Old friends

[An Investigator]

Hi,

I'm just wondering if anyone has any advice about visiting pubs/bars.  At the moment I've avoided them but my friend's outside the Church really like spending time in them, most of them drink and smoke.   I miss hanging out with them, I don't think many people in my ward would visit them unless it was a restaurant.  Is this a Lds thing? Are we advised to avoid these places even if we are drinking soft drinks?  

[Guest MormonGator]

Depends on the quality of your friendships. If they pressure you to smoke and drink, then you might want to find new friends. If the accept your new life choices and are supportive, than by all means go to the pub. 

[An Investigator]

No pressure I'm too old for that,  maybe it's just people in the ward tend to hang out with other people in the ward.

[zil]

The short version of my answer is that it's just fine for you to hang out in the pub with your friends as long as it doesn't hinder your spiritual life in any way (which it certainly doesn't have to).

Long version:

1. The appearance of evil.  This might be the most common concern.  People see a known Mormon go into a bar and they start jumping to ridiculous conclusions about what that Mormon is doing in there.  To avoid the possibility that someone will reject investigation of the church on such grounds, many folks avoid the appearance.
2. If you struggle with avoiding drinking, don't make your life harder (whoever you are, member or not).
3. What @MormonGator said.
4. Life-long Mormons, depending on lots of details, may not have friends who frequent bars.  Their friends who do may never invite them because it's known Mormons don't drink.
5. Personally, while moderate drinking on the part of others wouldn't bother me, I would not want to be in the middle of a smoke-filled room.  (I like my lungs and am hoping they'll stay pink a long time.   )
6. I've had mixed experiences:
   • In high school, my employer sent me across the street to a bar to get change (we were out).  It was dark inside and every person in there looked miserable.  It was enough to convince me I wanted nothing to do with such places.
   • In Moscow, the embassy had its own bar inside.  I would go there sometimes with friends.  No one thought for a minute that my orange juice was anything but orange juice - though we made jokes about it.  I was not spiritually damaged by the experience.
   • Also in Moscow, I went to a farewell party for someone who was returning home (at their apartment, inside the embassy compound).  Everyone but the Mormons got plastered.  My plastered friends thought they were having fun and everything was hilarious.  They weren't having fun.  It wasn't hilarious.  Another friend and I walked the two of them home (at separate times).  Not sure they would have made it otherwise.  Again, no one thought I was doing anything against my religion because they knew me well.  Again, I wasn't harmed by the experience (though it wasn't much of a party).
     • I do have an amusing story of one of the walks home, if someone wants to hear it.  The other walk home was just pitiful (he wanted to steal a case of Pepsi - while a security camera was looking down at him; then he got all vulgar and literally licked photos of his wife, while crying (his wife was alive and well, just not present at the time, there were no problems in his marriage, no idea why he was crying) - it was kinda sad).
   • So, you know, I reckon it depends on what kind of experiences you're going to have. 

[Guest MormonGator]

20 minutes ago, An Investigator said:

No pressure I'm too old for that,  maybe it's just people in the ward tend to hang out with other people in the ward.

 Yes, they do. I have noticed that as well. It's partially because people generally hang out with those who share their views/morals and it's partially because LDS communities tend to be somewhat closed off to the outside world sometimes. That is not an insult, it's the same with most religions from Jewish-Muslim-Whatever. 

 It's also changing-more and more LDS all over the world are reaching out to the outside world via the internet, etc.  

[Guest MormonGator]

Just to add: I go to concerts/restaurants all the time where my friends and family drink (and at concerts I am sure partake in other non-LDS approved activities) and it's totally fine. Most of my LDS friends live several states away and I'm not going to become a recluse. So you aren't alone at all OP. 

[zil]

5 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

I'm not going to become a recluse

Hey!  Stop dissing recluses (recli? reclusi? whatever)!  We have great lives!  And we appreciate you other people who keep all the other other people from bothering us while we reclude - so be nice.  

[Guest]

Sometimes its because of what people tend to do while drinking and smoking.  I personally have a great aversion to tobacco smoke -- except for Cuban cigars.  But that's another story.

As far as the drinking... I had a friend who was a moderate drinker.  But he invited me to a bar once.  I didn't drink.  He drank moderately.  But his other friend drank until he was slobbering drunk.  This really was not a pleasant experience for me.

I went to a company Christmas party.  They specifically gave a couple of tickets to each employee for free drinks.  I gave mine to a co-worker who knew I was LDS.  He only drank a few and could hold his liquor well.  However, at least a handful of people (most of whom I worked with personally) got very drunk.  So drunk that other drinkers were commenting on them the next day.

This was not a pleasant experience.  My avoidance of such events has little to do with my faith or observance of the WoW.  I just don't find watching this behavior very enjoyable.

[Guest MormonGator]

@Carborendum, come on. We all know you don't have any friends. 

(just playing my friend. Get it? Get it!? Haw haw haw!) 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

@Carborendum, come on. We all know you don't have any friends. 

