DennisTate

Could the HOLY SPIRIT be YHWH the Mother?

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Here is an article by a Latter day Saint that gives us some background on this idea:

 

 

Temple Vision as a Catalyst to Theological Convergence: Ecumenical Renewal in a Post-Ecumenical EraMichelle G. Wiener

 
 
 
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Abstract The modern Ecumenical Movement actively seeks to establish visible unity among all Christendom. How this is to eventually take shape remains a mystery. Historically, there are four methods by which this process is understood: (1) Faith and Order, (2) Life and Work, (3) Common missionary efforts, and (4) A renewed commitment to theological education. Nevertheless, the search for visible unity remains problematic, when taking into account the further divisions that exist in the sacramental life of the Church, as the Lima 1982 Baptism, Eucharist and Ministry (BEM) document examines. The reality remains that the Church is nowhere closer to achieving the visible unity for which Jesus prayed in John 17:21. But what if we are not looking in the right place? What is the answer has been reiterated throughout the Scriptures all along – hidden in plain sight? The Temple, with its cube-shaped Holy of Holies, can provide a catalyst through which, not only visible unity, but a wider theological convergence, is achieved. As this essay will argue, Temple vision can become a catalyst to achieving the mystical unity for which Jesus prayed, as consistent with Christ’s ecumenical imperative. In our increasingly technological world that is looking for mystical connections of a deeper nature, this may very well be what the world needs today. Keywords: Temple, Visible Unity, Ecumenical, Theological Convergence DOI: 10.7176/JPCR/48-04 Publication date:March 31st 2020
 
1. Ecumenical Convergence in Crisis The modern Ecumenical Movement is characterized by a search for visible unity. However, the difficulty in defining this term sparks much debate within ecumenical circles, considering the manifold “diversities which are rooted in theological traditions.”1 Historically, this search for visible unity has been known to take shape in one of four ways: (1) Faith and Order, or a common theology, (2) Life and Work, or a common commitment to social justice, (3) Collective missiological/missionary efforts, and (4) A renewed commitment to theological education. Additionally, as the 1982 Faith and Order Commission Lima document affirms, each denomination experiences further division in their practices related to Baptism, Eucharist and Ministry (BEM) with much of the debate surrounding the issue of proper authority to administer within the “constitutionally or canonically ordered”2 sacramental life of individual denominations. What becomes lost in this debate pertaining to visible unity is a lack of focus on the visible aspects of being unified. Further division results from the very act of debate itself. There seems to be no clear pathway for fully realizing Church Unity in accordance with Christ’s ecumenical imperative outlined in John 17:21, “so that the world may believe.” The Church has found itself in a postecumenical age; thus, it “requires the renewal of ecumenical vision.”3 The reality is the world stands in disbelief when it looks at what has become of the Christian Church, with so many divisions and theological disagreements. Is there a key to visible unity? Or has the focus shifted in another direction – that of a wider mystical convergence? Temple Vision can provide a catalyst through which, not only visible unity, but a wider theological convergence, is achieved, as consistent with the deeper mystical unity for which Jesus prayed, as outlined in John 17:21.
 
 
1.1 The Search for Mystical Unity The newly emerging academic field of Temple Theology offers insight into the true nature of Christ’s ministry while on earth, which finds continuity in the life of the Body of Christ today in anticipation of the final eschaton, with the cosmic Temple – the New Jerusalem – descending from heaven in the form of a cube, as recorded in Revelation 21. In fact, as will be argued, mystical unity is found within the image of the cube itself as it stands as a testament to the unified nature of the Divine Reality in accordance with Jesus’ prayer for unity in which he prayed for us to be joined with him as he is joined with his Father. This mystical unity culminates in the cubeshaped Holy of Holies, or inner sanctum, as it was originally housed in the inner sanctum of King Solomon’s Temple. Referencing Isaiah 66:1, New Testament scholar Gregory K. Beale explains, “the holy of holies
represented the invisible heavenly temple and throne of God…and it was the actual place where the heavenly dimensions extended down to earth.”4 Thus, it was the dwelling place of the Divine Council and the place where divine planning took place. In this respect, the cube-shaped Holy of Holies becomes a visible sign of the mystical unity for which Jesus Christ prayed as he was nostalgically looking back to a Temple long ago destroyed by the Babylonians in 587BCE. Seeing the corruption in the refurbished Temple of King Herod, Jesus was not only lamenting an earlier time in Israel’s history, but was looking forward to the day when the cosmic heavenly Temple would be revealed to a creation longing for renewal, both on a cosmic level, and in real time.
 
