martybess

Gwen, I do agree most who have negative comments about obesity have never had to deal with it but this says nothing about the millions who do have to deal with it. I just wanted to know why it's not talked about more by the church but now I know why.

I guess I should of did a search first to see this is a volatile subject indeed. Thanks for the point about it not being black and white. ..

You assume I'm not fat? I see this is something I will have to take one myself. Sorry if I have offended you.

I'm not so sure it was done in other worlds. Are we taking this at face value or are we to look at it symbolically somehow? Like a rib being taken from Adam to form woman for we know did not happen.

PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG PPL/ I'm wondering why the church doesn't take a stronger stand ON obesity. Is it not important in G-d's eyes that we take care of ourselves? Please don't get me wrong here, I'm just wondering because it seems contrary to the laws of health?? At what point do we cross the line? 300lbs? Can I feel I'm going to make it if I can't control my eating. Does it all boil down to how I feel about myself? ..

Child birth is the closet thing to what the Savior had to do in the garden in a way. It's willingly submitting oneself to the law of sacrifice (think of the temple) for in the worse case the woman could die during childbirth. It's corrupted and can be deadly as was the experience of the atonement for the Savior both indeed needed for HF work to progress.

Hemi great thread! The posts have helped my understanding of the garden and fall.

Another principle concerning ordinances is they can be seen and a doorway opening up to further light and knowledge. We know that there is an ordinance call the endowment. But there are suppose to be blessings and powers received by one because they have been endowed. Most of the time the term endowment in the scriptures is referring not to the ordinance of the endowment but what should be happening in our lives because the ordinance has been preformed. (D&C 38:32-33 & 38) 32 Wherefore, for this cause I gave unto you the commandment that ye should go to the Ohio; and there I will give unto you my law; and there you shall be endowed with power from on high; After the ordinance has been preformed we should receive power from on high. 33 And from thence, whosoever I will shall go forth among all nations, and it shall be told them what they shall do; for I have a great work laid up in store, for Israel shall be saved, and I will lead them whithersoever I will, and no power shall stay my hand.” 38” See that all things are preserved; and when men are endowed with power from on high and sent forth, all these things shall be gathered unto the bosom of the church.” (D&C 43:16)” And ye are to be taught from on high. Sanctify yourselves and ye shall be endowed with power, that ye may give even as I have spoken.” (D&C 105:11-12)” 11 And this cannot be brought to pass until mine elders are endowed with power from on high. 12 For behold, I have prepared a great endowment and blessing to be poured out upon them, inasmuch as they are faithful and continue in humility before me. History of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, vol. 2 “Remember, you are not to go to their nations till you receive your endowments. Tarry at Kirtland until you are endowed with power from on high. You need a fountain of wisdom, knowledge and intelligence such as you never had. Relative to the endowment, I make a remark or two, that there may be no mistake. The world cannot receive the things of God. He can endow you without worldly pomp or great parade. He can give you that wisdom, that intelligence, and that power, which characterized the ancient saints, and now characterizes the inhabitants of the upper world.” So according to the prophet Joseph Smith once you have received the endowment ordinance we should bring into our lives an endowment to what he referred to as a great power a fountain of wisdom, knowledge and intelligence that will be equivalent to those who are the ancient saints and also those who inhabit the upper world. The question might be asked is everybody that’s endowed receive such power, knowledge and intelligence. These things do not come automatically because an ordinance has been preformed. Anymore the Holy Ghost comes simply because you had hands laid on you head for the gift of the Holy Ghost. Notice the wording is receive the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is not being commanded to go to that person that person is being commanded to receive the Holy Ghost. So it is with the endowment. The endowment is a doorway opening up to greater light and knowledge and understanding. When Joseph Smith was teaching about the plan of salvation, where we came from, why were here and where we are going he explained “Knowledge of these things can only be obtained by experience through the ordinances of God set forth for that purpose.”(Teachings page 124) “I assure the Saints that truth, in reference to these matters, can and may be known through the revelations of God in the way of His ordinances, and in answer to prayer.” (Teachings page 125) So you see the ordinances are doorways that open up to those who are interested in the privilege of receiving greater light and knowledge from God. Because the priesthood has the power to administer those ordinances and has the keys of the mysteries of the kingdom of God. (D&C 84:19-20) 19 And this greater priesthood administereth the gospel and holdeth the key of the mysteries of the kingdom, even the key of the knowledge of God.” 20 Therefore, in the ordinances thereof, the power of godliness is manifest 21 And without the ordinances thereof, and the authority of the priesthood, the power of godliness is not manifest unto men in the flesh; Notice how both male and female are equal under the priesthood. Notice the important thing as indicated here is not holding the priesthood but having the power of godliness which is manifest in the ordinances. That’s very critical. I think we learn through the ordinances the power of the atonement then as the power make us like our Father in Heaven. Latter Day Saints are very clear in their doctrine, that we become like God. And it’s be way of the ordinances that we progress to that point. So male and female are absolutely equal under the priesthood. Notice I hold the priesthood but I cannot give myself one blessing. If I want a blessing guess what, I have to go to somebody else who has the priesthood to give it to me. If I want any ordinance preformed upon myself I cannot perform any ordinance upon myself I have to go to somebody else who holds the priesthood. Therefore Heavenly Father has made his sons and his daughters equal under the priesthood and equal access to the power of Godliness which is thru the ordinances because it’s the ordinances which the power of godliness is manifest to men in the flesh. Very important that we understand. Truly the D&C does reveals the priesthood. By way of these ordinances we begin to secure things unto ourselves. What happens as these ordinances are preformed and as we are true and faithful to the covenants that we make as we receive these ordinances? Let’s see what is really happening to us as we are progressing through the ordinances receiving line upon line and as we are receiving light, knowledge and understanding concerning the power of godliness. Lets go to the D&C section 132. Verse 6, notice the ordinances are entree or initiation into the new and everlasting covenant. “And as pertaining to the new and everlasting covenant, it was instituted for the fulness of my glory; and he that receiveth a fulness thereof must and shall abide the law, or he shall be damned, saith the Lord God.” Notice were having something given to us, it’s referred to here as “the fullness of Gods glory”. What does that make in the end? Well again the D&C is very clear. (my thought.... by abiding the laws given in the ordinaces one recievces power, the power of Godliness). Let’s go to verse 20 to find out what happens to a person who receives the fullness of all of these blessings. “20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.” No wonder satin in the apostasy changed the ordinances. Fouled up the order or the sequence of events that one must go through to become his Father in Heaven. The ordinances put our route back to the presence of God in order and in proper sequence with the powers and the rights and the keys so we can obtain our full end which is to become like our Father in Heaven. What a powerful revelation. What more could we ask for as children of a God. Then to become what he is. And to be instructed by the power of the priesthood as it is a channel bringing to us the information on how to progress to that point. ..