I once looked up my family name on one of those websites that tells you how many people share your family name.  The result was:  Zero.

No wonder I haven't spoken much with my family lately.  They don't exist.

[Guest MormonGator]

4 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

No wonder I haven't spoken much with my family lately.  They don't exist.

A cousin posted a childhood photo on Facebook of one side of my family. Out of the 11 kids, 10 were smiling and having fun. One looked like he would rather be anywhere but there.

I'll leave it to your imagination why I haven't spoken much to my family either.  

[zil]

5 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

A cousin posted a childhood photo on Facebook of one side of my family. Out of the 11 kids, 10 were smiling and having fun. One looked like he would rather be anywhere but there.

I'll leave it to your imagination why I haven't spoken much to my family either.  

See?  You should have become a recluse. Then you could spend your time making up words like "Reclusiatti" (complete with a logo / seal / shield / motto / mascot, and a fancy font - cuz, you know, you'll have plenty of time for that sort of thing).

[An Investigator]

Thanks for the replies I really love hanging about with people in the ward but my friend's share my dark sense of humour more and my love of 80s metal ?.  

My friends won't be getting blind drunk but will insist on sitting outside on the smoking patio cough cough lol, then we are going for Mexican ?

I'm doing my visiting teaching before we meet up too so it's definitely going to be a game of two halves ?

 

[Guest MormonGator]

6 minutes ago, An Investigator said:

 friend's share my dark sense of humour more and my love of 80s metal ?.  

 

Dark sense of humor and 80's metal? This could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship @An Investigator!!!! 

[zil]

7 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Dark sense of humor and 80's metal? This could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship @An Investigator!!!! 

Oh, great.  Another application to process.  I think I might need a raise.

[An Investigator]

1 hour ago, MormonGator said:

Dark sense of humor and 80's metal? This could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship @An Investigator!!!! 

Oooh what bands do you like?  I'm a big crue fan.. I saw their last ever tour last year and the drum roller-coaster.   I also went to work for Halloween last year as a pregnant Gene Simmons ?

Edited September 14, 2016 by An Investigator

[Guest MormonGator]

8 minutes ago, An Investigator said:

Oooh what bands do you like?  I'm a big crue fan.. I saw their last ever tour last year and the drum roller-coaster.   I also went to work last year as a pregnant Gene Simmons ?

I have been known to listen to Kiss from time to time.  Ask @mirkwood, he knows. 

The beautiful LadyGator and I went to a Bret Michaels concert a few months ago. It was fantastic to see him again after some heath setbacks. It was a short concert (only about 45 minutes) but it was fantastic. 

Other than that I like Poison, Crue, Firehouse, Kix, and several other hair bands. My personal favorites are metal and punk. Anvil, Megadeth, Metallica, The Ramones, Pistols and Dead Kennedys. There are many more, of course!

Edited September 14, 2016 by MormonGator

[An Investigator]

I love the Ramones also The Cramps, Crass (bit naughty I know), Uncle Sam, Blondie, Rage Against the Machine, Mike Oldfield, LA Guns,  Stiff Little Fingers and Alice Cooper...  Loads of others too.

[Guest MormonGator]

4 minutes ago, An Investigator said:

I love the Ramones also The Cramps, Crass (bit naughty I know), Uncle Sam, Blondie, Rage Against the Machine, Mike Oldfield, LA Guns,  Stiff Little Fingers and Alice Cooper...  Loads of others too.

 All fantastic choices. Like we all know, Stiff Little Fingers influenced so many bands yet they are criminally unknown in the states. 

[An Investigator]

Yeah I have inflammable material on vinyl... Although my family are big Irish decent Catholics so it's well hidden ?

Edited September 14, 2016 by An Investigator

[zil]

10 hours ago, zil said:

See?  You should have become a recluse. Then you could spend your time making up words like "Reclusiatti" (complete with a logo / seal / shield / motto / mascot, and a fancy font - cuz, you know, you'll have plenty of time for that sort of thing).

@MormonGator: Admit it.  Now you're jealous:

[bytebear]

Become the designated driver.  Watch out that your friends don't over do it, and be an example.  I have a reputation of being the sober one in some of my business circles, and it ends up being a little about being a Mormon, and more about being someone they can rely on.

[Sunday21]

I am also the designated driver! I go to bars and drink coke. No problem!

Edited September 16, 2016 by Sunday21

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Sunday21 said:

I am also the designated driver! I go to bars and drink coke. No problem!

SINNER! 

[Guest MormonGator]

OP-LadyGator and I were talking about this last night. She made the very good point that sometimes old friends grow apart. After you've matured it is sometimes harder to rekindle old friendships. I've experienced this in my life first hand. I used to feel very guilty that my childhood friends have drifted apart. Then when I re-connected with them on Facebook, etc I began to understand that there is a reason for that. We have little in common as adults. It's not a sad thing at all-my friendships as an adult are much deeper and more enjoyable than they ever were when I was a kid. 

Just something to think about. 

Edited September 29, 2016 by MormonGator