1.1.1 Alternative Models In a world that is looking for alternative forms of spirituality transcending a strictly ‘biblical’ model, this search for a visible, mystical unity becomes all the more necessary, especially within our increasing technological age. Today, people are searching for a connection to the spirit realm, with a need to see unity in nature and the search for life after death. This is evidenced by the recent obsession in our culture with Near Death Experiences (NDE), reincarnation, meditation and God-realization, Gaia Consciousness, various methods of divination, and even goddess spirituality. What was once called ‘New Age’ spirituality has resurfaced and recycled itself for a new era in the form of neo-Gnosticism. While New Age/neo-Gnosticism appears on a surface level to be antithetical to the Bible, it really is not when considered in light of all the Temple has to offer. Neo-Gnosticism delves into the mystery in such a way that biblical Christianity would never dare. Nevertheless, such powerful spiritual connections exist historically in the Temple construct, which is both biblically-based and deeply mystical in approach. The spiritual and practical implications are rather astounding when considered in light of the cubeshaped Holy of Holies, which becomes a catalyst for the convergence of all things; moreover, echoing back to “the Unity of Day One”5 of creation in its original state in the presence of the unified Heavenly Hosts. It is precisely the Heavenly Host that represents the mystical unity of which Jesus speaks."
 
1.1.2 Returning to the Source In King Solomon’s original Temple, the Heavenly Hosts existed beyond the veil. Temple theologian Margaret Barker argues that the reason for this is the members of the angelic hosts— or the Divine Council – are all derived from the same source, as “the unity within the holy of holies meant that all the angels were derived from the One.”6 This is evidenced by the fact that the Veil, which was woven from blue, scarlet and purple, included engravings of the Heavenly Host and served as a boundary between this world and the next. The area behind the veil represents a singularity of purpose in the Divine Presence. The High Priest who enters through the veil is then transformed in the Presence of the Divine Council and becomes an exalted being endowed with power from on high for the purpose of returning, or being “sent out into the great hall of the temple,”7 both to bless and proclaim restoration and renewal to the outside world, inclusive of both the visible creation and broken humanity. Within the Temple is found the possibility of God-realization and eventual apotheosis, or exaltation through which humanity can become ‘like God,’ much like New Age/neo-Gnostic spirituality seeks to do. This is a clear reversal of the curse reiterated by the serpent in Genesis 3:5 through which humanity seeks to attain godlike status through foolish pride. In his prayer for unity, the Great High Priest is calling us to forsake the cares of this world and join him in affirmation of that essential unity through the transformative power of the Atonement. Apotheosis remains a collective, as well as an individual effort.
 
..... (Dr. Michelle Weiner)


 

 

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Not in LDS teaching.

Gender is an eternal characteristic of the God and the Godhead is Male - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all male.  Heavenly Mother who is The Father's eternal companion is female.

In any case, this topic is addressed here:  

 

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39 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Not in LDS teaching.

Gender is an eternal characteristic of the God and the Godhead is Male - Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all male.  Heavenly Mother who is The Father's eternal companion is female.

In any case, this topic is addressed here:  

 

I began to question this after reading the near death experience account of Mr. Christian Andreason:

Christian Andreason, chapter two:

http://www.allaboutchristian.com/spirituality/

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What do you think is the true gender of God?

In all honesty, I always dislike being asked this, because the answer is always as complicated as the question.

But I will answer by saying that I deeply believe and intuit God to be a Being who is beyond human comprehension and understanding.  I see God existing as One who encompasses absolutely everything that exists on a atomic or energetic levelyet even with all that, I know there is WAY more!  

God also represents all timethe past, present and future that we are each existing in as a unique personality and while all this is going on, at the same timeGod also has an infinite and distinct personality. 