I think it helps understand the ceremony better. We must remember that (all) ordinances that G_d has given us have role playing evolved. Encyclopedia of Mormonism: “The word "ordinance" is derived from the Latin ordinare, which means to put in order or sequence; or to act" What is an ordinance? An ordinance is a mini drama of a portion of the plan of salvation. Baptism. Is it not a mini drama? According to the Savior to Nickademus are we not re-enacting our birth coming forth from our mothers whom. According to the Apostle Paul in the book of Romans chapter 6 verse one thru six are we not also at the same moment re-enacting our death, burial and resurrection in the likeness of Jesus Christ. It truly is a mini drama. Partaking of the Sacrament is it not a mini drama of part of the plan of salvation. We are taking of his flesh symbolically and of his blood symbolically and symbolically bring inside of ourselves so that he becomes part with us. So every ordinance is a mini drama. Notice what is does. The ordinances have a tendency to set in order the plan of salvation. Especially the temple drama. Notice it orders the plan of salvation from before the creation thru exaltation. It sets everything in order. The same is true with the endowment. ..

I really think this is a valid point. I'm sooooo glad I was the one to take my wife by the right hand and into the celestial room!!! You will be glad you waited even if it's 10 years from now. Baptisms are awesome!! They qualify us for the celestial kingdom. Especially since your doing family!!! KUDOS to you!!! Those who you have brought into the gospel will have many kisses for you when you meet. How awesome will that be!....... Wait.

Hemi what about these scriptures?? Moro. 6: 5-6 5 And the church did meet together oft, to fast and to pray, and to speak one with another concerning the welfare of their souls. 6 And they did meet together oft to partake of bread and wine, in remembrance of the Lord Jesus. 4 Ne. 1: 12 12 And they did not walk any more after the performances and ordinances of the law of Moses; but they did walk after the commandments which they had received from their Lord and their God, continuing in fasting and prayer, and in meeting together oft both to pray and to hear the word of the Lord. ....

LOL, probably shouldn't of been started.

I have wished many times it was like this normally!, openly talking about struggles like this in HP group meetings. So many there could help as well as it helping the one with the struggles. Why can we not be like this???? I think this must of be a special gift or something like that????? Know who needs a friend, and say something like "glad to see you sister how is your cat doing" or whatever is one of their interests. The person trying to repent for serious things and especially those we notice who seems alone, no one talks to them and they just slip in and go home. Are we going to church to be with our buddies and blaa blaa the meeting away??? Why are we going??? Is the only reason to be spiritually uplifted as the stk pres counselor said?? Does it not say to strengthen each other??? ..

