lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 John 3:16 states "For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that whoever should believe in him should not perish but have everlasting life" Begotten greek word means "one and only" He is one and only son is what the bible says. How do you reconcile this to mormon teaching that teaches that God had multiple children? Also why then would Mary not be in Heaven with God ruling with him? Since the bible states she is the mother of Jesus. This confused me in regards to what LDS teaches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Mormon Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 From what I remember, Jesus was the only begotten 'in the flesh'. We are all his spirit children, but Jesus was his only begotten in the flesh. Something like that. My memory isn't so good. Others will have better resources and memories. BTW - Welcome to the site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Thanks for the reply..but if you look at the scriptures it does not say in the flesh..only begotten son..so are you getting that from the book of mormon or some other source? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MobyMule Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 By your same reasoning you can't exclude it either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 The book of mormon was written by a man..so that is huge in understanding what lds does with this scripture verse. do they add to scripture through a man or some other way explain this verse? also in regards to mary..under lds teaching wouldn't she be in heaven? any insights would be great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MobyMule Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Look what is to understand. The scriptures(the Bible) do not specify flesh vs spirit. But they imply flesh. Look up the Hebrews verse on Isaac and Abraham. As for your questions about Mary why wouldn't she be in heaven? I don't understand where you are going with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 hmm..i'm not quite sure what the meaning of issac and ambraham have to do with my question but I will do that for sure. Other then when issac was born he was called issac because God made her laugh due to the fact she was in her old age. in regards to mary..My understand of lds teaching was that we have a celestial marriage we do good things we eventually make it the top of the kingdoms. we become a god, we populate planets etc...their are multiple gods and godesses..??? So then would Mary not be in heaven and had a sexual relationsip with God at one point to concieve Jesus who eventually as one our brothers came to this planet to redeem world or a part of the redemption plan? I am trying to summarize..So it baffled me in thinking okay Mary was on the earth when the angel came to her and said she would have a baby miracously without having sex with joseph through the holy spirit. Anybody have any insights on this for me? Thanks again to those that responded... just trying to understand better.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kona0197 Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Wow. Great questions. (And I thought I was good at poking holes in teachings...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Mormon Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Wow. Great questions. (And I thought I was good at poking holes in teachings...)Wow, I thought you respected Mormons or was that just lip service? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kona0197 Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Wow, I thought you respected Mormons or was that just lip service?Classic example of an antagonizing post. I don't think I will be drawn into another argument with you. Nice try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Hi you guys..just don't want my questions to turn into an argument of any kind. I have been diving into mormonism alot in the last 4 months mainly because I moved to a popular mormon area. So I understand how lds explains some scriptures but there are many I that I have not gotten a clear understanding on and I can't find it in a book or by ex mormons etc..so I thought hmm a lds forum maybe they can help me understand where they are coming from on these things..Please don't get upset by my questions..I am not attacking you as a person..but if anything shedding light on a doctrine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningStar Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Wow. Great questions. (And I thought I was good at poking holes in teachings...) What holes? From LDS.org:Jesus Christ is the Only Begotten Son of God the Father in the flesh. He was the Creator, He is our Savior, and He will be our Judge. Under the direction of our Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ created the earth. Through His suffering in the Garden of Gethsemane and by giving His life on the cross—that is, by performing the Atonement—Jesus Christ saves us from our sins as we follow Him. Through His Resurrection, Jesus Christ saves us from physical death. Because He overcame death, we will all be given the gift of resurrection. We are all God's children, but Jesus Christ is His only begotten son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kona0197 Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Lostnfound - Sorry brother. I'll refrain from going off topic. I hope you find the answers to your questions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningStar Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 hmm..i'm not quite sure what the meaning of issac and ambraham have to do with my question but I will do that for sure. Other then when issac was born he was called issac because God made her laugh due to the fact she was in her old age.in regards to mary..My understand of lds teaching was that we have a celestial marriage we do good things we eventually make it the top of the kingdoms. we become a god, we populate planets etc...their are multiple gods and godesses..??? So then would Mary not be in heaven and had a sexual relationsip with God at one point to concieve Jesus who eventually as one our brothers came to this planet to redeem world or a part of the redemption plan? I am tring to summarize..So it baffled me in thinking okay Mary was on the earth when the angel came to her and said she would have a baby miracously without having sex with joseph throught the holy spirit.Anybody have any insights on this for me? Thanks again to those that responded... just