But even "God", as a "Persona" or "Presence" is still way beyond our comprehension.  So what do we humans' do to try to understand this Persona or Presence?we try to compare it to our own!  And usually this boils down to us putting "God" as a gender or form we are personally comfortable seeing in a seat of control.  From a conscious viewpoint in regard to gender: some men and women do not trust women, so they consistently see God only as a man.  Some women and men do not trust men, so they consistently see God only as a woman.  Yet, when looking at God from Divine viewpoint you must realize that in truth, as God exists in such a state of Totality, it stands to reason that "God" (in His or Her absolute form) is completely genderlessand exists for all of us an unlimited amount of faces and images. 

However,  now that I have pointed all this out, I want to say that I full-well know that their are very definite, discernable energies that come from God that we can sense as being either masculine or feminine.  Because of this, I believe that God (in personality) speaks or reveals Him/Her Self to us using a voicing and/or image (whether masculine or feminine) that we most relate to or need to experience at the time.

When I was a child, I was most comfortable with seeing God literally as my "Heavenly Father" and I would hear from Him speaking to me with a voice I can only think to call male.  Even today, with my enlightened way of seeing and thinking about God,  I am still often comforted by a vision of God as a kind, strong, older man.  Especially as it is becoming more obvious that we are living in a world where there is so little well-balanced male leadership and honest-to-goodness integrity!" (Christian Andreason, chapter 2)

 

 

Edited by DennisTate
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Back in the 1990's I read articles on String Theory and it intrigued me that Stephen Hawking Ph. D. was struggling to fit GRAVITY into the Grand Unified Theory of Space and Time that he was working on.

One possible answer could be that there might actually be TWO fundamental energy force...... one  perhaps like Super Strings (light) and the other perhaps like Super Waves. (gravity).

Messiah Yeshua - Jesus stated emphatically that the Ancient of Days The Father was greater than him and was doing the miracles but.......  when Messiah Yeshua - Jesus stated that his disciples were better off with The Comforter, The Holy Spirit..... was he not saying that The Holy Spirit was also in a sense greater than him for the disciples to be better off with the Holy Spirit in them rather than to continue to have Messiah Yeshua - Jesus there with them???

 

 

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/gender/g1.htm
 

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"Pulling and gravitation, which resemble basic feminine traits, are the dominant properties of the magnetic loop. Consequently, magnetic loops have a capacity for storing energy and act to maintain the structural integrity of the entire wave formation. The electronic/energetic loop consists of expanding properties that disperse energetic matter that “disappears” into space. This is synonymous with masculine characteristics." (Dr. Chaim Tejman)

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Here is Messiah Yeshua - Jesus stating clearly that The Ancient of Days the Father was and is greater than Him:

John 14:10  "Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."

This statements sure sounds to me like Messiah Yeshua - Jesus was saying that The Holy Spirit was also greater than Him:

Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

 

But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:

 

But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

 

And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Dr. Michael Yaegar found his experience to be really scary.... actually terrifying... and who could blame him, but nonetheless what he reports being shown does remind us of some statements by Messiah Yeshua - Jesus.

 

 

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A VISION of HELL Gehenna - HADES - SHEOL. It is Eternal Torment!

Dr. Michael Yeager, on the verge of suicide and with a knife to his wrist a fear hit him which he now recognizes as the fear of God. He dropped his knife and went to his knees and asked the Lord to forgive him of his sins and he gave his life to the Lord.

He was immediately freed from all addictions and was given a desire to tell others about Jesus. What stuck out to me the most is that he said that selfishness is the beginning of being on the pathway to hell. He mentions things like being obsessed with TV watching, sports and anything else we love more than God, as very dangerous and can place us on the wrong path.

One night when in prayer he received a vision of hell and the floor of his room opened up he kept falling down and down in a deep dark hole for miles and miles. It was very real and he could see, touch, smell, feel everything. Fear was filling his whole being.

A wind was blowing from this hole that seemed to be bottomless and the odor was so strong it was sickening. By looking between his feet he could see a distant orange glow. As he approached this orange glow it became bigger and bigger and he then entered a cavern and he was over a huge area of what looked like lava sending flames hundreds of feet into the air. Earth shattering explosions could also be heard. He knew he was still about 10,000 feet above this burning sea and even at that distance the heat was almost too much to bear and it felt like his skin was actually burning off.