No, no..... please don't take it that way. As has been stated by MarginOfError this really has no bearing on the real issues of life. Just thinking out loud which gets me in trouble most of the time. Priesthood leaders are guided and know what to do. ..

If you lost your bookmark here you go. :) Book of Mormon

Ahhhhhh I see the spirit is working on you. No worries though, do you know how to find the missionaries or are you hesitant too? ..

Nemo, Stay away from ppl who attack! That should be a huge red flag. Was not Christ attacked? Is not Christianity under attack? Find the missionaries, we can help you with this if you don't know where to begin. Like has been said, to know us and our beliefs talk to us not attackers. The gospel is really basic, much of what you might read here is just us blaabing about thoughts. Dont let it confuse you, if you have a question please ask. Seek and pray and you will feel it. I think you already have. Did you not feel a burst of energy and excitement when you came back and read the responses? In your post you seem excited that you came here and asked, I ask why? Because the spirit is leading you down the right direction. That's one way the spirit helps us. Did you feel that excitement in the other forums when they attacked? I think not. Nemo may you be blessed to have courage, strength and peace to help you. Please come back. Here's a great site for you. You can chat with the missionaries here. :) Mormon.org - Home ...

Reading a talk is not a bad thing I don't think if it's a well prepared spiritual talk. Do not the GA read their talks in general conference? I have often thought about this subject and wonder what it is that makes for a spiritual talk. With that said i do remember hearing GA's in conference as a teen and thinking this is the most boring thing I have ever heard only to read it years later and saying that's one of the best talks I've read! Was I not spiritual as a teen? Well honestly I had way more spiritual manifestation then so what gives here? Are all the talks that seem nonspiritual really that way to everyone? Do we all need to be good speakers for it to be a good talk? I have heard some really, really GOOD speakers give nonspiritual talks plenty. Are all talks meant for me, really are they... all of them? HMMMMMMMMM ..

For what it's work here's my rant, of course I may be way off base. Auxiliary programs are the brunches of the tree and if one spends to much time on the branches and it's fruits and not on strengthening the roots the fruits will die and thus poor attendance. To many ward focus way to much time on the brunches, all the programs and making sure they are running top notch and fail to see what is happening to the roots. To have a strong tree and good fruit you must start with the roots. How much time do we spend at making sure were doing a fantastic job in our calling? Hours a day? And how much time to we spend studying the scriptures, fasting, praying, going to the temple etc. a day? I would venture to say the time spent on our calling as den leader lets say far surpasses time spent on the roots. That's the problem, am I guilty yes. President Spencer W. Kimball noted in general conference on Sept. 30, 1978: "There are far too few who are willing to pay the price, in discipline and hard work, to cultivate hardy roots. . . . Let us each cultivate deep roots so that we may secure the desired fruits of our . . . labors."

I think even if you have your sealing annulled your children are still sealed to both parents.

Out stake president loves to get down into the trenches with the rest of us. He is great at showing how to find the lost and how to show love. I live a a huge stake in Utah.... our stake president has been to my house looking for lost sheep, my son. He has done this to hundreds of ppl in the stake. He goes out with a bishop to visit ward members every wed night. He know us all! This is the way to teach wards how to increase sac attendance. He is an awesome man! ..

Sorry for dragging this out ppl maybe I'm being impossible here but is this the scripture your referring too? (D&C 107) 10 High priests after the order of the Melchizedek Priesthood have a bright to officiate in their own standing, under the direction of the presidency, in administering spiritual things, and also in the office of an elder, priest (of the Levitical order), teacher, deacon, and member. 11 An elder has a right to officiate in his stead when the high priest is not present. Is "when the high priest is not present" what your referring too when you say the scriptures are clear? ..

Our stake president told me this week it's the HP but then I was talking with a bishop at work about it and he said his stake president told him it's the EQ. Personally I think it's the HPGL. Just because he does not hold keys (keys must be defined here) does not disqualify him, he is a high priest. The bishop's counselor does not hold keys either but acts under the direction of the bishop's keys and is commissioned, set apart to even give temple recommend interviews. I have been EQ pres twice and HPGL once and the same person (Stake President) laid his hands on my head and set me apart. Yes as EQ pres and held keys but the word keys here needs to be defined and does not apply here. His key's are important to the qrm he's over but those key's are not over the rest of the congregation during sacrament meeting. I also think it's a good idea to know these procedures Justice....those who have been put into this situation can appreciate being prepared! :) ..

I think ppl think this is policy but I now think due to this thread that it's really up to whoever the bishop/stk pres assigns. And the reason it's good to have 2 up there is help correct errors if any. (The Sac prayers and ward business). ..

great idea!!!