was ready to let him have (Baptists are all about the Word of God--not personal experiences). Turns out, the pastor explained it well, and this Bible Baptist came into Pentecost.

He did the right thing and resigned his commission. He became a "mission church" pastor, and we joined his church. That guy would lead worship for an hour, then preach for an hour. The time flew, because he had such a powerful love for the Spirit and the Word.

[the_jason]

"God is not a God of confusion." I've heard that a lot. Can you give me the reference for that idea again please? Thank you

"For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints." 1 Cor. 14: 33

[Dr T]

Thank you The Jason. Is that passage talking about prophecy and people doing things that are not biblical and then calling it of God? God would be consistent and not sent out different messages. What is your take on that passage?

[Guest Yediyd]

Thank you The Jason. Is that passage talking about prophecy and people doing things that are not biblical and then calling it of God? God would be consistent and not sent out different messages. What is your take on that passage?

I know you didn't ask me, but my take on that passage is: G-d was telling the members of the church to get together and be united in what they were teaching, because hie church was not meant to teach many doctrines, but one...he is not the author of confusion...Satan is. Paul was reprimanding the leaders of the churches . (in my opinon)

[the_jason]

My take on the passage is just what it says. God does not cause confusion. Man causes confusion.

"For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work." James 3: 16

[Gabelma]

I personally believe Jesus was capable of feeding the 5000 from 5 loaves and 2 fishes. I don't know if its all 100% accurate but I do know there is nothing wrong with me reading it literally. Same goes for the Book of Mormon - I have yet to read anything that convinces me it didn't happen so I will obey the teachings and imagine the people as real people unless the Lord himself tells me otherwise lol If I am honest its not a question I tend to consider very often - I read it and take it as literal but I do with the New Testament as well. the Old Testament I tend to struggle more with. But I am much further removed from Stone Age man I think its more a lack of understanding and empathy than of taking it literally.

Charley

[Dr T]

Thank you for both of your thoughts on that. :)

[Gabelma]

My whole life I have been interested, fascinated and curious about scripture. Perhaps mine is a different view. I have found that scripture have given me comfort in times of war, joy when overwhelmed with sorrow, stability during times of disruption and change, strength when I was weak and could not go on and reflection and quiet in times of great reward and joy.

When I was 13 I started verse by verse in the Bible writing down what I thought the verse meant and why G-d bothered to give us that particular piece of scripture. It took me over 10 years to complete the Bible, Book of Mormon, Pearl of Great Price and Doctrine and Covenants. My scripture journal is one of my most precious treasures. I often refer to that work still as one of the most inspired references to explain any scripture. Yet most of that study was done without the help of the education I now have.

I have found my training in science is help greatly by scripture – I also find that my understanding of scripture is helped greatly by science.

My biggest disappointment associated with scripture is when I hear someone say the meaning of such and such a scripture is => what ever specific thing they think. I do not think that the scriptures have any single meaning or understanding. I believe the scriptures are like an onion that has many layers of meaning. As we peel back one layer only to discover another.

What an absolutely fantastic idea thank you if I start now I may just do it by time I am 41 lol - I did something similar chapter by chapter in the Book of Mormon and it was fantastic, I had been baptised 13 years when i realised that whilst I had always assued the Book of Mormon was the word of God I had never actually asked him, and began to build my testimony chapter by chapter.

I agree with your other 2 paragraphs - I found my education is greatly enriched by having a bench mark to refer too - without it there are too many ifs, buts, maybes and whys. And also that as I grow scriptures mean different things to me - I was not wrong before just my understanding increased. Kind of like when I studied physics at degree level they told me to more or less forget what I had learned at school - or when I studied history I discovered dates and timlines that were accepter at school were debatable at uni.

I need the scripture in my life to be very much the iron rod and unbendable because the more I learn in my studies the less I actually know about anything.

Charley

[Annabelli]

GS Miracle

An extraordinary event caused by the power of God. Miracles are an important element in the work of Jesus Christ. They include healings, restoring the dead to life, and resurrection. Miracles are a part of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Faith is necessary in order for miracles to be manifested (Mark 6: 5-6; Morm. 9: 10-20; Ether 12: 12).

We often refer to Blessings rather than Miracles. Blessings can be small or largely significant. Miracles are reserved for for the Lord and no one else will ever have the power to perform a miracle.

Reverence is a state of Faith when you no longer hear the cry of a baby, a weeping speaker, or the shuffling of footsteps coming and going.

Blessings are usually manifested by inspirations for someone to act and be given the privilege to help someone.