The smell was so nauseating that it made him cough and gasp for air but there was none. His ears than began to be filled with a very eerie sound that sounded like humming. This sound was constant and got louder and louder as he approached the lava. God opened his understanding as to what the sound was. The sound was actually human beings screaming in unbelievable agony. He realized that God was showing him a vision of hell.

At about 200 feet above this lake of lava, fire and brimstone, the pain got almost too much to bear. He then saw some objects bobbing up and down in this burning sea of what looked like lava. There were tens of thousands of these objects. These objects were actually human beings bobbing up and down and back and forth. These people were weeping and wailing in extreme agony.

No relief from pain was available to them. Their bodies were burned black in this sea of fire and brimstone. Suddenly he plunged into the lava and it covered him and filled his eyes, nose throat, lungs etc. His eyes felt like they were being consumed out of their sockets and could barely breathe. He finds it difficult to explain the amount of pain he was experiencing. He also knew hell was eternal and no chance of getting out.

He was shown that selfishness is the gateway to hell. Excruciating pain overtook him fully as he was submerged in this sea of fire and brimstone that looked like lava. As he was sucked down into this sea he was in total darkness with no light at all. He was suffocating and could not take a breath but yet he was not dying. When he returned to the surface he realized that he was till intact and his five senses were very much alive.

There were other creatures in the sea of fire that looked like huge worms. They would come to the surface and then disappear and then return to the surface. About 20 feet from him he saw them coming to the surface and they were coming towards him. When they reached him they began boring into him and went inside his body and brain and were coming out of his eyes. They were driving him insane. (where the worm dieth not) There is no end to these things in hell. They are eternal. There is no place to go for any relief. There is no love there. It is totally void of love. An emptiness beyond comprehension enveloped him.

Although there were many, many others there, there were no communications whatsoever. Your memory is also there still with you and you can remember everything that went on in your life, including each time the Gospel was presented to you and you refused.

He then was gripped with an intense thirst. There was no way to quench this thirst. (rich man and Lazarus) If the message of the Gospel is rejected you will be forever tormented in hell like the Bible so clearly says. The voice of God then echoed across the sea of fire and brimstone and lava telling hell to release him and he was returned back to his room. " (Dr. Michael Yeager)

 

Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

 

Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
 
Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
Edited by DennisTate
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48 minutes ago, DennisTate said:

I began to question this after reading the near death experience account of Mr. Christian Andreason:

Christian Andreason, chapter two:

http://www.allaboutchristian.com/spirituality/

 

Well, if he would take some time to talk to the missionaries and consult with the Holy Spirit about it, he just might get an inkling of how limited his understanding of God is when stabbing in the dark.

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This topic seems to be important to me because it looks to me like Latter day Saints are one  of the only groups capable of leading the charge against the Atheistic control over higher education.  

A branch of Theistic Evolutionary Theory that addresses the possibility of women ALSO being in the image of the Elohim or YHWH the Mother who may perhaps be The Comforter.... is an angle on this that could get many people interested.  I tried my best to summarize the topic at CarbonBias.blogspot   .ca/

 

The writings of Chaim Henry Tejman M. D. could become a big part of textbooks on a Theistic Version of Evolutionary Theory that has YHWH and / or the Heavenly Father and / or The Comforter - The Holy Spirit evolving........

and then after the Seven Spirits of YHWH, (but they may be twins, one male and one female).... speak in Genesis 1:26 and 27 then we have YHWH in a position to create human life in their own image.

"And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.  So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

 

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/fund/fund3.htm
 

"The swirling and spinning motion creates circular formations. To finish
constructing the wave, the energetic matter must complete two semi-circular rounds. The figures are executed perpendicular to each other, and their energetic paths are in a state of superposition. The closed formation allows the energetic matter to move along closed energetic paths and maintain its energetic matter. It creates two internal swirls (vortices), which are neither identical nor symmetrical. In other words, the same type of energetic matter that moves along a common path that is shared by both swirls within a particular wave formation. Nevertheless, the swirls do not contain equal amounts of energy even in units with the same amount of space." (Dr. Chaim Tejman)

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/book/life1.htm
 

"The essential matter from which our universe is created is energetic matter. It behaves like living matter, creating every known entity, including living objects and even thought (which occurs through energetic matter–wave interaction). The essential structure of energetic matter is high-energy (concentrated energetic matter) electro-magnetic waves (picture above). This simple structure is the basis of everything: every energetic formation and the universe. In picture 2, we see that the DNA (double helix) of all living formations has the same structure as waves: two loops of the same energetic matter, behaving according to the same rules." (Dr. Chaim Tejman)

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12 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Well, if he would take some time to talk to the missionaries and consult with the Holy Spirit about it, he just might get an inkling of how limited his understanding of God is when stabbing in the dark.