trying to understand better.:) Why would you assume Mary had relations with God at one point? Both the Bible and Book of Mormon state she was a virgin when Jesus was conceived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 that little exerpt from lds .org is not a complete picture of what lds teaches.. because lds does not teach you are saved by jesus christ alone. It is based on Works..what we do to earn salvation. Does anybody have any thoughts on my mary question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningStar Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Please don't tell us what we believe. We believe no one would be saved without Jesus Christ. Our works cannot get us to Heaven. Because of the Atonement, everyone will be resurrected except for the Sons of Perdition.Our works affect which Kingdom we will go to, but they don't give us salvation. Even the Bible says we will be judge by our works. For what purpose do you think this is?Rev. 20: 12-13 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their fworks. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 as far as mary have sexual relations with God..okay maybe not all mormons agree on their own doctrine then... devout mormons have explained it this..way as a i posted earlier.. we do good things here we get to celestial heaven the very top we evolve into a god we have mulitple children,, we eventually will own our own planet and populate the earth...etc..and the whole process repeats itself...lds teaching states God was once a man that was created into a God correct?? Then he and someone tell me who he was married to that allowed him to evolve into a God and eventually have all these children that would populate planet earth? I assumed that would be Mary? Becaise the bible says mary was jesus mother? So then why was she on the earth when she got pregnant and not in heaven. Does anybody understand my question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 p.s. morning star you are absoutly correct that works according to lds teaching determine your level of kingdom.. I will not argue with you on that one. This is not a me against you kind of thing at all..:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kona0197 Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 I do but I lack the knowledge to give you an answer. I know that Mormons do not discuss the heavenly Mother but say there is one.. After all that would make sense since we have a heavenly Father and family is everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 Really??!! That is facinating to me. Where is that in the lds doctrine? Is it on a website I can look up I wonder? If the lds teaches there is a heavenely mother which is what I too had always understood about lds then wouldn't that person be mary? by the way I am not catholic and I do not think mary is co-redeemer with God in heaven but in way shape or form..just a note to let you know my own stance on mary but her role in the bible is unique and God said all will call her blessed among woman..but I can't seem to get my head around how she fits in lds teaching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaidservantX Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 I encourage you to begin at the beginning, lostnfound . . . the beginning of knowledge. And in time, you will find out for yourself all you desire to know.My suggestion as to what the beginning is in this case and for these questions is to explore in depth the website Mormon.org (have you been there yet? I love it! and I think you will too. :)) and be willing to accept what you hear, if you feel you can. If you feel that you can't accept what you hear, then I think the questions that you are asking, although interesting in some sense, will make no difference otherwise.I hope you have a long and enjoyable time at lds.net. Thanks for participating and I look forward to many more contributions from you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenamarie Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 She was the Earthly mother of our Saviour. That's it. There is no LDS doctrine explaining the "how" of the Conception of Christ. I have never heard someone within the LDS church say that they believe Mary had sex with God. That is something I've only read on anti-Mormon websites that have been filled with all sorts of other misinformation about the church. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lostnfound Posted April 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 xhenli and jena... First xhenli I have been to mormon.org and many other lds sites to read to understand and even interview various mormons..as far as feeling like it is truth..well..the bible says the heart is desperately wicked..so I don't trust my feelings on things. I don't feel my way to understanding..but go the only source of truth.and Gods' word say you align everything against God's word which I have done and not just on mormons but various reglions of the world including christianity..(does that surprise you?) and you test the spirits for what is true. "the evidence demands a verdict" josh mcdowell. I highly reccomend it. (It's not a anti mormon book so you should be able to read it.) Too many people are following after reglions because it feels good. or by some emotional draw to it. Jena your post umm well...I know lds says there is a heavenly mother..and according to lds teaching God did not start off as always was..but rather evolved to get into that position...so that would bring up the question as to mary? Did God have multiple wives then according to lds? In that our brother(lds teaching) Jesus was the only one brought into the world through a earthly mother? Any thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MorningStar Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 You realize we believe in continuing revelation, right? :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jenamarie Posted April 21, 2008 Report Share Posted April 21, 2008 There is no doctrine as to how many wives Heavenly Father has. We know of a Heavenly Mother and that is it. Anything beyond that is merely speculation. And Mary was the mother of Christ's physical body. Jesus Christ was the only person ever born on this earth who could claim God as both the Father of his spirit, and the Father of his physical body. Mary was the mother of his physical form. There is no doctrine beyond that as to what Mary's roll was in Heavenly Father's plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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