I could be wrong.... I often am.... but I do have the impression that those people who have a brush with death come back with a level of humility..... and selflessness.... and drive to reach out to the lost...... and real wisdom to do the job given to them that could be coopted by the Latter day Saints church to make her outreach even more effective. 

When the possibility of Ezekiel chapter thirty seven happening again and again and again and again and again is factored into the whole formula......  we can begin to get our heads around this controversial but profoundly encouraging possibility:

(Time is an invention..... time did not always exist and actually could not exist until Space was created.  One seventh of earth time was made for man in the form of The Sabbath, so what about the other six sevenths, were they made for mankind as well????  If so....  then the LDS teachings related to there being genuine hope for repentance and even preaching in Hades or Sheol........ sure begins to make more sense?!)

And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

 

https://www.near-death.com/experiences/exceptional/christian-andreason.html#a04h

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h. Who goes to heaven?
 

In the end ... believe it or not (sigh of relief), everyone gets to come home! Heaven is a place of ultimate LOVE. When we have learned how to become individuals that base our entire existence and consciousness around manifesting LOVE, we then become capable of entering the domain of the higher Realms of Heaven. If we do not practice Love, we can only go so far and we will be made to incarnate somewhere out there in God's super Universe again and again (unlimited times) until we learn.

 

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20 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

Well, if he would take some time to talk to the missionaries and consult with the Holy Spirit about it, he just might get an inkling of how limited his understanding of God is when stabbing in the dark.

Here is one of the possibilities that is in my head......

a well financed series of films done by Latter day Saints interviewers..... with near death experiencers like Rabbi Alon Anava, Christian Andreason, Howard Storm, Kevin Zadai, Dean Braxton and his wife who prayed for him so effectively, Colton Burpo and his dad who prayed with rather dangerous chutzpah while his son was dead...... and Dr. Eben Alexander and so many others..............  and I would suggest something of a wide eyed and open minded and childlike fascination with these people a bit like how Sid Roth is very respectful to his guests.... .and mostly asks them questions.

I believe that the harvest from something like that could be phenomenal..... yes.... it would be great for those near death experiencers who find a church home in the Latter day Saints church and it would be logical to interview many of them first....... or at least as well.......... but in comparison to most of us near death experiencers are almost glowing......

 

And whenever the children of Israel saw the face of Moses, that the skin of Moses' face shone, then Moses would put the veil on his face again, until he went in to speak with Him.
 

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35 minutes ago, Carborendum said:

No.

I have to admit.........  near death experiencers report that when they seem to have a meeting with the Holy Sprit they perceive Him as  a He!

Chapter seven of "The Torch and the Sword" by Rick Joyner though added an interesting angle to the idea of:

As one whom his mother comforts,
So I will comfort you;
And you shall be comforted in Jerusalem.”
but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all.

 

Chapter seven, entitled "The Queen," begins just after the 1:37:00 mark in this audio video:
 

 

Edited by DennisTate
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15 hours ago, DennisTate said:

I have to admit.........  near death experiencers report that ...

Dennis,

I have to wonder, are NDEs your "scriptural canon" upon which you base your faith?  If not, why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord? Why do you quote them so much?

If you do use them as part of your scriptural canon, then why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord?

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1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

Dennis,

I have to wonder, are NDEs your "scriptural canon" upon which you base your faith?  If not, why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord? Why do you quote them so much?

If you do use them as part of your scriptural canon, then why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord?

That is an excellent question and to a high degree my answer is YES!

As of today, April 22, 2020 I am of the belief that near death experience accounts are a very up to date fulfillment of this promise that I believe is being fulfilled more and more and more and more and more each day, each week and each month and each years in our time period.

 

These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father. (John 16:25)

Do I absolutely accept all near death experience accounts?

No....  Matthew chapter four reminds me of the near death experience account of Rabbi Alon Anava and many others but who did Messiah Yeshua - Jesus meet during this brush with death initiated to a degree by prolonged fasting?  The Tempter!

One of the criteria that I use to judge the value of near death experience accounts is IF... .THEY FIT WITH SCRIPTURES OR NOT..... secondly I consider the Life Review important because it appears to be part of a covenant between our Creator and all mankind.  

 

This is certainly interesting:

 

God’s Gender Identity Crisisby Michelle Wiener | Jul 25, 2018 | Church, Empowerment, eternal progression, faith crisis, Featured, Fellowship, Feminism, gender, God, Goddess, Heavenly Mother, Heavenly Mother, Mother in Heaven, Patriarchy, Theology | 2 comments

 

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1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

Dennis,

I have to wonder, are NDEs your "scriptural canon" upon which you base your faith?  If not, why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord? Why do you quote them so much?

If you do use them as part of your scriptural canon, then why do you lean so heavily upon these words of men, rather than the word of the Lord?

On the other hand......  it was really scripture itself that was my ultimate guide during these last thirty years of studying these accounts.

Near death experience accounts were used to get me rethinking my understanding of scriptures.  For example Pastor General of the Worldwide Church of God, Mr. Herbert W. Armstrong and his son Evangelist Garner Ted Armstrong taught a very dogmatic variation on the Soul Sleep doctrine that I soon began to see as probably in error..... once I read some of the near death experience account of Dr. George Ritchie.

Ultimately it was 2 Corinthians 12: 2-4 that was changing my mind..... even more so than the NDE account.

I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)

How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

 

https://www.near-death.com/experiences/exceptional/george-ritchie.html#a05c

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c. His Experience of the "Receiving Station"
 

Jesus then takes Ritchie to another realm and is shown a kind of "receiving station" where spirits would arrive in a deep hypnotic sleep because of a particular religious belief they held to be true. Here there were "angels" trying to arouse them and help them realize, "God is truly a God of the living and that they did not have to lie around sleeping until Gabriel or someone came along blowing on a horn." These are the spirits of people who believe they must sleep in their grave until the second coming of Christ (i.e., soul sleep.)

 

 

 

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24 minutes ago, DennisTate said:

That is an excellent question and to a high degree my answer is YES!

You had once stated that you were interested in being baptized as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  We do NOT hold NDEs to be scripture.  So, if you're not willing to plow your field and re-sow, you're not ready for the waters of baptism.

The Church is enlightened by more people who carry with them the Spirit of God into the Church.  Your intent from the beginning has been to bring with you all manner of false doctrine so that you may be driven with the wind and tossed.

STOP IT!

Humble yourself and learn from the Oracles of God.  Learn from actual scriptures rather than the privately interpreted house-of-cards that you've formed for yourself.  Those who have claimed NDEs are NOT PROPHETS!!! just because they claim an NDE. Stop treating them as such.

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On 4/22/2020 at 12:42 PM, Carborendum said:

You had once stated that you were interested in being baptized as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  We do NOT hold NDEs to be scripture.  So, if you're not willing to plow your field and re-sow, you're not ready for the waters of baptism.

The Church is enlightened by more people who carry with them the Spirit of God into the Church.  Your intent from the beginning has been to bring with you all manner of false doctrine so that you may be driven with the wind and tossed.

STOP IT!

Humble yourself and learn from the Oracles of God.  Learn from actual scriptures rather than the privately interpreted house-of-cards that you've formed for yourself.  Those who have claimed NDEs are NOT PROPHETS!!! just because they claim an NDE. Stop treating them as such.

Good points... but somebody of the calibre of Moses have to be careful when they make such statements......

"And Moses said unto him, Enviest thou for my sake? would God that all the LORD'S people were prophets, and that the LORD would put his spirit upon them!" (Numbers 11:29)

In the past the world was like this:

For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely.

But the future will be so different.....

And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more." (Jeremiah 31:34)

In one decade Dr. Eben Alexander's NDE account has helped a lot of people to begin to rise up out of their extreme skepticism and unbelief.  His account was translated into over thirty languages if I remember correctly.  

 

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